You're right. And that is why I would not select the German naval model.

I picked it on the idea that I am not constrained by the same economical problems that germany had in WWII.

Germany had a fearsome set of ships, but her admirals (and Hitler) were so afraid to use them (rightly so, because they didn't really have the ability to make more,) that they never left port, and got bombed there, or when they did leave port they got swiftly outnumbered and destroyed by the allies.

So I picked germany because, in my little country, I would have had enough metal for 6 Bismarck-class, a handful of Hippers (cute little rhyme innit?) and enough destroyers and auxillaries to guard them all.

I'm sure somebody will come along and blow huge holes in my ideas.
I will have my grain of salt ready.

Hmm, Task Force Land.

Infantry: German, with all the cool 44 weaponry.
Armor good mix of German and Soviet tanks.
Air:A mix of German aircraft and Soviet numbers.
Navy: British
Logistics:Soviet
Artillery: Soviet
Command German

Soviets had logistics ? The same guys who issued 5 bullets to each soldier but only 1/4 of them got rifles. Then when an armed guy fell an unarmed soldier picked the dead guys rifle, loaded in his 5 bullets and continued to fight until he fell.

THESE soviets ?

Thats messed up.

I'd play, but I see no division between logistics and production, R&D, or intel.

This seems kind of silly...but it also sounds like fun. I'll play:up:

Country- Pwnia
Infantry- German Waffen SS. I know, they were bad guys, but man for man they were damned good fighters!
Armor- German (post-1941. I know the Russians had more serviceable and more effective tanks, but I cannot endorse their crew training model. They just threw men away)

Air Force- Russian. An odd choice, I know, but the Russians developed a close air-support model based on the German model in relatively short order and then actually had the resources to employ it effectively. The US and the British did nothing of the sort. They just threw men and machines at the war until the Axis was literally without means to oppose them, and even then they didn't have any success accomplishing their stated objectives. Worse, the Western Allies engaged in massive and ineffective terror-bombings of civilians. Not in my damn airforce!

Navy- I'll take the US Navy. For all their considerable power and subsequent attempts to check the U-boat threat, the Royal Navy was precisely garbage until the US showed up. All they managed to do was to lose every surface naval engagement and fail to adequately address the U-boat threat on their own, in like, multiple ways.

Actually, now that I think about it, screw the US Navy. The only people who had any idea of how to use a Navy with the goal of "force projection" were the Japanese. They were proactive rather than reactive. Were it not for the incredible stroke of luck we had at Midway, they would have beat our asses black and blue before they succumbed to our material superiority. I want US material superiority combined with Japanese naval tactics.

Artillery - German

German artillery targeting and employment was so frakking good that the US uses it as a model for combined-force operations to this day, and it serves very well.

Command Model - German again. The German model of command is so good that their methods are embraced by the world's only remaining superpower. In fact, we go a step beyond that and have adopted German unit tactics, camoflauge, and even helmets.

Logistics- I'd go with the US, though Russians are a close second. There's nothing quite like mindlessly throwing vastly superior resources at the enemy until they give up because they no longer have the means to resist. It's not a good or effective strategy, but it does work. Actually, I take that back. I'd use the British model of logistics. There is nothing quite like throwing someone else's vastly superior resources at the enemy until they no longer have the means to resist.

So I guess what I really want is allied material superiority and axis troops. Can I do that?

The same Soviets whose war effort is so often substituted for by myths, yes. While it is indeed true that many Soviet units in 1941 and early 1942 were very poorly equipped (Because they were hastily raised, and because the rapid German advance captured many of their weapons and transportation capability), this situation, as far as I know, was never one that was horrible to the extent that you make it and was rectified very quickly.

In fact, I'd have chosen Soviet logistics, especially when one considers they have been able to supply vast offensives over long distances at the same time the Western Allies struggled to advance over much better infrastructure and shorter distances on the Western Front. The fact that Soviet sea supply ability was lacking (Because they didn't really need any) and that Soviet ability to supply their forces came partly because of lend-lease US equipment led me to choose the US/Western Allies instead, though.

Well, yes, the Soviets did have logistics. Getting such sheer masses of men, guns, armor, and artillery to the front count as logistics. I don't like the idea any more than you do, in fact I find it rather repulsive, but the Soviets did do the majority of the fighting and they did win the war pretty much by themselves. I'm not sure I could be persuaded to fight by the Soviets. I'd probably have taken arms against them, but then I'm not a Soviet.

Yep. THOSE Soviets.

Tell me about it.

I think you're confusing material superiority with the aforementioned concepts, but I might be wrong. Please elaborate.

Nation: Giggity Republic of Hotchacha

(Airborne) Infantry-Damian Lewis as Major Dick Winters
Armor-Erwin Rommel as himself
Air Force-some cute guy with an accent in a Spitfire
Navy-Jürgen Prochnow as der Alte
Artillery-whoever has the biggest gun
Command Model-I vill be giffink ze kommants, ja?
Logistics-we'll start with a game of nekkid Twister and go from there

:hmmm:

It's entirely possible that I've missed the whole point of this exercise. :shifty: :O:

:hmmm:lets see

Infantry: Germany
Best troops, best weapons,

Armour: Germany
Great tanks, short on mechanical reliability though

Air: US
american planes are of great quality, thats for sure
Japanese pilots often used up all their ammo and still fail to destroy a F6F

Navy: Japan
The best battleships, and the best carriers

Morale: Japan
Most determined troops in the war

Propaganda: Germany
So successful that there is a Goebbels' mass media in China

Troop numbers: Soviet & US
Well the soviet union was able to field the most troops, of course US numbers for the navy

Logistics:US
Well the US was able to supply many allied countries with equipment and supplies

Secret weapons:
this is a tough one:hmmm:
Germany had rockets, Japan had bio weapons, Italy had the human torpedo
but still, America had NUKES

BBs are powerful weapons, but air power rules the seas. Look what happened to Yamato, and she was one big, mean mofo.

Infantry - Gurkha

Air Force - Luftwaffe

Attitude - Ireland.


There's a what? What's on? A WAR?! I'm not dressed!


Pfft, one track mind. :O:

Still, japan planned 6 Yamatos
6 yamatos vs 6 bismarks I'd bet on the yamatos

I presume its not SH4, so one sub can't take out 10 battleships

Oh you mean how she took about 30 bombs and 20 torpedoes before sinking? :03:

If the US didn't have air superiority and only some of those attack planes made it to their target things could have been different.

A Battleship-Carrier force properly used can be a lot more dangerous than a carrier only force.

The only reason the soviets had any logistics at all is due to lend lease.
We sent them so many trucks that they went from an immobile army on defensive's 1941-1943 to a very German styled mobile army 1944-45.

Lend lease did save the Soviet Union despite all the Russia won da war by dem selves sayers.

Here is where Lend lease proved most effective, Trucks, Rubber and fuel, not tanks, planes and guns.

They had the manpower always did but Germany still walked all over them because they lacked mobility, We gave them that mobility and they quickly turned the tables although getting black eyes all the way to Berlin.

And also for your close air support argument, While not quite a Sturmovik the P-47's and the Typhoons and Tempests were still just about as effective with the added advantage that they were no longer bomb trucks when the payload was dropped but competitive fighters!

I'm with August since you're talking organizational structure, not just equipment. That means if you pick German armor, you get their logistical train, too. No picking and choosing. Ditto german infantry—crappy logistics.

US tanks were not as good, but they were easy for us to keep running (the fact that most americans were familiar with their own cars or farm vehicles didn't hurt—US car ownership was grossly higher than anywhere else on earth, so the lads all knew about keeping their jalopies running).