If you want to, I will give 50$ for a good cause!!!

It's not so much their willingness to support a venture like this..... it's a question of if they are financially able able to support it. Some are more than others, but there are those that just don't have the extra money to do so.

And that is why the GR2 Editor/Viewer is being worked on. Spite is a powerful motivator :D Just to be able to stick it to them and know that there's nothing they can do about it will forever bring a smile to my face :yep:

where would SH5 be without you.

stick it to em! :salute:

+1:rock:

Interesting, all of it, but it faces a major hurdle in the form of IP rights.

I am not a lawyer, so I don't know where the line is drawn exactly between "adding functionality to a piece of software" and "fundamentally changing it in a way where it becomes a competitor to the original", but I'm sure there is one, and I'm even more sure that if Ubi found out that somebody had created a version of SH that basically blew everything that they might do with the franchise out of the water before they'd even started developing it, they'd swoop down with a murder of lawyers quicker than you can say "spit."

And I understand that too. If your Intellectual Property has been rendered worthless by a competing product that is, in its essentials, only existing because of your original code, then you have a legitimate issue.

The only way to get around this would be to reach some sort of agreement with Ubi, and I consider that a long shot. They could sell the rights outright, but I don't think that any community based effort could come out with that kind of dough, although I wish it weren't so. The other would be some sort of legal "sharing" agreement under which any competing product based on Ubi's code would pay back a percentage of its revenue while Ubi would still be able to develop their own. That might work, but I don't know.

Assuming that some sort of agreement, I'm sure there are other possibilities, that wouldn't require millions of dollars from the enthusiast community, and we are that, could be reached, then I could easily see it happening.

Wild-eyed, wishful but not unrealistic idea follows:

If the Dogs of Subsim Software Gurus are allowed to be unleashed through some agreement with Ubi, we'd need some cash to get the project rolling. But if the developers would be willing to work for free and, let's face it, they are doing just that already, with the promise of a percentage of sales if their project comes to fruition, then the seed capital wouldn't necessarily amount to a huge number. If, further, to encourage even more "investors" to invest in our favorite type of sim, an agreement was reached to pay back the initial investment if and ONLY if a finished product were to show up, perhaps with a small 10% return on investment to acknowledge the risk in putting money into something that you don't know is going to ever amount to anything, then raising funds shouldn't be a problem.

If that were the case, if I were promised that I'd get $110 back on my initial $100 donation if and ONLY if the work resulted in an actual product that could be sold, no obligation to pay me back anything if it fizzled out, then I'd be seriously tempted. After all, worst case scenario I'd be out $100, and I've blown more serious money on less serious projects on too many occasions to count and I TRUST the SubSim programmers to put out good stuff and, best case scenario, I'd not only get the best WWII submarine simulator ever made, I'd get it for free with a nice $10 check on top of it.

Also, whereas I, after about a decade's worth of hoping in vain that Ubi would ever get this particular sim right have pretty much given up on ever seeing my "dream" WWII sub sim, this model would actually give me hope again and that would easily be worth a hundred measly bucks. It would probably be worth a lot more. I've spent much more than that on this franchise over the years, don't even get me started on what building a box that would run SHIII well cost me.

And then there is a much simpler model, if Ubi would be amenable to it: Clearly, they're never going to get it right. They're too busy throwing out endless clones of what sells while paying scant attention to niches like ours. I understand that completely. They're a corporation. They need to make the bottom line, and it doesn't make sense to throw a fortune into something that might barely break even when you can churn out another Assassin's Creed (which I love, by the way) in a matter of months that will make you millions.

But if a substantial number of SubSim programming geniuses, and we all know that we have an abundance of them without me needing to name names, were to say to Ubi: "Hey, we can do this right if you'll let us have the tools, and we'll do it on our own time as we're already doing provided that you'll reimburse necessary technical expenses only during development and, in return, when we're done, and only if we get done, we'll split the proceeds of the final product. If we get it wrong you won't be out much since you won't have to pay any salaries and you won't have to bother with deadlines, and if we get it RIGHT, we'll all be shoveling in the money with almost no layout."

