SUBSIM Radio Room Forums

SUBSIM Radio Room Forums (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/index.php)
-   General Topics (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/forumdisplay.php?f=175)
-   -   Sonia Sotomayor 0, white people 1 (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=153232)

Aramike 06-30-09 04:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tribesman (Post 1126221)
Despite the fact that she never said that

Here we go again ...

She said, QUOTE: "I would hope that a wise Latina woman with the richness of her experiences would more often than not reach a better conclusion than a white male who hasn’t lived that life."

How do those words mean anything different than... "A female latina judge can judge better than a white male"?

Please, do break it down for all of us who seem to understand the obvious, Mr. You-Can't-Comprehend.

Tchocky 06-30-09 05:12 AM

Rather good piece on this ruling - http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/30/op...html?th&emc=th

Quote:

Judge Sotomayor, famously, was one of three judges on an appellate panel who applied their federal circuit’s settled precedent to rule in New Haven’s favor. Like that decision or hate it, cheer Monday’s ruling or deplore it, one thing that is clear from reading the Supreme Court’s 89 pages of opinions in the case is that Judge Sotomayor and her colleagues played by the old rules, and the court changed them. Although “Sotomayor Reversed” was a frequent headline on the posts that spread quickly across the Web, it was actually the Supreme Court itself that shifted course.

AVGWarhawk 06-30-09 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aramike (Post 1126223)
Here we go again ...

She said, QUOTE: "I would hope that a wise Latina woman with the richness of her experiences would more often than not reach a better conclusion than a white male who hasn’t lived that life."

How do those words mean anything different than... "A female latina judge can judge better than a white male"?

Please, do break it down for all of us who seem to understand the obvious, Mr. You-Can't-Comprehend.

She said exactly what she meant. I agree aramike, there is not skirting what she really meant.

Tribesman 06-30-09 08:33 AM

Quote:

Here we go again ...
If she said that then you should have no trouble quoting her saying it , but as you can't then it is a fact that she never said it.

Quote:

How do those words mean anything different than... "A female latina judge can judge better than a white male"?
Thats easy, its called context .
Do you understand that word yet ?
Probably not as you don't understand the words quote or fact either.
As for what it means thats simple. you can either take the whole speech that shows your take is wrong , or you can take the paragraph from which the actual line comes which show your interpretation is wrong or you can take the following paragraph which also surprisingly shows your interpretation to be wrong.
So when any one of three methods shows you to be wrong a combination of all three shows you to be absolutely without a doubt completely wrong.



Kazuaki Shimazaki II 06-30-09 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tribesman (Post 1126320)

If she said that then you should have no trouble quoting her saying it , but as you can't then it is a fact that she never said it.



I don't exactly see you quoting the paragraph and helping her fight those horrid charges off. Let's just look at the offending paragraph.
Quote:

Whether born from experience or inherent physiological or cultural differences, a possibility I abhor less or discount less than my colleague Judge Cedarbaum, our gender and national origins may and will make a difference in our judging. Justice O'Connor has often been cited as saying that a wise old man and wise old woman will reach the same conclusion in deciding cases. I am not so sure Justice O'Connor is the author of that line since Professor Resnik attributes that line to Supreme Court Justice Coyle. I am also not so sure that I agree with the statement. First, as Professor Martha Minnow has noted, there can never be a universal definition of wise. Second, I would hope that a wise Latina woman with the richness of her experiences would more often than not reach a better conclusion than a white male who hasn't lived that life.
Please explain to me how this is supposed to fight off the charge. I see Sotomayor constantly alluding there will be differences in how different cultures or genders will interpret cases (the fact that they are different IMPLIES a high probability that one side's interpretation will be "better", since the idea of their quality being equal is extremely unlikely), then it is topped off by her letting us know WHICH side is going to make "better" conclusions "more often than not".

SteamWake 06-30-09 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tribesman (Post 1126320)
If she said that then you should have no trouble quoting her saying it , but as you can't then it is a fact that she never said it.

Need a shovel to get your head out of the sand?

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/au...sotomayor.html

Quote:

I would hope that a wise Latina woman with the richness of her experiences would more often than not reach a better conclusion than a white male who hasn't lived that life.

Tribesman 06-30-09 11:07 AM

Quote:

Need a shovel to get your head out of the sand?
Need help reading much?
Quote:

"A femail latina judge can judge better than a white male".

SteamWake 06-30-09 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tribesman (Post 1126411)
Need help reading much?


Its called paraprhasing its the interwebs get over it.

No doubt in my mind that is what she meant.

But again I risk looking a fool by arguing so have a nice day. :salute:

Aramike 06-30-09 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteamWake (Post 1126415)
Its called paraprhasing its the interwebs get over it.

No doubt in my mind that is what she meant.

But again I risk looking a fool by arguing so have a nice day. :salute:

Notice how Tribesman completely ignored KSII's post explaining the entire paragraph. Furthermore, clearly he doesn't understand what paraphrasing is.

Alas, it is Tribesman's MO to claim "context" despite the fact that the context is correct, and then claim that everyone BUT him can't read, comprehend, etc.

So yeah, you're right. It's pointless to debate something with Tribesman, as it is clearly difficult to explain simple concepts to someone who cannot grasp that a sentence has a meaning unto itself.

