I agree with you never less Islam is very convenient ideology to be used for violence combined with some average backwardness of Muslims.
What christians,communists or nazis did in the past is inexcusable but now the deal is about what Muslims do in the present in the name of religion.
It is issue in present time....
Any way just because some nutcases did some crazy stuff in Europe does not make it all tolerable.

If you compere Islam to communism yourself then you probably can spot the problems by yourself...not asking you to hate every Muslim you see though.


..........

1) Are you going to tell me there 'could be' justifable miltary reasons for ever single isolated attrocity carried out by our side in Iraq? The torture, the rapes and god know what else? In that country we invaded against our own international laws because they had invisible WMDs? Of course the majority of Our Troops were not doing these things, may well have done so based on an ideology that muslims are bad. there may not be a holy book ont hat but its still an ideology.

2) Problem with the Islamic ideology (much like all the major relegions) is that its written in such a way that is wide open to mis-interpretation and bad translation.
The Islamic Ideology you like to present is simply 'your' interpretation of it (nothing wrong with that mind you)
but heres my question, why should I trust at face value, an interpretation of Islam from someone that I know has very low opinion of Islam? If i want to learn about cars, I dont go and ask Green Peace do I?
For all I know you might just be picking out the parts that support your distain, and leave out the parts that dont, (like a 9/11 truther) Im not saying you ARE doing this - just that its pretty typical of human behaviour, thats all.

You might tell me I should look at some of the evil acts carried out by muslims, (and I freely admit that there are plenty of them too) The problem is, that they are perfectly proportional to evil acts perpitrated by non-muslims.
So therefore, the only problems I have with muslims, is the same problem I have with the rest of mankind. I see nothing that makes them particularly more monsterous than anyone else.

There was this policy not to enter mosques ...never ever not to hurt local people's feelings till mosques turned out to be ammo dumps and terrorists hideouts.

Thats all good and well, but there are many many examples of wrong doing from our side. We invaded a country based on a lie, and our values and ethics are pretty accademic when we are senslessly murdering thousands of innocent people and maiming thousands more, deosn't matter how we dress it up, we are not much better or worse than 'them overall. Just different.

Many Iraqis had high hopes with the Americans but other internal and external interest kicked in....in retrospect it could be much better to have conscious clean and let them kill each other.
this would actually had saved some American lives.

Unfortunatley your are probably right.

Good then... don't play it some sort of humanitarian do good er concerned with well being of humanity lol
This whole anti American campaign is wrapped in that crap therefore a lie again.

What part of the question exactly did you not understand?

It is not as rnadom as yiou claim it to be. First, the Quran is filled with contradicting lines, these derive - for the vast majority - from the fact of different times of origin when what Muhammad said the passage in question. This has never stopped both fundamentalist mainstream and the so-called moderate islam that you think exists from proceeding thoruhg history ion the fundamentalist manner. This may be becasue of another fact, that is that the socalled abrogation principle gained consensus amongst all major Muslim juristzic schools and lineages already in 9th or 10th century. It says that in case of contradiction between two quotes from different passages of the Quran, the one that has been given later (was created later and thus is newer) should be given superiority over the older one. Muhammad turned the more violent and aggressive the elder he becam and the more successful his conquest was running. So do the math and add 1 and 1 together. Most violent passages in the Quran are the later ones. They thus have dominance over older quotes.

The whole book is, like the bible a confused collection of contradictions and a bullride through the timeline, because the Suras are nbot sorted in chronological order, but by length. That allows Islam to blind the unknowing infidels and giove one quote toat tells them qhat they want to hear, while acting on behalf of another one that means them evil. The whole communication from Islam'S side is an endless stream of one-eyed halftruths and deceptive opportunistic baits meant to mislead the intended victims, the prey. And the prey is us.

In case of doubt, judge it by the histoic record of deed, act and behavior. And for that dark historic record it has on its behalf, I hold it responsible, no matter what they tell me about that I misunderstand it, and that it was meant differently than it was carried out, and and and. I simply don't listen anymore, I simply do mnot care anymore. I'm not buying this bull. I seer the disatrous trail Islam has left in world'S history and that it has set every place into flames where it arrives and that it destroyed or tried to destroy every culture it came into contact with, and that it bullies against everybody, and claims everything for itself. That is what counts, and that is what decides whether I see it as tolerant, multicultural and peaceful, or as violent, intolerant and supremacistic. The deed is what counts, and even more when the deed is in conformity with the demands of the ideology that motivates and justifies the deed. Here, I see conformity between both.

