SUBSIM Radio Room Forums

SUBSIM Radio Room Forums (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/index.php)
-   General Topics (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/forumdisplay.php?f=175)
-   -   Global Nazi investigations rise for a second year (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=179038)

joea 01-13-11 09:22 AM

I'm all for no statute of limitations on crimes against humanity I do wish however as much time was spent on tracking more recent perpetrators of war crimes.

Feuer Frei! 01-13-11 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matador.es (Post 1573376)
If i may comment on this topic:


Source:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heinrich_Boere

A Dutch man who collaborated in '40 was sentenced to death in '49. He (Boere) escaped and went to Germany. There, he was granted a German citizen ship since he was (hardcore) Waffen-SS and there is a law in Germany they cannot be extradited.

Late 2009 the Dutch state initiated a trail to to manage extradition from the German government (Dep of justice), who refused. Lately a request has been made in the European Union to force Germany to extradite this Boere so the sentence can be executed.

The Netherlands do not have a death penalty, except during war time, which Boere received. Off course this sentence will not take effect when the extradition would take place (would not mind if it would happen though).

It is a bit harsh though that after so many years Germany still protects former war criminal by law. Although various German politicians have publicly disapproved the protection of Boere, the law is still in effect.:know:

The only thing you left out was that he was tried and sentenced to life in prison. By Germany.
I don't see how he was protected.

Freiwillige 01-13-11 09:36 AM

I'm all for rounding up the most evil deserving sob's and giving them justice but there is a point that it just starts to stink of a witch hunt. It happened, it was stopped, the leaders are dead and buried along with almost all the henchmen.

Its become to political really. Like trying to beat a dead horse to keep the story alive. I understand they don't want anybody to forget about the holocaust and that's understandable but its gotten so overwhelming that people tend to forget that there are plenty of other victims of that war as well. There are always victims of war.

Feuer Frei! 01-13-11 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Catfish (Post 1573360)
So i would not say that the finding and prosecuting of a few minor Nazis is really such a great accomplishment ? Wiesenthal center should know better.

Ivan Demjanjuk, Heinrich Boere... certainly not 'minor' Nazis, in fact in the top 10 wanted list.

Matador.es 01-13-11 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feuer Frei! (Post 1573388)
The only thing you left out was that he was tried and sentenced to life in prison. By Germany.
I don't see how he was protected.

since he is not in prison?

Quote:

The Provincial Court of Appeal in Cologne ruled on 7 July 2009, that Heinrich Boere was fit for trial, overturning the lower court's ruling.[7] Following a judicial review by the German Constitutional Court, the court decided not to accept Boere's appeal and ruled further that Boere was indeed fit to stand trial. However, according to the court he will be under medical supervision, being provided with a doctor for the length of the trial. The trial started on 28 October 2009, at Aachen's regional court.[8]
In 2009, Boere lived in an old-age home in his birth town of Eschweiler, Germany.[5] He was not taken into custody for the trial against him. In an interview with Der Spiegel, he said, "I'm not interested in what happened back then."[9] In a documentary by Dutch journalists Rob van Olm and Jan Louter, who were the first to bring Boere to the attention of the public, Boere did admit to some feeling of remorse and states he has confessed his crimes to a priest, and has prayed for his victims. On 23 March 2010 in Aachen, Germany, he was sentenced to life in prison. His defence, that he would have been shot had he disobeyed orders (sometimes known as the 'Nuremberg Defense'), was rejected. Following the ruling of the court, his solicitors announced that they would appeal the judgment.[10] {Source:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heinrich_Boere}
Above all, its kind of late, 2009 since '49.

Feuer Frei! 01-13-11 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matador.es (Post 1573396)
since he is not in prison?

I don't understand?
Quote:

On 23 March 2010 in Aachen, Germany, he was sentenced to life in prison.
Quote:

Above all, its kind of late, 2009 since '49.
Yes, perhaps, your post just came across a little 'anti-German' is all, in the view that they were unwilling to deport, ie unwilling to trie and sentence...
i think i took your original post slightly wrong :yep:

Catfish 01-13-11 09:57 AM

It seems most of the Nazi went to the USA, and South America. In Germany and Europe the minor ones were prosecuted and often killed, the higher "rest" was used against communism.

A german peasant was pulling beetroots out of the ground, when a US soldier came along and asked him what he did.
He said "De-Nazification, i pull out the small ones so the others grow bigger".

Only that - as the links i put in in the post above - the US and general "the west" took advantage and supported those Nazis against the eastern threat. Operation Gladio and its members were strictly recruiting right-wing anti-communism people, like Nazis.

O.T.:
Now that the external threats are mostly gone, they have to make up a threat to justify their existence and it seems they perform acts of internal state terrorism. Some of the bombing assassinations seem to be initiated by Gladio, and similar agencies in the US.

Greetings,
Catfish

Matador.es 01-13-11 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feuer Frei! (Post 1573400)
I don't understand?
Yes, perhaps, your post just came across a little 'anti-German' is all, in the view that they were unwilling to deport, ie unwilling to trie and sentence...
i think i took your original post slightly wrong :yep:

I am sorry for "appearing anti-German", in case i did; that is not what I intend to be. But, please do not take this as an offence, but I do still get "mad" and yes, I am anti Nazi, when we talk about ppl like Boere.

But my "anti-Nazi" should not be (mis)interpreted as anti-German, not at all.

My first post was just about giving a practical example for things already mentioned before by others like Vendor and Catfish in particular.

And this is an open question since I can’t find any source confirming my recollection; is he also jailed according to his sentence?

Skybird 01-13-11 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matador.es (Post 1573434)
And this is an open question since I can’t find any source confirming my recollection; is he also jailed according to his sentence?

There do not seem to be any media entries about him after the sentence from March 2010, when he got life. He was in a wheelchair back then, and of high age, and ill. He said back then that he did not care much about the sentence, for he were so old now that all he waited for was death. I assume he is in prison, but in the hospital wing.

He confessed guilty on the charges. He also said - no matter what it is worth and whether he was honest or not - that he regretted what he did, that he wished he had not done it, and that back then him any many others honestly believed they were doing the right thing, while now he knew that he obviously did not.

His defender said that after 66 years a person hardly still is the same person it has been back then. Some Nazi criminals denied their guilt and demonstrated a mental inability to realise the evilness of what they had done. At least at the end of his life, Boere refused to do that, and instead confessed guilty. For whatever it is worth.

Skybird 01-13-11 11:43 AM

Oh-oh, I was wrong. News from August last year:

http://www.da****radio.de/nachrichte...-boere-prozess

replace **** with s h i t (das Hit Radio).

His lawyer has appealed against the German court sentence, on basis of European laws that prohibit that you get called to court twice for the same crime. In 1949 Boerne was sentenced by a court in Netherlands for the same crime, the assassination of three civilians. He did not go to prison back then, obviously, but his lawyer argues that he could not be charged twice for the same crime he had been sentenced for before.

Sounds like a dipsute about formal things. Don'T know what has come of this. The lawyer claimed the same already in March at the German court, but the court rejected to follow his argument.

Skybird 01-13-11 11:46 AM

Ah, here it is, the appeal was denied in Decembre last year by the 2nd senate of the German Federal Court:

http://www.antenne-ac.de/005453-fall...rueck-gewiesen

And no, he is not in prison or hospital (Decembre) but still is in an old people's home. There seems to have been a scandal about two Dutch journalists having filmed him there with hidden camera, and who then got into troubles over hanving done that.

http://www.focus.de/politik/deutschl...id_584560.html
(from 24.12.2010)

Also, forget what I said about him having regretted his deeds. It seems to have been a manouver only, by this latest link.

So kann man sich irren.

Matador.es 01-13-11 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird (Post 1573482)
....In 1949 Boerne was sentenced by a court in Netherlands for the same crime, the assassination of three civilians. He did not go to prison back then,.....

He was not sentenced for life nor prison, but for death in '49


Anyway, we have been talking and thinking longer about his trail then he ever did about his killings. So better turn it around :o

Also some i like to share, like he said himself, he is so old that the only thing he does is waiting to die, so it does not matter to him if he get imprisoned....

That is quite a thing, it would have been different if he would have been in jail in '49 till now. So he is completely right, the penalty is not hard enough.


PS yes, its easy to get confused

August 01-13-11 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Catfish (Post 1573360)
and enforced by the US Green Berets.

I think you might might have your sources mixed up Catfish, as the US Green Berets do not handle law enforcement or any other type of police work. Their function is to train foreign military and insurgent troops to fight wars.

Gerald 01-13-11 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by August (Post 1573501)
I think you might might have your sources mixed up Catfish, as the US Green Berets do not handle law enforcement or any other type of police work. Their function is to train foreign military and insurgent troops to fight wars.

I could not have expressed myself better than you!

Takeda Shingen 01-13-11 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by August (Post 1573501)
I think you might might have your sources mixed up Catfish, as the US Green Berets do not handle law enforcement or any other type of police work. Their function is to train foreign military and insurgent troops to fight wars.

I swear that I could remember you having been a Green Beret. Am I mixed up on that?


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:27 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 1995- 2025 Subsim®
"Subsim" is a registered trademark, all rights reserved.