SUBSIM Radio Room Forums - US warns of Snowden consequences

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Brilliant speech!

The eagle has a right wing and an ultra-right wing. Therefore it flys a bit strange.

Maybe this is a good to test a drone on an American who has leaked information and currently on foreign soil.

Sure, attack any suspect and if it wasn't Snowden, declare the victims sympathizers and supporters who deserve in anyway.

Standard procedure of a constitutional democracy. Suspicion is justification enough to die. Legal trials and the chance to defend yourself are just a waste of money and time.

Hit them hard and let God sort them. This is the human rights the kids in uniform fight, kill and die for.

Putin has confirmed Snowden is in the transit area of the airport and is accompanied by legal advisers from the website Wikileaks:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-23053915

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ducimus (Post 2075693)

Personally, I draw a distinction between Snowden and Mannings.

I didn't mention Mannings. Didn't know who he was until you brought him up. That said, now that I do know I see that it's a good comparison. :sunny:

Does this lend some ironic similarity to the saying...
"That which you hate the most you become" ?

The USA used to be the provider of asylum. Not a place to seek asylum from.
Why no. They're not stomping on anyone's freedom. Much.

Here's some steak for your black eye Mister President.:arrgh!:
Reindeer games can get a bit brutal.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve (Post 2075783)

I didn't mention Mannings. Didn't know who he was until you brought him up. That said, now that I do know I see that it's a good comparison. :sunny:

I know you didn't. However when you said, "Did Snowden reveal secrets that could get our own people killed? If so, then he deserves prosecution", the first thing that came to my mind, was Mannings, and once that thought crept into my head, i couldn't help but make a comparison.

Why b*tch? America and the UK, Europe and the world population has gotten what it deserves.
each and every yank crying outrage gets what he/she deserves...
as it was for a thousand years.

It could be argued that what comes round goes around but I don't think this issue is anywhere finished yet :hmmm:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ducimus (Post 2075850)

Ah. Sometimes I'm so easily cornfused. :doh:

Maybe I misunderstood something, but I thought that there was a huge different between Manning and Snowden.

Markus

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimbuna (Post 2075870)

It could be argued that what comes round goes around but I don't think this issue is anywhere finished yet :hmmm:

No doubt about that. This will drag on far longer than the Assange/Manning saga.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mapuc (Post 2075900)

Maybe I misunderstood something, but I thought that there was a huge different between Manning and Snowden.

As Ducimus showed, there is a huge difference. I was merely questioning how and why Mannings came into the conversation in the first place. He explained that nicely.

The interesting question is: when the defence against terrorism and hostile powers is legitimate, when is the cost for such defence becoming too much? How much freedom is acceptable to be destroyed in the name of counter-terrorism monitoring of everybody, American/British and non-American/British alike? And what does it tell about the state of a society that claims to be "free" if no longer every<body is seen as innocent as long as his guilt is not proven, but is considered potentially guilty as long as not proven innocent?

But such moral questions are only luxury items. The real issue is that this apparatus that got secretly established could get so very perfectly abused by the ruling elites to control and suppress their own people, to manipulate their personal fates and lives, to tackle them if one sees fit - with them not even knowing that they get tackled.

These genies are out of the bottle. The elites will not give up on their new supertools. And since they are in bed with private business, the commercial use and abuse of all this date as well as the abuse of this data by state offices must be taken as inevitable. Laws will not change that, since paper is patient and ink dries fast.

I think these things would have come anyway, even without global terrorism. Terrorism only delivered a free excuse for it, and created the opportunity to speed the process up.

If our leaders and elites would be trustworthy and noble and good and all that, if only they were like that... But they aren't. they will not be. They cannot become that. It is against their explicit interest to be like that.

Even with this Snowden revelation that the NSA can and has been tracking foreign and American citizens emails, phone calls, etc to the tune of millions of hits per day ... surely they only have time for the wicked, the spys, the terrorist, the bad guys.

This is still the best country in the world and one of the sure ways to prove it is to slip in a little by law into the immigration bill now being formed in Congress that allows the NSA to do exactly what they are doing now (whatever that is).

When they swear them in just add the fact that can be monitored for life.

They don't care if you check them out ... all they want is a job and a meal and a warm place to sleep so they can send a good ole USA postal office money order home to feed their children.

I know for a fact that they have been checking me out for years ... all it does is make me a more honest person :yep: