SUBSIM Radio Room Forums - Harbour Raiding

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- - Harbour Raiding (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=152502)

I don't do it for the simple reason that the game makes it too easy and it wasn't done in real life. Well, once, of course, but that was the only one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torplexed (Post 1113783)

That's because most simulations have no strategic sense, just a tactical one. The AI doesn't care that it's losing a tanker every three weeks, because all it's prior cargo and warship losses are constantly being regenerated every time you start a new patrol. If the AI had only a finite pool of warships and cargo vessels and was programmed to worry about long-term losses, the game sure would play more realistic.

That was one of the things we discussed in Houston with Dan. While talking about a truly dynamic campaign we were arguing how much influence one submarine could have on the outcome of the war, when someone suggested that it would be nice if once you caused enough havock for the enemy they started rerouting convoys away from your area and started actively looking for you. Dan said he would look into the feasibility of doing that in "some future unnamed subsim".

Proper AI response to individual attacks and to ongoing warmaking is one of the main things still lacking in the game.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve (Post 1115941)

I don't do it for the simple reason that the game makes it too easy and it wasn't done in real life. Well, once, of course, but that was the only one.

:timeout: Could it be!? Sailor "Walking Naval Encylopedia" Steve is wrong!? :03:

Prien wasn't the only harbor raider. Albrect Achilles in U-161 raided Port of Spain in 1942:

http://books.google.com/books?id=YOO...+of+spain+raid

On a Dare, Balz went into Southampton. Didn't see any worthy targets, took pictures and left undetected. (GWX 2.1).

Quote:

Originally Posted by mookiemookie (Post 1116335)

:timeout: Could it be!? Sailor "Walking Naval Encylopedia" Steve is wrong!? :03:

More often than you may think.

Quote:

Prien wasn't the only harbor raider. Albrect Achilles in U-161 raided Port of Spain in 1942:

http://books.google.com/books?id=YOO...+of+spain+raid

Good find. But the principle still stands. Going into an unprotected Caribbean port is not what people are talking about in these threads. Loch Ewe gets mentioned a lot.

With 100% realism, the only harbor I dare to attack are islands with lots of deep water around. St Helena, comes to mind, You can usually find a light cruiser and a large tanker there. The other ones I can think of right now will be the two little islands off Sicily. After the capture by the allies, there are some troop ships there (that ware GWX2.1, don't know if GWX3.0 keep it).

I find attacking a major fleet port, such as lock Ewe or Gibraltar quite unrealistic. Especially Lock Ewe, If suppose a uboat did sneak into the harbor and sink a ship, round the clock air-patrol and aggressive surface search it will be impossible for it to get out the Hebrides. But then this is a game, a lot of things are pretty unrealistic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by fisherstoys1 (Post 1113330)

How many people here have taken to harbour raids to make things more interesting??

In the Medd. I got tons of warships this way, many were cruisers. In one campaign I got 12 cruisers alone.

Grant

See my poll earlier on this very subject.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=145990

I agree with you that there are plenty of actions away from harbor raids. On this patrol I got 7 carriers. That is much more fun than any harbor raid.

CAPTAIN'S LOG

Date and Time
Grid
Occurrences
05 Sep 1943 0235 Patrol 39
U-161, 2nd Flotilla
Left at: September 5, 1943, 02:35
From: Lorient
Mission Orders: Patrol grid ED39

28 Sep 1943

1216 ED 12 Ship sunk! M/V Eutaw Springs (Modern Tanker), 9018 tons
1216 ED 12 Ship sunk! M/V Royal Oak (Modern Tanker), 9016 tons
1220 ED 12 Ship sunk! S.S. Trego (Medium Tanker), 8701 tons
1253 ED 12 Ship sunk! S.S. Fenris (Medium Tanker), 8327 tons

04 Oct 1943

0018 DM 52 Ship sunk! S.S. Jean Jadot (Great Lakes Freighter), 1788 tons
1746 DM 52 Ship sunk! S.S. Merkur (Intermediate Tanker), 3490 tons

11 Oct 1943

1044 DB 95 Ship sunk! USS Franklin (Essex class), 27100 tons

12 Oct 1943

0219 DB 95 Ship sunk! S.S. Suderoy (Whale Factory Ship), 12016 tons
1759 DB 92 Ship sunk! S.S. Atlantic City (Intermediate Tanker), 3491 tons

14 Oct 1943

0935 DB 98 Ship sunk! USS Lexington (Essex class), 27100 tons

26 Oct 1943

0512 CC 11 Ship sunk! HMS Attacker (Bogue class), 15390 tons

27 Oct 1943

1450 BB 94 Ship sunk! HMS Tracker (Bogue class), 15390 tons
2017 BB 91 Ship sunk! USS Kalinin Bay (Casablanca class), 10400 tons

29 Oct 1943

1132 BB 91 Ship sunk! USS Breton (Bogue class), 15390 tons

01 Nov 1943

0058 BB 95 Ship sunk! USS Copahee (Bogue class), 15390 tons

13 Nov 1943 1449 Patrol results
Crew losses: 0
Ships sunk: 15
Aircraft destroyed: 0
Patrol tonnage: 182007 tons

BACK

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torplexed (Post 1113783)

(snip)The AI doesn't care that it's losing a tanker every three weeks, because all it's prior cargo and warship losses are constantly being regenerated every time you start a new patrol. (snip)

And that, ladies and gentlemen, is why humanity will always lose a war of attrition against a mechanical foe. Just ask the Connors.