If I were Ubi and owned an IP that I clearly didn't know what to do with as has been proven over the years, that'd be a win-win proposition. Almost no loss if it didn't work and a potential huge profit if it did, because it WOULD sell and, considering the tiny investment needed, only research and tool prices, the loss would be minimal if it failed.

Just spit-balling here.

Nor am I, but I think that as long as the purchase of the original is still required before you can play the modified version, you should be alright.

This is exactly what happened five years ago. Pacific Aces was a brilliant mod which brought an American Campaign to SH2. People were starting to talk about doing the same for SH3, but Ubisoft quietly requested that they not do that, as the upcoming SH4 was going to be about the American Pacific campaign. The modders respected Ubi's wishes and the proposed American mod for SH3 never happened.

Creating other u-boat types should be no problem legally, but doing it right will take a lot more time and effort than some people seem to realize. New exteriors, complete new interiors, crew placement and animations, adding the whole thing to the campaign. Not impossible, but extremely difficult and time-consuming.

Good point, Steve, but as you point out in the second paragraph, there is a grey area where modding an existing purchase reaches the point where it becomes hard for the IP owner to do anything further with their property along those same lines. If Ubi, for instance (I pray as everybody else here has been doing for years) decided that they'd make the ultimate WWII U-Boat sim with SH6, then it would be pointless for them to try if SH5, an existing product, had already been modded to the point where they'd be competing with themselves, so to speak.

Sure, to use that hypothetical Super Mod for SH5 you'd still have to purchase SH5, but the franchise would be dead for Ubi as far as future versions were concerned, and I completely understand why they would be opposed to that just the same way they were opposed to modding the Pacific into SH3. They've invested a lot of money in that IP, after all.

And bottom line, about adding the TypII to SH5 which is, after all, what this thread was originally about, I completely agree with you: I'm not a coder, but I'm sure it could be done, it's just that it's a much bigger task than I think a lot of people realize.

They should be glad they are off the hook with there shoddy finished game . The modders are the saviour of this game .

The original topic of this thread was whether we might one day expect a playable Type II boat. As one who would be thrilled to see a new type of boat a type II would be fine but more practical, I think, would be a Type IX.

I say this not because I have a personal preference but rather because the Type IX is used (in TRW) in all campaigns and is mandatory for historical accuracy in Trevally's and GAP's new Operation Monsun in OH II, a MOD many, if not most, would find it hard to live without. I, for one, am going through withdrawals as my current computer just doesn't doesn't have the horespower to cope with OHII even OHII light and I will have to wait for my new box so I can return to one of the best MODs available to us.

Just to let you know, i recently had the same problem of not being able to run OHII. Dont know if youve tried this but taking away TDW UI mod and replacing it with whatever else will let my computer run OHII. throwing it out there.

@misha1967
If do not talk to the laws of a purely human standpoint: for submitting any claims ubi should move ass. For the past two years have passed since ubi generally does not comment on the further development of sh5, does not provide any answers, no hints, and even circumstantial evidence that sh5 ever be fixed or will be released sh6. Here players are fit to wheel in a lawsuit against the ubi: the product is not finished, is full of errors, the money received from the players, but there is no action to remedy the defective product. That is, the rights of buyers actually violated and ubi got away with it. Members, instead of suits rolled up their sleeves and fix their own egregious shortcomings games. And if it's for and receive a claim from the ubi - it would be something. Law and Justice, it turns out different things? (when I took the exam for a driver's license, we have hinted, that you can take the exam in two ways: "the law" and "justly")

Thanks for the tip, Dance Commander, I'll give it as whirl though I'm not sure there's life after TDW's great UI MOD. I may have been using it for too long now to change.

------------------------------------------------------

TYP II ---SH4---SH5 !!:salute:

http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/9152/66895890.jpg


http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/6596/captureaa1.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/5908/captureabv.jpg


http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/9062/51791022.jpg

wonderful!!!:yeah::up:

Tomi 099, you work on it actually?