"Any admission that you have in your possession illegal software can and usually will result in revocation of your Radio Room forum account."

And he´s a repeat offender.

It's part of the posted rules we agreed to when we signed up here:

So while it sucks, it was the posted punishment for such actions. Combined with whatever happened in Auguest, I can see a perma ban happening.

I dont have to agree even if its in the rules.

What about the larger picture? Perm ban for people who make this a funnier and more interesting place to be?

Yes, he has screwed up, but he couldn`t have been aware of what he got himself into.

I have no idea what previous transgressions Seth has been pulled for.

I also agree, that whatever the moderators decide is the best course of action regarding failure to comply with the forum rules is, then it must stand. Their word is final and I doubt anyone will be able to change their minds.

I also agree entirely with the Forum Rules regarding Piracy, Cracks, etc etc. I firmly believe in supporting the developers of all software via the legal purchase of this software.

However, (you knew there was going to be one)

I would ask you to consider the following (as this issue always comes back to the same sticking point).

These expansion packs have been proven to contain work by modders who were not informed/asked/paid or credited for their work. As such the developers of these expansion packs have not supported the original developers in any way shape or form.

Now, because of the excellent relationship Subsim has with developers/game studios, I can totally understand the need to keep all talk of Piracy, Cracks etc off the forum, but the old adage applies here, “two wrongs, don’t make a right” but I believe that there maybe a need to relax the rules in this case as Seth has done nothing different to what the expansion developers have done.

We can penalize Seth. But how do we penalize the developers of this expansion pack?
Not buy their Expansion Pack?

I don’t want to get into a lengthy discussion about the Ubi Agreement we all signed when we first used SH3, as it’s been discussed before.

I just wonder if there might be a little wriggle room in this instance.

Quote:

Any admission that you have in your possession illegal software

The word "can" means that there may always be a workaround, in light of any mitigating, or extenuating circumstances!

It's like EVERY case of someone dropping litter being automatically given the MAXIMUM penalty......doesn't happen in reality (although the Rules say it can).

Personally, I don't know Seth, never even exchanged conversations on these Forums with him, but I have enjoyed reading some of his posts, and have benefitted from his knowledge of SH3!

From what I have seen, it isn't as if the "Pirate software" admittance was at the more blatant end, such as posting links, web addresses, details etc.

In all honesty, if the truth be told, how many of us can be 100% sure that they have NEVER downloaded any pirate, or illegal software, even by accident!

JMHO

I think if it were anything else, the punishment wouldn't have been so harsh, but unfortunately subsim would be condoning his actions by allowing him to stay, and could result in negative consequences for the site, so the choices are limited. IMO

Apples and oranges. Seth has admitted twice that he possesses pirated software, two commercial products that he hasn´t paid for. What the developers of the expansion pack did was something completely different.

Ok, nuff said.

Thanks

Easy answer for that...sue them!

But! It hasn't happened yet, I wonder why. Where is the proof? I wanna see it. That company has not been sued yet as far as I know, their products are still out there in the stores. Danlisa you got no right to judge this, so be careful. Let's call them suspects instead...until we see a verdict from a court of law.

However I don't think we will see that, this case is probably not serious enough to end up there.

Anyone else noticed that there has been ALOT of 'in the brigs' recently? Alot of crap has happened before without the person being banned, but why the mods are so strict now?

Anyways, hang in there Seth! You did the right thing IMO. F*ck the X1.

We cannot sue them. They have Ubi´s permission to mod the files, no matter if G-d him/herself made the mod, they can take it and use it as long as they have ubi´s permission. They havent done anything illegal, but what they did was morally wrong.

And why it is so hard to take a look at the thread, where modders identify that there are their mods used?? Open your eyes ffs!

Where in my post have I judged them? I have not called them thieves or accused them of stealing. Now if you want to imply that from what I have written then that is up to you.

This has been done for me, did you read this from your other thread?

No worries Dowly, I've posted it for him

We are not more strict than before. It´s just that some people had accumulated several warnings, they still didn´t get it and did something stupid again, so they got suspended or banned.

damn it ,i know seth 'he just started skinning some subs and now this happens ...bad luck i presume' '

That's correct Admiral Dowly! They haven't done anything illegal by the law, and that's why I have been defending their products...because they are good. But we also got the wonderful GWX-team, and they will release the "same" product, for free :up:

Like if u are with the guys

and they are talking about a group of chicks that you saw last night in the club.
now they are curious how to would be in bed...you just lie about ''I banged that blondies sister last night, that was great'' the others might then be confinced they are good in bed ;)

So in Seths case of a lie, for example

He didnt have the Expansion pack.
Subwolf says the ones that dont have it dont know sh!t about it
Seth wants to proof he is right that the Expansion sucks
well, he can tell ''I have buyed a copy bla bla bla''
but Set thinks this ''What will others think of me when I bought it?'' he expects negative results.

Seth doesnt want that to happend he wanted to stay on a Cool/neutral level. you know keep his head high.
''Well I downloaded the pack and its full of spyware bla bla bla''
seth thinks:
1. the anti-SW side will think: See what seth said, it sucks he tried it but also he didnt support he producer
he forgot about the other side:
2. the Pro-SW side sais: He is a pirate!, how could you download something you think it sucks in the first place bla bla.
And he didnt remember that Piracy is a stab in the heart on this comunity:
3. Mod: Sees a piracy act one of the members , breaking the forum rules and bans him.

I dont care if seth lied or indeed has the mod pirated from the internet.

Well what seth said I will refer as a foolish act. especially when most of us know piracy is not to be spoken about keep your HD private. we dont wanna know what you do with the internet.

now the perm ban:

I find it too hard, now I dont know what happend in August, his posts dont go further then September. at least that are the ones I can find on his profile.
Also, he mention that he downloaded the expansion, ok?! did he in anyway promote the expansion while we know better not to do the same, he didnt said where he got it from, nor he shared files of it.

''He Said that he downloaded it''
Reason to perm ban it for it?
No
Temp Ban? Yes, and double the days in the brig then the last time he was in it.

''He said that he downloaded it and posted a link where to get it from''
Thats a reason to perm ban him.

because still we are human beeing , sometimes we screw up by a dumb action. nobody is hurt or has been insulted. we are dissapointed that he said those things but the punishment is just Way to hard

HunterICX

sorry for some gramar mistakes or spelling, but I hope a clarify my other post a bit.

Ok, Hunter, now I got your intention. Sorry for misinterpreting your original post.;)

YES BUT THEY STOLE FREE MODS AND SOLD THEM!!!! WITHOUT PERMISSION!!!

And please tell me, what you mean by this "because they are good."?

Good like they havent broken the law?

Good modders?

I cant find a single good thing about their product (well, of course the great mods made by the COMMUNITY).

Like you said in the other thread, people have opinions. This is my opinion, based on findings of the modders here in SubSim.

Danlisa, yes I did read that. But if I was a lawyer I couldn't use that as evidence...that's my point.

It's the moral side of this that hurts you, and I understand that, as I have told you before.