And so I see Islam as what it is. Inhumane, intolerant, aggressive, violent and totalitarian. It is in its historic record of behavior. It is in it's ideology and in its scripture. More is not needed to form an opinion.

It didn't take Sky long to chime in with his usual line of rubbish were he manages to contradict himself in very short order.:doh:

Nicely done
Game set and match:up:
Though I hope you are not besmirching any other chimps when you refer to the hyterical ones:03:

Right.
So skybird just trashed his own arguement and then topped it by repeating some of his bull that was totally trashed before
"I has looked briefly at a german translation and some bits at a rough count looked longer than others sort of so ya I is right as i had written for many years this"

:haha:crazy man, absolutely far out crazy.
If in doubt about a text you look at the text.

Well I guess you won't be happy until this, starts happening again, I notice in my last threat where this picture was posted, it was deleted, some just can't handle the truth, take a good long look at it, it happened and we need to make sure this never happens again. Arab spring in Eygpt what a wonderful thing. WARNING GRAPHIC PICTURE

Image Deleted <NeonSamurai>

No graphic images of people murdered, blown up, dismembered, or similarly ripped up. If you must, you can use a link to the image and include the warning "Graphic image warning". Copied from rules nothing said about fixin to be executed.

It was probably deleted because:

Well thats easy.
Apparently there is this secret UN NWO plan which will ban all guns and send them off to ReptiliaPrime in those spaceships under the pyramids, when this plan comes to fruition it will be impossible for people to be shot in the back of the head anymore.

So Yubba, and I won't link to that picture again, but I'm guessing that you're fine with that so long as you're holding the gun and the person you're shooting is a Muslim, right? :hmmm:

@Yubba, If that ^ ever happens again, and it happens somewhere like America, it is far more likley it will come from within your own borders that from outside of them. odds of 10-1 Id say, so be careful who you vote for and keep an eye on the small print on those bills that get rushed though congress, do this and Im sure you will be fine :03:.
For an American, you live in nation of mostly christians and Jews who are armed to the teeth, so the spread of Islam should be the least of your worries, while the fixing economy and protecting the constitution (mostly from other Americans) should be number 1.

@Skybird, If I want a take in a lesson on the subject of Islam, I will go and find someone who is objective as possible on the subject, and I think you will agree that is just not going to be you.
I have seen that you can be objective and balanced on other other topics, (and I can either agree or at least sympathise with your views on several other issues) -Just not this one.

If confronted with too harsh a sight: close both eyes, turn away, and deny reality.

Very well. This works great - until the day the object of your denial bites you in the a$$.

Thats exaclty what Im talking about ^

This is reality:
Muslims: 90% of them are complacent like rest of us and dont really give a toss about what happens outside of their own neighbourhood,
The extremists all hate each other, most them have got no money, and most of the world regards them as idiots.

Yet some how they will take over the non-muslim world by the genius art of burning flags and building stealth mosques on every street corner untill we are all drawn to the call of prayer like zombies to a carcass?

How can I take you views on Islam seriously when you believe its a giant conspiricy?
For godsakes man, there are almost as many Chinese as there are Muslims. Islam is 2 about billion people, Non-Islam is about 5 billion people.. do the maths.
How come none of the muslims Ive met tried to convert me or kill me? How come they just drank tea and played video games with me? is it an evil trick?
Most of them are pretty coy about dicussing their faith to non-muslims, you have to ask them.
You think that is because they have something to hide? or perhaps that they are just doing it out of politeness?

Skybirds ignore list:har:

Don't know about Europe but that is very nice description of some ME regions.:haha:
There is no shortage of those guys and things are sort of moving backward so far...lets hope its one step back that will be followed by 2 forward.:D

EU has low % of muslims but i heard about what is going on in some hoods there and it does not look very good.

I think it already has happened.

No graphic images of people murdered, blown up, dismembered, or similarly ripped up. If you must, you can use a link to the image and include the warning "Graphic image warning". copied from rules, nothing about fixin to be executed, or kicked in the head by a thug welcome to Post Consitutional America, or Americtopia to others.