You are aiming at the wrong person. Use the search-button to find what I said about Afghanistan during the last four years, or Iraq, or Islam, or Turkey. You are not long enough around to remember that, and I have no intention to repeat dozens and dozens of pages of essays and writings I have produced in that time :) I have come to an almost zero tolerance policy towards Islam, yes, and for very good reasons. But I have opposed and attacked America's way of bringing them it's political ideas and values in the same uncompromised way and manner.

The Western countries and their faults you quoted - still there are many protesters and demonstrators against such things, and medias reflect such discussion to a wqide degree, usually. Sentencing and/or killing people for typical Islamic reasons, Sharia or family honours (disobedient females, especially) is common practice in many countries between Marocco and Indonesia, some of which I had been to. It's just not always a headline in the news. And still public Muslim protest and resistance against such things by far does not compare to the level Western citizens make issues within their communities an issue of examination or public debate. Nor do I see a Muslim uprise against the yearly killing of around 150.000 Christians in Muslim countries in local progroms and local violance (source: Vatican leak), nor against the ethnic cleansing that takes place in all Muslim territory since 1300 years and led to the constant declining of all non-Muslim communities in these territories during that time, until today.

From Germany I know that a huge degree of young generation Muslims having lived in Germany all their live welcomes the idea of violance against disobedient female family members, and Sharia. I wrote about that in the past as well.

I do not accept Islam claiming it is ethically en par and of the same civilisational development level like the West has been in the past (we are beyond the climax of our culture, but still we are far better off than almost all other world, especially the Muslim world and Africa). It is not, but lacks more than a millenium behind. If you do not believe me, I recommend you to travel and see some places yourself. ;) I have seen quite a bit of the Orient. I know that in many parts of Africa it is even worse, without having been in Africa (accept the northern coast-states).

I remember a news from some days ago, in England or Belgium, I do not remember. A Muslim husband is currently at court, being accused for having beaten up his wife. He defended that he does not know what it was about, in his Muslim home country he wouldn't have beaten her, but would have seen her getting killed - if this is no sign that he is a moderate Muslim...?! - Pack your luggage and back to the place under that stone where you have emerged from, that is all I have to say to this moderate muslim. My place shall not be your place as well.

Not really aiming at anyone, in fact from what I've read already I suspect we're actually of a like mind on many things political.

I don't have a zero tolerance of Muslims though, there we are of very different opinions. I'm not saying that I'm for Islamic Jihad or anything of that sort, as certainly there are clear lines between what an international community can tolerate and what it cannot.

I don't view all "Arabs" under the same lens though simply because they are too diversified a group: both geographically and religiously (I'm no expert on the Koran but the various groups do seem to differ in how they interpret it). I think Islam, compared to modern day christianity, is certainly difficult for us Westerners to wrap our minds around no matter how "moderate" it may be. And I agree, to an extent, that from the point of view of an "elightened" civilization they do still seem to be stuck in the dark ages. Though christianity has many dark chapters of its own, and still remains a tool to uncritically rationalize one's actions when no rational explanation can be applied.

But when you're talking about a geographically diversified group of 1.4 billion Muslim people I personally find it very had to make too many generalizations. I would like to think that they should be given the opportunity to work their "growing pains" out but at the same time I understand that the hostility some of them have toward the West combined with the ease of modern day transit, deadly weapons, and their willingness to use them even when it means self-destruction, doesn't tend to allow us to simply sit back and let them work things out themselves.

There are really two big cultural problems that I see: one is radical Islam (Islam and religion in general, for that matter, more evil having come of both than good to my mind) and the other is the poverty and exclusion that can allow the religion to become more and more radical. And our interventions into the middle east to date haven't done anything to change things, if anything we've only stirred the hornet's nest. Essentially we're between a rock and a hard place with conflict between the two cultures likely not only to become more common, but more deadly as well (9/11 being but a small taste of what may be in store for us). Yet in our interventions we seem only to show a knack for making the situation worse.

Since you are wondering why I think that way, the major essays I wrote on the matter. Sorry for the spelling, I simply type too fast.

I haven't always been that hostile towards Islam, but found myself in need to become like that the more I reflected on academical input and experiences at location and general research of previous years. I have done quite a bit of travelling there, partially for professional reasons, and spend - amongst others - half a year each in Turkey (Eastern part, Anatolia, Kurdistan), and Iran (North-West, Teheran, southeastern border region).

Until roughly two years ago I have shared your more generous, tolerant attiude. I rate this as almost suicidal nowadays.

the lionks are no obligation, since it is a lot of reading, it's just an invitation. Let it be if you do not want, it's okay. It's not too systematical, I wrote it the way it came to my mind.

http://www.subsim.com/phpBB/viewtopi...=history+islam
"If you want the history stuff alone, go to chapter 2. If you want my quarrel with Islam moving into the modern West plus some already known stuff I have written in former topics in the past months, go for the Foreword as well."

http://www.subsim.com/phpBB/viewtopi...light=dialogue

http://www.subsim.com/phpBB/viewtopi...light=dialogue

http://www.subsim.com/phpBB/viewtopi...ghlight=turkey

http://www.subsim.com/phpBB/viewtopi...650&highlight=

Whoa there !

Scandium, welcome to this forum. Just what it needed ! Another opinionated personality. The more the merrier ! :up:

One reminder tho'. Skybird has gained and fully earned a special position here (as his avatar gives away). His 'Palmarès include critically acclaimed study projects on Islam's history and current position: A definite must read. Moreover: He is German. And the good news is: Gone are the days of 'die Marchierer' who would mindlessly follow orders and later on: The Germans who are painfully politically correct as not be confused with TR Germany. Hail to a new breed of free spirited Germans.

He ist der Weltmeister of verbose, of avalanches of words, of waterfalls of syllables. He uses words like a M1A2 uses its 120mm M256 smoothbore gun.

http://www.army-technology.com/proje...ges/abram1.jpg

It was not much more than a year ago I think when -rather to my surprise at that point- you came out of your closet on the Islam issue. Things went quick from then on...

:arrgh!:

Thanks for the welcome. I'd been lurking in the Sh3 forum for at least a couple months before finally registering and posting. It was only more recently that I ventured into the "General Topics" and discovered something very rare on the 'net these days: an international forum where political, military, and religious discussions are not only welcome, and of differing points of view, but even civil.

I'll probably sift through some of his archived links to get a better feel for the forum and the writings, because I have to admit that despite having read many threads in SH3 before ever posting, with registration out of the way I just dove straight into this one.

:( But my opinion on Bush and Neocons has not changed much... You just never asked me about Islam earlier :)

Intellectual output from the Arab world
 

Those were the days that Islam (and anti-Nazism) were the only subjcts Skybird & I agreed upon, but nevertheless got into fights because even with those subjects he couldn't hide his anti-Americanism...
:D
Nowadays my opinion about Bush (not America) is shifting, due to reading Tom Friedman's "Longitudes and Attitudes".
:-?

Re: Intellectual output from the Arab world
 

Ach nee, ne...? :) "'ne Hütte auf 'ner Wanderdüne is' schneller!" :lol:

BTW, just fopr the record. It is anti-Bushism, not anti-americanism. :know: