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-   -   Iran/US conflict (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=241771)

Skybird 01-08-20 04:07 PM

And now influential Shia leader Al Sadr has declared this crisis to be over, and sent his militia fighters home that just days ago he had reactivated and called onto the streets.

ET2SN 01-08-20 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aktungbby (Post 2643774)
Much like the decision to drop the atomic bomb in a clearly defeated Japan was in reality a message to Stalin for his post-war iron curtain consideration...

My Dad was to be part of the invasion force if the bomb didn't work. :yep: Stalin wasn't a part of that discussion.

August 01-08-20 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Onkel Neal (Post 2643755)
Live Trump speech, parsing through the usual rambling gibberish, he's backing down.


But no Americans were injured and no American assets were damaged. Leveling their oil fields or cities would be a tad over reactive don't ya think?
Apparently he has instituted more economic sanctions. What else or instead should he have done in response?

mapuc 01-08-20 04:26 PM

A question about your local politicians acting in this crisis.

Here mostly those politicians who belong to the left is suddenly expert on middle east and American politics.

They are critic against Trump(as always) and his politics or lack of politics against Iran/Middle east.

So how is your politicians acting..?

Markus

Aktungbby 01-08-20 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ET2SN (Post 2643801)
My Dad was to be part of the invasion force if the bomb didn't work. :yep: Stalin wasn't a part of that discussion.

SO WAS MINE! HE INFORMED IN THE SIXTIES THAT I WOULDN'T BE HERE IF NOT FOR THE BOMB. HE FLEW B 29'S IN WWII AND WAS ON TINIAN WHEN THE ENOLA GAY TOOK OFF.
Quote:

As with many people, Truman was shocked by the enormous losses suffered at Okinawa. American intelligence reports indicated (correctly) that, although Japan could no longer meaningfully project its power overseas, it retained an army of two million soldiers and about 10,000 aircraft -- half of them kamikazes -- for the final defense of the homeland. (During postwar studies the United States learned that the Japanese had correctly anticipated where in Kyushu the initial landings would have taken place.) Although Truman hoped that the atomic bomb might give the United States an edge in postwar diplomacy,:timeout:(STALIN) the prospect of avoiding another year of bloody warfare in the end may well have figured most importantly in his decision to drop the atomic bomb on Japan.
SAVING AMERICAN LIVES CAME FIRST BUT O'L JOE STALIN FIGURED INTO THE EQUATION....https://www.osti.gov/opennet/manhattan-project-history/Events/1945/potsdam_decision.htm THE REPERCUSSIONS OF THE STALIN LANDGRAB ARE STILL EVIDENT TODAY: JAPAN STILL DOES NOT HAVE BACK THE KURIL ISLANDS AS RUSSIA NEVER RETURNED THEM. AFTER ACQUIRING THEM DURING STALIN'S TOKEN ASSISTANCE TO AID THE ALLIES AGAINST JAPAN. IT IS WORTH NOTING THAT KIM JUNG UN'S TEST MISSILES AVOID NARROWLY GOING NEAR 'RUSSIAN TERRITORY' PREFERRING TO AGGRAVATE JAPANESE TERITORY:https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped..._Japan.svg.png https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...-Japan-Map.png< Habomai, Shikotan, Kunashiri and Etorofu. ARE THE DISPUTED TERRITORIES HELD ILLEGALLY BY RUSSIA SINCE 1945. https://www.mofa.go.jp/region/europe/russia/territory/overview.html UNDER NEGOTIATION TO THIS DAY AND THE DPRK MAKES GOOD USE OF THE GEOGRAPHIC LOOPHOLE AS PUTIN "DOTH NOT PROTEST" HIS N. KOREAN ALLY'S NUKE MISSILE TESTS TOO MUCH. AMAZING HOW POTSDAM CONFERENCE 1945 STILL AFFECTS THE PACIFIC REGION MORE THAN HALF A CENTURY LATER....THE CHINESE IN THE SOUTH CHINA SEA ISLAND DISPUTES ARE JUST KEEPING UP WITH THEIR 'COMMIE' BUDDIES IN THE KURILS IMHO.:O:

Bilge_Rat 01-08-20 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Onkel Neal (Post 2643755)
Live Trump speech, parsing through the usual rambling gibberish, he's backing down.

True, but the next logical retaliation would have been to hit military targets inside Iran which would mean an actual war. No one wants war, not Trump or ayatollah Khamenei.

I actually think of this as a win for Trump. Now the Iranians know that if they push too much, Trump will hit back hard.

August 01-08-20 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mapuc (Post 2643803)
A question about your local politicians acting in this crisis.

Here mostly those politicians who belong to the left is suddenly expert on middle east and American politics.

They are critic against Trump(as always) and his politics or lack of politics against Iran/Middle east.

So how is your politicians acting..?

Markus


There used to be a saying here that "politics end at the waters edge" meaning that we may squabble among ourselves over domestic issues but present a united front when it comes to foreign policy. That is pretty much dead now.

Jeff-Groves 01-08-20 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mapuc (Post 2643803)
A question about your local politicians acting in this crisis.

Are you kidding?
They can't even decide or come to a complete decision on impeachment let alone what the official breakfast will be tomorrow!

So they shot a few missiles that SHOULD have hit targets aimed at.
They ran their mouths and rattled swords.

