What's that noise? I think it's the world's smallest violin playing for Mr. Ajmi.

"bloody stain on our conscience!":rotfl:

I'm glad the rest of the world ISN'T on our side. Why should I care about the "rest of the world?" The same "rest of the world" that said the US deserved 9/11 even before the smoke had cleared?

If I've learned anything in recent times it's to make sure to do the OPPOSITE of what the "Ruins of Europe" tell us to. They talk about what a horrible country the US is, and then they expect us to follow their advice when dealing with terrorists? It makes no sense. You don't seek advice from those who wish you ill. :doh:

Later, people. The "stain on my conscience" is just too much to bear.:cry:

Who the heck is Mr Ajmi? :-?

The subject of the original article. He blew himself up, murdering 7 people.

Do you even remember the response to 9/11? The front page of Le Monde proclaimed "We are all Americans now".
So in answer to your question, no. Not that "rest of the world". The one that, by and large, supported the US when it had been greviously wounded.
See my above comment on international attitudes.
Dealing with terrorists? Some of those in Cuba were bought by US forces in Afghanistan, no proof necessary, cold hard cash is the impetus. This strategy, combined with what have routinely been described as kangaroo courst, don't imbue the official statements of "terrorists" with much credibility. Certainly some are, but there are many victims of circumstance.

EDIT - If I was talking about how horrible the US is, I wouldn't have described Guantanamo as a stain. I thought that was obvious.
A simple exercise of empathy would make this seem a lot less light-hearted.

By "victims of circumstance", are you referring to Hamdan? The man was a willing bodyguard and fighter for someone whose organization's goal was to kill American civillians.

PD

Not familiar with the name, but if it's bin Laden's driver/bodyguard you mean, I recall all the charges against him being dropped.
However, that may say more about the murky/illegal proceedings than the giult/innocence of the prisoner.

I was referring to those who were bought by US forces in Afghanistan.




http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/0531-10.htm

Okay gotcha. As for Hamdan, charges were dropped because it was ruled the court that tried him didn't have the juridstiction to so. As he was ruled an "enemy combatant", not a "unlwawful enemy combatant" as would have been required. This also invalidated all the other Guantanamo prisoner rulings, IIRC.

And I agree, the way we whored out capturing prisoners to the Northern Alliance is ridiculous. But we had to come up with some prisoners. And the fact is we were a day late and a dollar short in gettting there. Nearly 30 days after almost 3,000 American civillians are killed...We start bombing and relying on special forces working with NA fighters as our boots on the ground. OBL and his buddies could have merrily skipped out of Afghanistan and cleared the border in any direction by that time. So we had to make do with buying prisoners from their tribal enemies; free market regulating itself I guess???

PD

First let me say i have no love of fantatical towelheads and islam, and im not sure what to do about gitmo in general, but i do know one thing for sure. That Gitmo should not become a modernized version of a Nazi Death camp. I dont want to give the world a legitimate reason to equate the American flag with the swaztika.

http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/7...tanamo9ux5.gif


http://img166.imageshack.us/img166/2...8237032zx6.jpg

Ok skybird, ive been looking for a excuse to link this picture for weeks, thanks!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...nstitution.jpg

That, "said", again, i have no idea what to do, only what we shouldnt do. No matter how much we may think we'd like to. (IE, shoot the bastards)

That's hilarious Ducimus. :lol:

PD

Serious question to those who oppose sending anyone to gitmo as people seem to love calling it (its certainly a lot easier to spell!)

what do you propose we do with terrorists when they're caught? let em go again?

surely you all dont propose we put them through the same legal systems that lets convicted killers out in less than 10 years, convicted kiddie fiddlers out ever, etc? like subman said, these fanatics will not change their ways. let em go they'll come away with all sorts of knowledge garned from our hospitality in pretty cushy surroundings, and they'll come back for a 'visit' later on..

If every person sent to Guantanamo was a nasty terrorist, then we wouldn't have seen most of them released without charge. (edit - that's a bit on the nose, I admit, I just don't believe a bloddy thing that comes out of there)
Guantanamo has nothing to do with terrorism or how to deal with it.

EDIT - No, we wouldn't let them go again. THere are more than two options here. Deny terrorist crimes any sort of special treatment, lock them up for mass murder.
DON'T round up people en masse and throw them into a legal black hole, possibly torturing them. None of thsi secrecy bull****. None of this "forced-positioning". All that does is confirm everything that Al-Qaeda says about the West. We're better than that.

"We are all Americans now"? Yeah, that's why they spend sooo much time calling Americans fascists & imperialists.:rotfl:

Again, i find it extremely funny how they admit that they hate the US and then demand that we follow their advice to fight terrorism.

I seem to recall a VERY compassionate article from the Euro's in the days after 9/11. "A Bully With a Bloody Nose is Still a Bully". Very little international goodwill was squandered becaus it was never there to begin with.

Oh, and here's one of our German friends who showed some heartfelt sympathy with the US:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...04.html?sub=AR

http://pillageidiot.blogspot.com/200...t-work-of.html

A lot of the "international community" probably WOULD want the terrorists set free, so long as there was some way to make sure they only attacked American interests. Many people were not at all unhappy about the attacks - see the links above.

"The euro's" - Europe is not one single entity or opinion bloc. To quote GWB, you forgot Poland.
I think you are confusing criticism with hate, whether wilfully or not I can't say.
Where's this admission of hate, by the way?

:roll: Well, you could google "Margaret Drabble", for one. I'll give her this - at least she dispenses with all the phony sympathy for America. I admire her honesty.

Where did I say that Europe was a single entity? The "Bloody Nose" article was written by a European -hence the reference to "Euro's".

http://www.dailytelegraph.co.uk/opin...ixopinion.html

"We are ALL AMERICANS NOW!" :D

The endless "they...they...they". There are a lot of European countries that are supportive of the US both morally and militarily, admittedly less so in the last couple of years.

That some individuals hate the US does not make sympathy shown by others false. hy is the sympathy phony?

I have to say i dont realllly agree much with what you said here tchock, guantanamo has everything to do with terrorism imo because thats where people suspected (innocent until proven guilty, obviously) are predominantly sent, kept etc. but thats a minor difference in interpretations of interest i think.

more to the point, i'll say i've not seen any evidence of people getting rounded up en masse and locked up. i've read similar charges by many people claiming its all a control-conspiracy-thing, but i've not seen evidence. we all know that the en masse claim can't be used just by the number of detainees, but if you can point to evidence on this one, by all means i'll look at it in depth!:)

I do agree in part with the secrecy thing though.. partly yes cos itd be nice to see what is really going on (be it good or bad) , im personally of the opinion we'd find theres been a lot of nasty stuff stopped that would simply be frightening but we'll never know. The partly no however, comes from that i can appreciate that they simply cant afford to release so much of the information they're gaining, etc. simply because to give it out would jeopardise ongoing operations.

Still im sure theres a lot they're able to release but probably cbf going through the effort of sorting it out.