Did a quick check and the IJN destroyers at the Java Sea battle were "Murasame", "Harusame", "Yudachi", "Samidare", "Asagumo", "Minegumo", "Hatsukaze", "Yukikaze", "Amatsukaze", "Tokitsukaze", "Ushio", "Sazanami", "Yamakaze" and "Kawakaze". The first six, together with the cruiser "Naka" (rear admiral Nishimura Shoji's flagship), formed the convoy's close escort.

Cool, I have Dull (poor name choice, huh?). I was thinking also of the composition of the transports in terms of rough sizes.

tater

The warships present at major operations can usually be found in reference books etc, but the composition of the transport convoys is rarely mentioned, apart from numbers involved. Usually the only transports mentioned are those that were actually sunk or damaged, and with a name one can look up said vessel's size. I don't think that any book has been published listing the names and tonnage of all transports involved in convoys, so be prepared to visit archives if you really want such info. And with the Japanese being able to destroy much material at the end of WW2, such info will be very hard to come by.

Quite true. The actual names aren't really critical, I have information about BaseFor1 going to place X, but I have no idea what ships are involved in it. My principal concern is getting the right balance of merchant targets in there.

DANG! I've got to find a link to that convoy document set! It has all that stuff.:damn:

Sorry to be a tease, but I know the link has been posted before. I'm still looking.

EDIT: Got it! Unfortunately the original poster was releasing it by request only, so there's no link. If he's now unavailable, or you can't find another link, I'll put it up as soon as I can. The bad news is that, as I said, it may be awhile before I can do that.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=109621

First post in the research thread in the mod forum:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=109621

Donner says to PM him for the files in there.

The problem is that the japanese didn't start organized convoys until 1944. There were a few in 1943, but not as organized as '44.

tater

Yeah, but these don't just list organized convoys, they list every sailing, from December 1941 on. Well, I can't vouch for every single sailing, but it sure looks like it. They even list the owners of each ship sunk.

Got it! This is an excellent resource. After some cursory browsing of the listings it is obvious that the SH4 convoys needs less DD's and more gunboats/minesweepers/armed merchants as escorts if the aim is to make the convoy compositions more realistic. I have yet to cross-check the sinkings listed in the Japanese Convoy History file with Aldens data in US Submarine Attacks In WWII, but the Convoy History listings seems accurate and comprehensive.

Can you PM me so I can get the file?

BTW, the quick and dirty mod I did to the existing layers radically reduces the escorts (and number of ships early on, too), and replaces many with subchasers and minesweepers changed (in the roster) to finction as "corvettes" so they will escort.

tater

I've been watching your mod very cloesly and I'll install it before my next SH4 session. Looks like just the thing for me. :)

Damn. That is amazing. It'll take ages to study. Note that at the begining the "convoys" are direct military convoys. Invasion forces, and supplies/meteriel for said invasions.

The IJN and IJA comandeered rather a lot of japanese merchant shipping (they had arranged to subsidize production of types that met certain standards for speed, etc, in the years leadign to the war in anticipation of this). Those direct military "convoys" would indeed be escorted. That of course leaves nearly half the traffic SOL. On top of that, aside from actual invasions, the IJA was unlikely to get much of anything from the IJN, their rivalry was pretty pathological.

tater

I'm glad you guys finally got copies, and I'm glad your first impressions were the same as mine. A long time ago I started to catalogue each sailing in brief, on one part to get averages for the devs or modders (this was a while ago) and on the other to put together a list of names. I was trying to put together a better and more complete ship list for SH3 Commander, and thought I might be able to do the same for SH4, as well as help make more realistic convoys. Of course my little experiment in "communal living" got me sidetracked, but I'm still hoping someday to contribute that to the gaming experience.

Meanwhile, have fun with it and keep me posted. Oh, and keep an eye out for the one merchie that got sunk by a single DUD torpedo!:sunny: