Okay, I re-read the whole article (I have nothing better to do tonight:roll: ) and I'm still pissed off. And here's why:

"
The plan to require proper sorting of refuse would be the nation's first mandatory recycling and composting law. It would direct garbage collectors to inspect the trash to make sure it is put into the right blue, black or green bin, according to a draft of the legislation prepared by the city's Department of the Environment.
The program is designed to limit the amount of food and foliage that goes into the city-contracted landfill in Alameda County, where the refuse takes up costly space and decomposes to form methane, one of the most potent of greenhouse gases. It will also help San Francisco, which city officials say currently diverts 70 percent of its waste from landfills, achieve a goal set by the Board of Supervisors to divert 75 percent by 2010 and have zero waste by 2020. "

This is why I'll never live the this goofy state (Kali-fornia).

• They have no money, but they are creating a new layer of government "Dept of Enviroment". That's more big fat Gov't union salaries and endless pensions at tax payer expense:damn: . You gotta be $^%$^% kidding me.
• It creates methane gas. There's another energy source! Stick a pipe in that landfill and utilize the resource.

I totally agree, but the problem is when the state bases their funding on something they want to stop, where do they get their money from to fund their programs? They find something else to tax.

First off friend, it's been just over 11 months since I smoked my last cigarette and I didn't quit because of nanny state cigarette taxes.

Second, even if you are right and it actually reduces the amount of smoking related illnesses then that means those people will likely live long enough to start collecting social security, which i'll bet will cost society far more money in the long run.

Third, anyone that actually thinks the government is doing this to reduce smoking related illness is a fool. It's all about revenue generation, which will have to be replaced by other means someday, and the op is just one possibility.

Finally, you're forgetting that there is a third choice which pays no taxes at all, and that is called the black market. If they can't stop illegal drug use what makes you think they'll be able to prevent people from buying their tobacco in rolled up baggies like pot smokers do?

A whole new class of criminalized users to clog up our jails. A new and lucrative market for gangsters to exploit with all the associated crime that entails. Now doesn't that sound just great?

No doubt! It is sickening that these crazy bastards make these kind of decisions, when they need to clean up the human waste the street bums produce. The streets of San Fransicko are a hazmat area.

[quote=nikimcbee]Some days ago American bankers and representatives of the Fed were in europe and promised to ask for and copy recipes to counter the financial mess at their home. Things of closer control and less liberal market philosophy all of a suddenly are attractive for america (not that it not always has been one of the most protect markets anyway...). Sinc elonger time, many american citizens already have understood that the old ameircna way of handling environmentla issues - not handling them at all, that was - can no longer be followed. Gas has become to expensive. Your state deficit and your depts are financed by foreign nnations. Many industrial key areas and plenty of jobs had been sold to foreigners, and into foreign countries. Just yesterday Greenspan warned that more American banks probably will collapse. Your infrastructure would need 1.5 trillion in investements over th enext 5 years plus additonal investements just save it in its current seriously damages shape. Ypur Iraq war in the main has been payed for by china. Your fiance system would collapse if foreigners like china and Europe would stop to buy worthless american treasury bonds. At OPEC more and more people openly philosophize abiut doing trasnactions in oil not in dollars but euros, which would mean an end to america's löicense to pr9nt money.

Your country simply doe snot live by itself, but lives on tick.

So, say: in what way to you think america would clean up Europe's mess? Fact is that much of the rest of the globe is paying for your financial and economic sins of the past to keep you uup running os that you can still take in some more imports. America has accepted to catapult itself into a very dangerous and critical dependence from other nations, financially. and if the others do not wish to pay for that any more, it would collapse.

I think you have a very overestimated self-perception. This is not the US of 1945. A fuse is already burning - and you try to declare it a good cigar, but: smoking kills. :D

[quote=Skybird]Well, skybird, you are definatley right about this, it is not the America of 1945!:shifty: One thing that really makes me mad about my country, is that we are not (collectively:roll: ) financially responsible. This problem is top to bottom. We are simply living waaaaay beyond our means. One day our additction to credit is going to catch up with us and it won't be pretty. (if it hasn't already)

The thing about this article that really pisses me off, is that these elected officials and lower level bureaucrates think they can do whatever they want without consequences. I live in a VERY liberal city, and they are killing the local economy with their eco-socialist policies. People have voted for measures and a few local bureaucrates have subverted the people's will and killed very good projects because they didn't believe in it. This whole thing isn't about "saving the planet" it's about generating money. Another good example of what I'm talking about are the red light cameras. In theory, it's nice, they are saving lives, but they generate so much money, a local Oregon city gov't had violated the law and (secretly) installed more secret red light cameras than they were allowed to so they could generate more money for the city. They got caught and were forced to remove them. Their explanation: "oops sorry.":nope: they are seeing what they can get away with. "We got away with X now lets try Y.

The whole thing is very clear, in my veiw, it's tyranny of the minority. Nazism, Bolshevism, they all started out as an innocent minority and grew to an awful cancer.

So, I'll end this with an open question to everybody that thinks this is a good idea:

1. Do you work (have a regular job, non gov't)?
2. At what point is enough enough? When will you grow tired of the amount of your personal money the gov't insists to take from you? 5%, 10% 30%, 50%, 75%, 100%?

1. Yes. Union railroad job.

2. I got tired 18% ago, I pay about 33% (local,state,and federal). When I factor in all the other taxes (gas tax, sales tax, utilities taxes, indirect taxation in the form of corporations being taxed resulting in higher prices for goods and services, the insidious "inflation tax" all registration tax , licensing tax, the "why the hell not" tax and the tax tax) I have no idea what i actually pay.

I'm going to try not to jump in on this thread too much, even though I generally support your argument. Everyone who cares already knows what I think anyway.

Keep up the fight:up:

and can someone pass me some popcorn too,please?

Roger that. Butter or no butter?

It's just these silly eco-socalist ideas need to be contained to SF. They deserve what they vote for.

Weeell, the public cost of unrecycled waste is higher than that of recycled waste. There is a higher environmental cost, and a higher cost of finding somewhere to put all the damn stuff. If you're dumping recyclable waste in the same way as non-recycleable waste then you deserve to pay the higher cost. It's called responsibility.

[quote=nikimcbee]Well, Nicki, giving tickets for wrong parking or making a mess of garbage that households refuse to separate, and 60 million people dead from fascist tyranny, the hoprror of KZs, and a whole generation of young germans being brainwashed and abused by Nazism for the sake of eternal war and conquest and racism - I must say i take your comparison of these two a bit queer. It does not compare, simply that, in no way. Not today, and not tomorrow.

[quote=Skybird]Sure it does. nazism (National Socialism) and communism started out as a simple idea and it grew. First they're seizing people who won't comply, the next thing you know, their gassing people and putting them in labor camps. Look at political correctness and how out of hand that has become.
it's not about recycling, it's about POLICE enforcing this.

There is no mention of police in the article. This is nothing to do with fascism, it's about people who are too lazy to recycle being influenced otherwise. Making the connection to Nazism/fascism is a giant "**** you" to anyone who has suffered unjustly through state power. I can't believe you're honestly making this argument, I hope this is a joke and I look a giant fool.

The next thing their going to want is treefiddy


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plShz...eature=related

Just for skybird
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-BWrRNGtAww&NR=1

Skeptics call Newsom's plan unworkable and see it as the latest intrusion from heavy-handed city government, which has outlawed smoking in parks and feeding pigeons in much of the city.
Duboce Triangle resident Mark Cromwell, a 53-year-old personal assistant, called the proposed law "laughable."
"Do we want our garbage collectors to be the meter maids of trash?" Cromwell said. "Good luck placing blame on the recycling criminal, especially in big apartment buildings. I will stop recycling if this law goes into effect just to become an eventual test case. Dictators are anathema, no matter which side of the political spectrum they come from."

Who enforces the laws at some point?

Next they'll be fining us for parking in the wrong place, driving too fast. What next?

Comparing recycling laws to Nazism is a disgusting product of extreme privilege. Seriously.

This guy going on about dictators? Someone needs a slap.