Tribesman 06-30-09 01:45 PM

Quote:

Notice how Tribesman completely ignored KSII's post explaining the entire paragraph
It is not ignored at all.
Quote:

Furthermore, clearly he doesn't understand what paraphrasing is.
:har::har::har::har:
Quote:

Alas, it is Tribesman's MO to claim "context" despite the fact that the context is correct
What was she talking about aramike?
What are you ridiculously claiming she was talking about?
Quote:

it is clearly difficult to explain simple concepts to someone who cannot grasp that a sentence has a meaning unto itself.
:har::har::har::har:
Even when it it is surrounded by conditionals.
Even when it doesn't mean what you claim it means and isn't even about what you think it is.
Read the statement again and try and understand why it cannot possibly mean what you claim it means .




Quote:

I see Sotomayor constantly alluding there will be differences in how different cultures or genders will interpret cases
What specificly is she talking about?

Aramike 06-30-09 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tribesman (Post 1126505)
It is not ignored at all.

:har::har::har::har:

What was she talking about aramike?
What are you ridiculously claiming she was talking about?

:har::har::har::har:
Even when it it is surrounded by conditionals.
Even when it doesn't mean what you claim it means and isn't even about what you think it is.
Read the statement again and try and understand why it cannot possibly mean what you claim it means .





What specificly is she talking about?

:yawn:

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention that part of Tribesman's MO - use copious amounts of :har: to disguise the fact that he has no idea what he's talking about.

To quote KSII (who you claim to not have ignored):
Quote:

I see Sotomayor constantly alluding there will be differences in how different cultures or genders will interpret cases (the fact that they are different IMPLIES a high probability that one side's interpretation will be "better", since the idea of their quality being equal is extremely unlikely), then it is topped off by her letting us know WHICH side is going to make "better" conclusions "more often than not".
Oh lookie: CONTEXT.

Aramike 06-30-09 02:36 PM

Kinda back on topic, my chief problem with Sotomayor is that she seems to drag the issue of race everywhere she goes.

I believe that someone on the Supreme Court of the US should NEVER look at skin color and/or heritage when judging a case, or even characterizing a person. There is nothing more irrelevent to someone's actions and qualifications than the tone of their skin.

Tribesman 06-30-09 03:15 PM

Quote:

There is nothing more irrelevent to someone's actions and qualifications than the tone of their skin.
You demonstrate that you havn't the faintest idea what you are talking about, you also demonstrate that you don't know what Soto was talking about .
Not surprising really.

Quote:

Oh lookie: CONTEXT.
Why does that word baffle you ?
Its a simple word to understand, just like quote and fact are simple to understand

Aramike 06-30-09 03:25 PM

Quote:

You demonstrate that you havn't the faintest idea what you are talking about, you also demonstrate that you don't know what Soto was talking about .
Not surprising really.
In the post you just quoted I wasn't referring only to the Sotomayor speech in question. Didn't understand the context, huh?
Quote:

Why does that word baffle you ?
Its a simple word to understand, just like quote and fact are simple to understand
It doesn't. You're the one saying that the context is different than what it is agreed to be, by nearly everyone here, the media, the White House, and - guess who - Sotomayor! http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...ple-occasions/

I refuse to discuss this further with someone who's disillusioned enough to actually believe that everyone else is wrong (including the originator of the quote) and he's right. She said a sentence. It meant what it said. In the context of the paragraph, it STILL meant what it said. No one but you is arguing context, and you're making a fool out of yourself by insisting upon doing so. Her speech may have made a couple of contradicting points regarding this, but that doesn't change the context - that just means she was poorly communicating her point (which she has since stated).

That's all I have to say on this subject. The proof is there, and the fact that it was a poor choice of words, and NOT context, is the explanation from the originator of the quote herself.

Game. Set. Match.

Tribesman 06-30-09 06:10 PM

Quote:

In the post you just quoted I wasn't referring only to the Sotomayor speech in question. Didn't understand the context, huh?
:har::har::har::har:
And in each case she has been refering to one specific thing.
Thats called context.

Quote:

You're the one saying that the context is different than what it is agreed to be
Come on Aramike its an easy question , what was she talking about?
Is the fact that if you actually answer that question your whole line of "reasoning" falls apart what is holding you up ?
Or is it that you simply can't answer the question?

Quote:

I refuse to discuss this further with someone who's disillusioned enough to actually believe that everyone else is wrong (including the originator of the quote)
Since she never said it meant what you said it meant then you are just showing your lack of comprehension again.

Quote:

She said a sentence. It meant what it said.
Yes she did , but you cannot understand what it meant or what it was about which is where the problem arises.

Quote:

and the fact that it was a poor choice of words, and NOT context
Congratulations , you just shot yourself in the foot.:up:

Aramike 06-30-09 06:36 PM

Sure, buddy.

Anyone who makes sense want to talk about this?

Platapus 06-30-09 06:40 PM

Well did not take long for this thread to bottom out. :nope:

Onkel Neal 06-30-09 06:46 PM

Yeah but it's funny! :haha:

SteamWake 06-30-09 07:06 PM

Its a shame really.

Seems like a couple of people got into a epeen measuring contest and totally lost sight of the issue at hand.

Personally I recognize futility when I see it.

But thats buisness as usuall around here it seems.

Aramike 06-30-09 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteamWake (Post 1126666)
Its a shame really.

Seems like a couple of people got into a epeen measuring contest and totally lost sight of the issue at hand.

Personally I recognize futility when I see it.

But thats buisness as usuall around here it seems.

Hey man, I do what I can to kill time when the workload is light. :cool:

But yeah, at some point I should stop responding to the guy pointing at the sky insisting that it's purple, as it is useless to keep arguing with such a person. :up:


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:34 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 1995- 2025 Subsim®
"Subsim" is a registered trademark, all rights reserved.