So, swastikas in any form in games are forbidden in Germany, like the blue swastika finnish air force used during WWII and which had nothing to do with nazis?

yes i am in Germany

i have the Collector's Edition

and that Ubisoft just deactivate all german copies of SH5 is abosluty not true and big nonsens !

i have the game from amazon and received this letter....

this letter say that you can give back the game if you like it...and then you received a Coupon therfore....

thats all....

maybe you can read/translate the letter....



Lieber Amazon Kunde,

Amazon hat eine wichtige Nachricht zu einem von Ihnen bestellten Produkt:

Sie haben bei uns das Spiel 'Silent Hunter 5 - Collector's Edition' (ASIN xxxxxx) gekauft (Bestellnummer siehe Betreff).

Dazu hat uns der Hersteller des Artikels 'Silent Hunter 5 - Collector's Edition' (ASIN xxxxxxx) folgendes mitgeteilt:

Es kam bei diesem Titel zu einem Produktionsfehler. Aufgrund dieses Fehlers enthält die ausgelieferte Version verfassungsfeindliche Symbole, die in Deutschland nicht verbreitet werden dürfen. Wir bedauern diese Unannehmlichkeit außerordentlich und bieten Ihnen an, Ihr Exemplar gegen Gutschrift an uns zurück zu senden. Leider können wir Ihnen keinen Austausch anbieten, da der Artikel aktuell nicht mehr produziert wird. Wenn der Artikel ein Geschenk war, bitten wir Sie, den Beschenkten darüber zu informieren.

Sobald Ihre Rücksendung bei uns eingebucht ist, senden wir Ihnen eine E-Mail, in der wir Ihnen die Gutschrift über den Warenwert und das Rückporto bestätigen.

Für die entstandene Unannehmlichkeit möchten wir uns außerdem mit einem Gutschein von Amazon in Höhe von 5 € entschuldigen, den Sie bis 31.12.2010 einlösen können. Sie finden den Gutschein weiter unten in dieser E-Mail.

Bitte benutzen Sie unser Online-Rücksendezentrum:

http://www.amazon.de/ruecksendezentrum

Dort leiten wir Sie Schritt für Schritt durch den Rückgabeprozess. Sie finden im Online-Rücksendezentrum auch eine ausdruckbare Rücksendungsübersicht, die Sie bitte Ihrer Sendung beilegen.

************************************************** *****************

Und hier ist Ihr Gutscheincode:
Einlösungscode: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
(Für die Bestellung erforderlich!)

Betrag pro Gutschein: EUR 5,00
gültig bis: 31.12.2010
Produktgruppen: Software und Videogames
NICHT gültig für Bestellungen bei Amazon.de Marketplace!

************************************************** *****************

(Dies ist eine automatisch versendete E-Mail. Bitte antworten Sie nicht auf dieses Schreiben, da die E-Mail-Adresse nur zum Versenden, nicht aber zum Empfang von E-Mails eingerichtet ist.)

Freundliche Grüße

Kundenservice Amazon.de

Translation:

Dear Amazon Customer,

Amazon has an important message for you regarding one of our products you ordered: You have purchased from us the game 'Silent Hunter 5 - Collector's Edition' (see invoice for order number).
Regarding this, the manufacturer of the item 'Silent Hunter 5 - Collector's Edition' has provided the following information:
This title has suffered a production error. Because of this error, the delivered version contains unconstitutional symbols which may not be distributed in Germany.
We regret this inconvenience severely, and offer you the option of returning your copy in return for a balance in your favor. Unfortunately, we cannot offer you a replacement, as the item is no longer being produced. If the item was a present, we ask that you inform the giver of this.
As soon as we have registered your return of the item, we will send you an e-mail in which we will state the amount of balance in your favor, amounting to the value of the item plus shipping costs incurred.
In return for this inconvenience, we present you with an additional voucher with a value of 5 Euro, which will be valid until 12/31/2010. You will find your voucher further below in this mail.

Please use the online returns center:
http://www.amazon.de/ruecksendezentrum

There, we'll lead you step by step through the return process. In the online returns center, you will also find a printable overview of your return to help you keep track of your return.

***********

And here is your voucher:
Redeem code: xxxxxxxxxxxxx
(used during ordering)

Value of voucher: 5 Euro.
Valid until 12/31/2010
Product group: Software and videogames.
NOT valid for orders on the Amazon.de marketplace.

***********

(This E-Mail was automatically sent. Please do not reply to this message, as the E-Mail address is only used for sending, not for reception of E-Mail.)

Friendly Greetings

Customer service Amazon.de

More or less :)

Yet another example of UbiSoft's brilliant planning::yeah:

First they screw up the game itself :06:

Then they irritate their most loyal repeat-purchase demographic :damn:

Then they screw up the server support :o

Now they run afoul of German law about swastikas. You'd think that was something with which Europeans would be intimately familiar. :down:


These are career-ending mistakes at most businesses. :up:

Unconstitutional symbols...:har:

Yea I know its a translation but it just struck me as being funny.

welcome to the dictarship of new DRM, yo pay the money but you only play when ubi wants

i think that it have another danger, if ubi don´t want give more support to the game, like servers and patches for a not very popular niche game, deciding shutting down without non DRM patch

whit this also ubi saves a lot of bandwidth in DRM serves just in a time of problems with connections.

This is beyond lame
 

Ok, I understand the stance to not promote this blot on Germany's history. But this is just lame.

Historically these symbols flew EVERYWHERE!!

Does Japan hide from their symbol of the rising sun in their games dealing with WWII? The same Japan that has a past of being VERY brutal, and killing many thousands if not millions of innocents in horrible and vicious ways. No, they just seemed to have learned to fight by putting down their swords, and picking up their briefcases.

How about America and the slavery supporting Rebel flag in Civil war games? That symbol is still around, and models of Rebel vessels have that flag as part of the kit. Yes there are those idiots that say " The south shall rise again", but so what? If I have a model of the HN Hunley, I WANT THAT FLAG ON IT'S MAST!! Not an orange flag with no other details.

Under the Union Jack, MANY atrocities took place the effects of which several countries are still feeling the effects of. Yet that flag flies proudly.

Germany, accept that your country like all countries has a history of pure evil in your past. Stop hiding. Just never ever, ever, let a scum ball like Hitler and the Nazis at the helm of your great country.

Realize that intolerance in most of its forms are evil, and do nothing for human kind.

Negating the symbol in historical games is not a way of doing this!!!

Before people say, "well the Nazis were responsible for millions of innocent deaths" Let's not forget Stalin is recorded to have killed MORE of his own people, under the Red Star. Is that symbol along with the Hammer and Sickle negated in Games in Russia? I don't believe so.

German government seems to be paying attention to the symptom rather than the problem. IMO.

Swastikas are not even an invention of the nazis. It's probably some stupid law that was imposed by the post war american protectorate and that has endured up to this time.

Here in Italy, it's against the law to promote fascism but the symbols were not removed because they do have their place in history. Besides, it would be pretty stupid because fascists just reused a lot of classic symbols which are everywhere; even the so called "roman salute" was a common way in the past to hail someone and in a less strict form it survived up to these days.

Speaking about symbols of fascism, you can even visit freely Benito Mussolini tomb: it's guarded 24/7 by volunteers in high uniform (most of them are former army members).

And I notice, except for a special few historians, people completely ignore stalins atrocities on his own people, and focus solely on the camps in Germany...

Heck, you'd get a pat on the back for wearing a murderer like Che on a t-shirt, right?

Even I think this is silly, and I won't even play a u-boat in a game cause it makes me feel creepy, lol.

Yes, it does sound rather peculiar :)
However, the german wording is "verfassungsfeindliche Symbole", and "verfassung" = constitution, and "feindlich" = hostile. I suppose it's really "Symbols hostile to the constitution", then, but "unconstitutional" seemed the nearest useful approximation thereof ;)

To be fair, the allies specifically shoehorned the banning of nazi symbology into the post war german constitution, so it's not really a decision of Germany itself to have it this way.

Does this mean that you must return the game, or is it a request? Because if it is a request, I would ignore it. It's not as if the political enforcement agency are going to come and dig through your games, checking for illegal iconography, right?

:o
Sadly, we cannot offer to exchange to a new copy for you, since this product currently is no longer produced.
:hmmm:

Now that was an interesting part of that Amazon mail. It shall be interesting to see the next news about this... http://www.silenthuntermods.com/foru...ended/popc.gif

That could happen in combination with predating, more serious investigations against you, for example if you are under surveillance due to a suspicion of being a distributor of Nazi stuff, or the Office for the Protection of the Constitution (a national intelligence service) has listed you as a member of a Nazi organisation. It could also happen if you get raided by police over suspicion of pirating software, and then they check your collection. I cannot imagine that ressources get unlocked to raid your home for just the purpose of searching swastikas in games. Police hardly can be assumed to have these ressources free these days - they are short on personnell and money.

Theoretically, possessing the version that features the "unconstitutional symbol" is illegal in Germany and could lead you to getting sued. The legal basis is like that indeed. Downloading and possessing a swastika mod for IL-2 for example also could get you into trouble.

that is, if the law enforcement authorities would learn that you own such an illegal thing.then they have an obligation to examine.

Maybe it is clever then not to tell them, or anyone else.

Which leaves the interesting question what the legal grounds of German Amazon is if they know you have not returned your copy. Obviously they know that you ordered it, and if you do not return it, you still owe it.

Maybe they agree to not use their sensitive information against you if you agree to pay them a monthly fee. :D

However, nowadays that your internet data is stored everywhere for eons to come, it certainly is a clever idea if you are German or austrian not to boast in forums with your downloaded Swastika patch, and your collection inclduing titles featuring these unconstiotutional symbols. The circumstance itself in principal can be legally used against you.

I personally think people on both sides of the law make too much tam-tam about Nazi swastikas being shown in games. It is an unimportant visual feature that neither increases realism and functionality, nor immersion. It simply is not important for the game. and people having suffered under the rule of the swastika, are still living. One must not confront them with the easyminded use of these symbols again.

It's a question of piety - not historic accuratesse. And a game like the SH or IL series has no educational value about the why and how of WW2, so whether swastikas are shown or not adds nothing to the realism at all. You could as well demand to have only recordings of original death cries in game, for reasons of "realism". I think that realism debate over critical symbols in a game almost always is an excuse often made in the same way like a man claims he only buys the Playboy or Penthouse magazine because of the good journalistic quality of the articles in it.


"Verfassungsfeindliche Symbole" means symbols standing for ideas and content that are hostile to the German constitutional order.