Given that We can turn them into a parking lot at the cost of billions of dollars?
Is it worth it to set them back 3 months?
I don't think so. It would be to easy to do.
I contend that drone shoot down was allowed. Of all the drones we have over there?
Don't you thing allowing one to get shot down is a bit suspicious!
Best way to screw with someone is to give them something they THINK they want!
At that point they divert resources that could have been used elsewhere.
Pretty sure We did that to Hitler during WWII
But then again? Many here don't care what History and it's lessons teach.

August 01-08-20 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aktungbby (Post 2643808)
SAVING AMERICAN LIVES CAME FIRST BUT O'L JOE STALIN FIGURED INTO THE EQUATION.

Well kinda but the Soviets already knew the potential power of an atomic bomb and their spies had kept them informed as to our progress in making them so our use of a nuke against Japan might have had a proof in the pudding benefit to it but I think the edge that the writer you quoted was really talking about was just our possession of them.

Jeff-Groves 01-08-20 06:04 PM

Biggest threat I see to the USA right now is the Dems.

August 01-08-20 06:16 PM

It's looking more and more like the Iranians accidentally shot down that Ukrainian airliner.



Quote:

The plane might have been shot down in the fog of war, one military source said. "The Iranians might have been hyped up, expecting a response and freaking out when they thought they saw an American air attack," the source told the Washington Examiner. "It's possible this was a mistake. It wouldn't be the first time something like that happened."

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/p...-plane-in-iran

Jeff-Groves 01-08-20 06:55 PM

I think it was Aliens!

There are no solid facts! Do you really want to contaminate a perfectly good
good thread of non facts with even more speculation of non facts?
OOPS! Forgot that is what is done here!
:haha:

Yes. Things are a bit cray cray what with all the Impeachment stuff and now the 'We killed your Boy in the Hood' thing.
More people are whacked in Detroit over turf then over there when you do the averages.
Why make it a bigger deal then it is?
Cause it sells.
Yeah. You all buy it and think it's a big deal. Once you think about it with an honest look?
It's business as usual. Not a damned thing has changed since WWII.

ET2SN 01-08-20 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aktungbby (Post 2643808)
SO WAS MINE! HE INFORMED IN THE SIXTIES THAT I WOULDN'T BE HERE IF NOT FOR THE BOMB. HE FLEW B 29'S IN WWII AND WAS ON TINIAN WHEN THE ENOLA GAY TOOK OFF. SAVING AMERICAN LIVES CAME FIRST BUT O'L JOE STALIN FIGURED INTO THE EQUATION....https://www.osti.gov/opennet/manhattan-project-history/Events/1945/potsdam_decision.htm THE REPERCUSSIONS OF THE STALIN LANDGRAB ARE STILL EVIDENT TODAY: JAPAN STILL DOES NOT HAVE BACK THE KURIL ISLANDS AS RUSSIA NEVER RETURNED THEM. AFTER ACQUIRING THEM DURING STALIN'S TOKEN ASSISTANCE TO AID THE ALLIES AGAINST JAPAN. IT IS WORTH NOTING THAT KIM JUNG UN'S TEST MISSILES AVOID NARROWLY GOING NEAR 'RUSSIAN TERRITORY' PREFERRING TO AGGRAVATE JAPANESE TERITORY:https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped..._Japan.svg.png https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...-Japan-Map.png< Habomai, Shikotan, Kunashiri and Etorofu. ARE THE DISPUTED TERRITORIES HELD ILLEGALLY BY RUSSIA SINCE 1945. https://www.mofa.go.jp/region/europe/russia/territory/overview.html UNDER NEGOTIATION TO THIS DAY AND THE DPRK MAKES GOOD USE OF THE GEOGRAPHIC LOOPHOLE AS PUTIN "DOTH NOT PROTEST" HIS N. KOREAN ALLY'S NUKE MISSILE TESTS TOO MUCH. AMAZING HOW POTSDAM CONFERENCE 1945 STILL AFFECTS THE PACIFIC REGION MORE THAN HALF A CENTURY LATER....THE CHINESE IN THE SOUTH CHINA SEA ISLAND DISPUTES ARE JUST KEEPING UP WITH THEIR 'COMMIE' BUDDIES IN THE KURILS IMHO.:O:



I've seen that argument and it supposes that the US leadership was omnipotent in terms of Russia while it was fighting a war in the Pacific.
If I had to guess, 99.999% of the US strategy was aimed at Japan and not at Russia. :)

The US had experience with Russia in terms of Lend/Lease so I think they had a good idea of who they were dealing with. The US didn't "want" Russia involved with the Japanese invasion in their over-all strategy. The US also understood why Germany failed to invade Russia (massive land mass where casualties weren't that important to the Russians) and that the Russian presence in the western Pacific was marginal, to say the least.

Also consider what happened to the USAAF/USAF between 1945 and 1950. If the US was concentrating on Russia that much, why did they "build down" the force?

Jeff-Groves 01-08-20 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ET2SN (Post 2643834)
If I had to guess, 99.999% of the US strategy was aimed at Japan and not at Russia.

I'd sleep better at night if I didn't know someone actually believes that!
:har:

Here's the challenge now.
Try to post without ignorance of facts.

I'd say we get 3 responses with actual proven facts before it breaks down.
Tick Tok people! I ain't stay up all night to see nonsense.

Aktungbby 01-08-20 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ET2SN (Post 2643834)
If I had to guess, 99.999% of the US strategy was aimed at Japan and not at

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff-Groves (Post 2643838)
I'd sleep better at night if I didn't know someone actually believes that!

C'mon now a little mercy! It was 89.666% which is close enough for gover.....errr:subsim: work; besides, I never quibble with a skilled professional who can tell whale farts from cold war Soviet subs opening their outer torpedo ports:o


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