No but they hold the UK and EU copy right for sonalasyst

They are the publisher. Ain't the same thing. And no, they don't own the code for DW.

Then they would hold publishers copyright.

Rights are transferable. SCS has the exclusive right to create derivative works of DW, but because that right is transferable, they can choose to allow some kinds of derivative works by others. They've made it clear that we can modify the database and doctrines freely, but not the .exe or .dll's.

Perhaps we should refer the whole issue back to SCS and ask why they will not allow this.I will be also asking for a refund if they try to fob me off!

Simple enough right? Allowing the creation of new playables for free means that Sonalysts can't make those playables available later as an addon that people will pay for. Now it is unlikely they will do this, but you would want to leave that available as an option for the future, right? I remember someone commenting on this likely being part of the reason for adding aircraft and ships to DW, which couldn't be done to SC with any amount of hacking.

Well to be honest I doubt defense contractors or the Navy or however it is who is buying SCS commercial simulation will go on the internet to use illegal mods to the software they are using.
They would be amendable to fines no ?
Just like using a non legal licensed software in a working environment.
Really I doubt that is the real problem for not having playable add ons.

If SCS ever do any kind of development or release any add on for DW then I will buy a shirt with lighthouses on it and I will allow my photograph to be displayed with me wearing it on this website.
http://www.pennersinc.com/stores/pen...lighthouse.jpg

Given that I cant actually add new things to the discussion I still want to put in my 2cts here ...

As was pointed out above already, SCS clearly and repeatedly stated that everything in DW is moddable short of messing around with the .dll and .exe files plus making completely new playable platforms (tho while an Astute class Sub is a No-Go the adding of an Indian Akula for example would be ok). Therefore we are quite legally able to improve the graphics, sounds, doctrines and databases (and even receive support from SCS in doing it).

This means DWX for DW is quite possible, the only thing we cannot do is something like the SCU (Sub Change Utility).

All of this was (and I repeat myself here) stated more then once and with clarity by SCS since before the release of DW. Its stated in the EULA as well which everybody who has installed DW has read to the fullest of course - after all you agreed to it by clicking Ok. If you don't like what you agreed to then you should have disagreed and taken the product back to your dealer immediatly. You (Linton) obviously didn't so don't go around posting about sueing and stuff, because instead of laughing at SCS the judge would most likely laugh at you before dismissing the case.

Aside from that, while I agree that there are a lot of things in DW which would be nice if they get improved - fact is that DW in itself is quite stable and does work as advertised (a few small bugs nonwithstanding). Yes, having a completely moddable product would be nice and DW would certainly benefit from it, but thats only a dream and we have to live with the restricted reality.

The choice we have at the end of the day is either wring our hands and write flaming statements which lead to nothing except spending the time writing when you could do something better or enjoy what we have and try to improve the parts we can improve (legally).Sure you can modify DW on your PC all day long ... but once you wanna play MP you run into trouble.

Well, I'll let this post trail off here ....

I never play mp( I do not have the time) and I feel that the game has been mis-sold.It will never reach its full potential and the peope who sold it to us are quite happy that it will not.Do you want to buy a three wheel car One Shot?

don't suit for MP??? lame lame lame

"Rights are transferable. SCS has the exclusive right to create derivative works of DW, but because that right is transferable, they can choose to allow some kinds of derivative works by others. They've made it clear that we can modify the database and doctrines freely, but not the .exe or .dll's"

:rotfl: Also, I have the exclusive right to modify the DW copy I bought, right? otherwise, why should I pay for it???

"All of this was (and I repeat myself here) stated more then once and with clarity by SCS since before the release of DW. Its stated in the EULA as well which everybody who has installed DW has read to the fullest of course - after all you agreed to it by clicking Ok. If you don't like what you agreed to then you should have disagreed and taken the product back to your dealer immediatly. You (Linton) obviously didn't so don't go around posting about sueing and stuff, because instead of laughing at SCS the judge would most likely laugh at you before dismissing the case. "

Gee!:damn: you just read what the EULA said in preinstallation, you have any idea what is the preconditions for this EULA


Do Sonalysts pay the bills for subsim???? :roll: if they do, I shut my mouth off
someone here depend his salary on Sonalysts' budget???:ping: if they are, well, I think you should do the job better

Next step: whole brandnew Interface(include the weaponloadout interface before gaming), need some quality PS hours to do that. But base on what I had done and test, I would say it's better than the original DW interface, at least in "Sonar display section", "new contact signal" is far more clear than those original, and it's a one man work, and I'm a just an amateur. can Sonalysts do better, they can! but they didn't, and those following patches doesn't seem so "patch to" me.

you spend your money buy something with flaws, they said they might fixed it but they didn't, and, you can fix it and improve it but you do nothing about it cause they tell you it's forbiden, then you sitting dark and wishful-thinking waiting for the empty promise???-----------No offense, but that's the most stupid thing

When I finish the Astute, I will create a new controable Rubis SSN, I mean, at least you should have 5 representative countries in the Game, otherwise, we shouldn't call it as a world simulation

First question

Are you adding a playable?

Or are we getting a new playable submarine at the expense of the other. So if you have the Astute playable you can't play the Seawolf. If that is the case I think it is ok.

If it is playing around with the dlls and exe to make an additional sub in addition to the existing ones this thread will be shut very quickly.

No. SCS has the exclusive right to modify the DW copy you bought. People have a reason to pay for DW so that they acquire the right to use DW. Payment gives you a license to use the software, it does not give you ownership of it.

I know, that is obnoxious as hell and I don't like it either. I really wish that I had enough bargaining power that I could negotiate with sellers to buy and own software and similar products instead of just buying a license. But wishing doesn't make it so.

There is no promise unless they agreed to provide updates/expansion, which you acknowledge they did not ("they might fixed it"). If you've installed DW, then YOU have agreed to an EULA, and it would be a far "stupider thing" for SCS to out of its way to make the conditions of the sale clear, make buyers promise to abide by those conditions, and then have to live with people breaking their word with them.

I have searched the archives but I am having trouble trying to remember what excuse SCS gave for their current stance.
The NCP was another flawed product.The version of subcommand it contained didn't work properly with scu.It removed the sounds and there was a sarcastic remark that appeared in the install that basically said-Tough.I find it amazing that a group of gamers could produce this but the manufacturer could not get it right.As a gaming company I think SCS are finished.Let us hope Ubisoft keep producing subsims ,warts and all.
Now I am quite happy for my seawolf to be sacrificed if somebody can make me a drivable Trafalgar.

SCU is the mod. It is what must be made compatible with the product, not the other way around.