Originally Posted by Feuer Frei!
(Post 2086213)
The one we live in.
I was waiting for you to make a comparison. An unrealistic comparison as well.
Firstly, your thread 'implies' that the kids are forced\coerced\told\\blackmailed or any other way against their will into this 4 day camp by titling it: 'feminizing boys to be like girls'.
Who is feminizing the boys? Is it the parents? Is it the boys themselves?
No-one. The camp? Nope. The camp, as i see it is a 'release' and a safe haven\ground for these kids to be themselves for a few days, away from the stereotypical and ignorant garbage that Society (yes, there's that word again) dishes out to anything that's not considered 'normal' or mainstream in the eyes of the ignorant buffoons who can't and won't accept gender differences in our....society.
Still living in the dark ages i suspect.
To me it seems utterly normal that a 'safe haven', such as this camp exists where people, or boys in this case can be themselves without being judged, bullied, harrassed, annoyed, sexually discriminated against, physically discriminated against, verbally discriminated against, etc etc.
Don't see the harm in it.
You seem to, firstly by creating the thread, then putting your slant on it by calling it sick, then by responding to my reply with a certain tone of venom and defensiveness.
Your comparison of these boys being able to 'come out' and being themselves, as the article describes, and comparing that to parents who molest children is a seriously bad example and i suggest you come up with a much more realistic and relative example next time.
Of course you do.
I would be interested to see what you thought of parents molesting children are then. Sick?
Society 50 years ago was a lot, and i stress the word lot more reserved and intolerant to gender issues than today.
We've come a long long way since then, although there is a long way to go until acceptance of issues such as these are addressed and moreso fully understood, and most importantly, the stigmas surrounding gender equality accepted and dealt with in a mature and empathetic way.
Probably not, since your thread wouldn't have got the replies it has so far.
It would have disappeared off the front page of GT quickly i suspect.
Although, i would have commended you for sharing it and shedding some light on this subject and perhaps educate some people and give it exposure which would have not happened 50 years ago.
Of course. I just made an opinion, like you, to state that calling it sick is far-fetched.
In my eyes. Nothing more, nothing less.
Don't see how, since there is no forcing of children being driven to these camps and quiete frankly the pictures seem to indicate that the boys and parents alike are actually enjoying themselves. Now before we jump down my throat and call me ignorant to the allegations that the media is very capable of not delivereing the full story or portraying this story as factual or not giving us the complete facts, of whether the parents are or are not forcing the boys to take part or not is another story.
Going off the pictures and the content of the story, it seems that it's a harmless, mutual and happy time had by all. How de we know? We don't. All i can conclude is that both parties are there at the camp by mutual agreement. If there is any signs of child abuse going on, mentally, physically or both, investigations would have already ensued by now, not least of the fact that this camp has been given exposure to the media and would already have been scrutinized by child protection services and other departments responsible for the welfare of children. Had that been the case. Or if that is the case. Agree. You and I may not agree on the parents being able to make certain decisions for their children, based on our beliefs, or our reservedness when it comes to issues like this. Can't be? Why not? You're talking about the physical attributes of womanhood? Therefore becoming a woman via surgical methods? Or? Transgender people are being accepted more and more in todays' society. Once again, we've come along way, still a long way to go.
Reality will only slap them in the face if certain sections of todays society displays the usual ignorant and stereotypical garbage that we see. Worse still, violent behaviour shown towards transgendered people, resulting in suicide, death, mental and physical scarring, trauma, the list goes on. They have morew chance of becoming what they want to become nowadays then say 50 years ago. In my eyes that can only be a good thing. .See above. How are they not protecting them? And we are discussing the article you posted and entirely drawing conclusions just from that article and discussing only the camp and its purpose and nothing else. I don't see that the parents in this article would be 'protecting their boys by not giving them support and the freedom to attend a camp such as this and let them be themselves, as the article describes it. Remember, just because a child looks young, doesn't mean to say we should underestimate the perceptions of a child. I don't think so at all. I think the article is a report on a camp that gives children the opportunity to be themselves and the parents are anything but bleating their disapproval of society's ignorant and unaccepting stance on gender issues.
That's fine, i don't either. But i don't see it. Still. No agenda-pushing going on here.
The gender issues we have faced, as a society so far, has taught us that, as i said above, we have a long way to go.
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