QFT- however I think the quest for realism could have been used elsewhere. Each to thier own.

As most have stated, 5-6 patrols then a desk job. It adds a bit of realism. Besides, you get the chance to use other submarines at different start points. Like I'm in the Baleo out of Manilla. I would like to try the S class on my next patrol when I start it. Also, how long do you stay out? I'm on my first patrol going into week three with it. Probably be out for another 3 weeks.

Put it this way has ANY1 been forced to retire? Who was based someplace else other than Pearl? Who didn't just recieve the GATO?

From the readme

Of all the things to Simulate, they simulate career length lol. When there so much else that is far from simulated.

Personally, I like that they simulate this, but I understand why others don't. It definitely should have been an option.

It may add a bit of realism, but I approach the SH series like an RPG. I don't want a disposable commander. After I've bonded with the character over a bunch of patrols and multiple years of war, like in SHIII, every strategic choice takes on a heightened level of importance - especially if you play DID ("dead is dead") like I do.

That's why in SHIII I'll go into Scapa on a first or second patrol. I've got nothing to lose, I haven't invested anything in the character. But would I go into Scapa in 1942 with a Kaleun I started the war with in 1939? No freaking way. Getting pounced on by a bunch of destroyers and being thoroughly depth charged takes on a new level of meaning if you've played a hundred hours with that character in DID mode.

This will have to be modded. If this mechanic is real, its a major gamebreaker for me.

I agree. I am one to get attached to one boat. I like to take it as far as I can.

Then again as said earlier, the patrols in SH4 seem to last 4-8 weeks so you are really out there a long time. In SH3 the patrols seem shorter, unless you are headed across the Atlantic.

Ditto for me, I like realism as much as the next guy, but this is a major roleplaying killer for me.

I will keep looking through the files. As I mentioned some posts above, hopefully we can find the trigger that asks if you want to 'buy' back into the war and lower to required renown.

Ther doesn't seem to be any bug here what so ever. Most sub skippers lasted at most 5 -8 patrols before being moved on. The USN aproach to their commanders was totally different to the German attitude, Particulary when you take into account the length of US war patrols in comparison. Sailing from Pearl to Empire waters was longer than a German boat heading to the East coast of the US during drumbeat except it was virtually every time they left port. It is works as designed as far as I can tell and it is historically accurate. Good.

As for being dismissed. There were a large number of US skippers dismissed during the war for not being agressive enough as well as for being incompetant. It was a major problem, compounded by the fact that the USN Sub force leadership was no where near as good at what they did as the KM equivalent. They improved, though, as did the quality of the skippers as those who were simply not up to the job were replaced by men who had served as officers on other boats and had learned how to fight a war in submarines.

Sh3 needed Shcommander before we got a feature like this. I for one am delighted that we got it straight of the bat.

when i think about it more the idea is kinda cool. makes you slow down and enjoy each patrol a bit more.

Taking control away from a player is a cardinal sin, especially if it is implied intuitively that they can keep going... This applies to gameplay, not story telling.

If I'm going to invest time in learning my crews names, developing their skills, and expecting to see improvements in their abilities I want to have a reasonable amount of time to do so. This also implies a lengthy, dramatic experience. Otherwise why bother with all the stats, medals, etc. Not to mention the DYNAMIC campaign engine! For only 5-8 missions.

If my patrol is limited to 5... That’s a max of about 130 torpedoes, maybe sinking 25-30 targets per career? Oh yeah that’s pretty real! But that’s not what I signed up for. Reply value is important, but not at the expense of the first play experience.

I'll bet you that there is some really ugly issues or major unbalancing that happens if a career goes on for too long that they are still sorting out.

After all not one single feature in this game works as advertised, not a single thing, let’s not make even more assumptions that the developers are super geniuses and make stuff up to support some wild assumptions.

IMO this is simply the single worst decision made by the dev team in SH4.

Of course it's unrealistic, but I WANT to start a career right after Pearl Harbour, battle through the difficult early war period with torpedo failures and japanese airpower at its height, see the allies pushed back to Australia, then participate in the counteroffensive, get new and better subs, equipment and torpedoes, grinding forward slowly and finally end the war hunting for the last remnants of the imperial fleet in the Inland Sea.

It's all about motivation.

:nope:

They can't win, can they? Either it's not realistic enough or it's too realistic. After all, it is supposed to be a simulator. Part of that is the career length. Richard o Kane doesn't seem to have any problem working with this with the story telling in his books, I don't either.

I think it's one of the best decisions they made. They reacted to SHcommander and made something better. :up:

You are right: it's all about motivation.

it is just annoying is all. if this is a realism thing there should be an option to turn it off. I can care less about realism (i play at 23% realism), I just really don't want to lose my boat.

No doubt the player will have single handedly sunk half the Japanese ships in existence by the end of 1945.

Indeed, optionally being the key word. I like the idea of it, but I also like the idea of working through the entire war with progressively better boats.

Thats right, you just proved my point, Richard is a story teller, not a designer. When you are in control of telling a story you control the entire experaince, lead ups, plots, spirals, drama, character development, emotion, etc.

In a game you have to at the very make the player belive he has some degree of control of those things through interactions, and also reward them for over comming certain criteria...

It really is prefrence but you have the option to retire every time you exist the game, you can impose this reality for your own idea of enjoyment. Forcing someone who has a diffrent idea, when its implied, even if by previous versions is a little lopsided.

SHcommander was/is awsome... because it had options! :D

I don't mean to be abrasive but I just like the game a lot and really want to have as much fun as I did with SH3...

Don't like the feature. Liked How SHIII was done. Its not real life. But to make everyone happy this is the way I think they should of done it.

after 4-5 missions you have the choice to Spend Renown (1000) to keep your commision. After another 3 you have to spend (2000) to keep it. Etc.

That way for you Realism buffs you get your 4 missions. The rest of us get what we want if we earn it (IE YOU NEED RENOWN).

Simple.

You realism folks need to chill a little. Not everyone that plays SH games is into realism. Thats why the devs was Suppose to make the game appeal to everyone.

I think we are all missing the point. It is a bug because it only happens after the player accepts the GATO in Pearl Harbour. Nobody else has said they have been forced to retire other than after doing as stated above.