as far as im concerned, Civil unions should be allowed to homosexuals, and under these they should be allowed every right that a married couple is allowed under law. to do otherwise is against the laws that that nation was founded on.

and I applaud that firm for not representing a law that is clearly discriminatory and in violation of the constitution

Go for it,:yep:

Do you really think divorce lawyers would allow that...:D

If the government isn't in the business of marriage, then who sets the marriage laws for property rights, parental rights, etc...Family law is a big business and the legal status of marriage is it's foundation. No legal marriage, no family law.?:06: Do we just let each decide his own marriage and leave it up to divorced couples to work it out on their own....

Guess we could let each church make it's own rules, but who decides legal recourse...Pastors...

Sorry, even I trust government more than the church on these matters. Just a fact, anything people can fight about needs legal laws and marriage is where most fighting takes place.

Marriage is just a religious blessing on a Civil Union. The Civil Union covers all those things without bringing religion into it.

It's like using the term "Birth certificate" instead of "Baptism certificate".

Does the law make a difference between "marriage" and "civil union"? Even if it's just the name, if there's a difference there's no reason we should deny it to gays.

Why are you so much against gay marriage August?

Birth certificate
 

The first legal gay marriage is now certified, January 14, 2001: signed, sealed, delivered.

http://i.imgur.com/3IcCz.jpg

Why do you ask?

Just curiosity. Why don't you want to tell?

Anyway, answer the question: does your law make any differences between the words "marriage" and "civil union"? Even if it's just the word.
If, according to your laws, "marriage" is just another word for "civil union", then why do you oppose gay marriage if it's exactly the same as a civil union?
If it's something else, why do you deny gays the rights heterosexuals have?

I never said I didn't want to tell. I just hesitate cooperating with antagonists who are hoping that i'll give them enough rope to hang me with.

In any case i'm dreadfully sorry to disappoint you but I do not oppose Civil Union for gays at all. I oppose government sponsored Marriage regardless of the happy couples sexual orientation. To me they're different things.

If it's, as you said, just a name then I guess you'd have no problem with renaming the Birth Certificate to the "Certification of Gods Latest Miracle" right?

This article refers to the U.S. but could equally well apply and other Western countries at any time ... in principle

It's just that if you answer "I'm against gays because my god tells me to" or "because it's counter-natural" or some other subjective crap answer like that, there's no need to continue this discussion.

I already got that from your previous posts, don't worry.

Yes, they are. Which is exactly the reason why IMO it's against gay rights to deny them marriage.

Except for that a birth certificate has about as much to do with the christian god as a marriage. Marriage is something cultural, not something religious. Muslims get married. Hindus get married. Even atheists get married. Marriage existed long before christianism.

Once again, I'm don't support religious gay marriages, unless their religion supports it. I only support gay marriages in the legal and cultural sense of the word.

Darkfish:

Gays have the same marriage rights as anyone else. They are free to marry a person of the opposite sex. That is what marriage means: A formal union between man and woman required and blessed by the church.

It seems to me that it's more important to you that gays be allowed to use the word Marriage to describe their Civil Union than it is to actually have the right to form that union. So that just means that this is not about equal rights but rather just another opportunity to stick it to organized religion.

They don't have the right to marry the person they love.

Erm, no. I just explained the church has nothing to do with it.

well, you're wrong.

As I just said, religion has nothing at all to do with marriage. You're the one that brings religion into the discussion, and then you're accusing me of sticking it to organized religion?

Yes, I think that's exactly what they want. It's the word. Marriage has a certain cultural and symbolical meaning. I don't know how it works in the US but here you can marry at city hall. It has nothing to do with religion, but you are married nonetheless. It's exactly this symbolical and cultural meaning that the gays feel entitled to I think.