Beep.
-you have selected gov't bail-out. If you are a spouse/contractor of a democratic senator please press 1. If you need this en espanyol, emprimo numero 9.

Standing ovation for you Mothballs. Well said. I would only like to add that we do need to search for the cause only to learn from it. People need to take responsibility for themselves, and push for accountability for all. I was going to add more, but I think you sufficiently covered the main stuff Mothballs. :up:

And it looks like you may be on your way to Skybird's sh**list as well. Congratulations. That happens when you threaten his sense of self-aggrandizing. Enjoy.

It's always "America's fault" when things go wrong in other countries... :roll:

Have to agree here. I can't see why it's America's fault German firms bought into American funds/securities. They looked good to American traders as well.

PD

Not self-induced - US-induced. The finaical crisis that has kicked global economy into recession, that has made international stockmarkets loosing 35 trillion in the past 6 months, and will kill several million jobs over 2008 and 2009, is made in America, by an America-wanted model that sold financial products around the globe that were invented by american banks, which America prevented from and defended against closer rules that would have helped to safeguard the abuse of them through gamblers and casiono-players, and that America still wants to be protected against closer rules that would prevent them to do what they did in the past. and as the parallel thread I started yesterday shows, these people already have started again to abuse the saystem, and to abuse the finacial aids, and obviously have not learned anything, and do not intend to turn things for th ebetter whule their market is left to this holy cow named "self-regulation", a fetish for america. This all proves just one thing: the market DOEs NOT regulate itself, america does not want to prevent the abuse of the system, and it does not mind to have triggered the worst crisis since the great depression, and does not care for having led the basis for this in the years before by excessive spenidng and wasting more money than it can afford, and turning into the greatest debtor known in history.

But it'S always the others fault. America is holy, and does only good. Yeah. Sure. It'S so great a nation in all the damage it has imposed onto others, the world necessarily must be "jeaulous", and where we criticise america for it'S ways, we are just greedy and evil.

Whom do you - and others - deceive here? Me? Or yourself?

A bit of a premature judgment, IMO Sky. We'll know for certain in 12-20 years IMO. Excess is just becoming a matter of public attention. Subsim is a bit of a skewed place for casting judgment on a whole country. IMO, America really starts to shine when the boot is stepping on her throat. Everything before that is politics. Which I suppose is embodied in that Churchill quote.

PD

Once again, we were in a boom, and a very strong one. Unemployment was on a record-low, exports boosting, there was more work than we had skilled workers. Not even the high oil price was able to kill the boom, just slowed it a bit. And then came Wall Street. mortage crisis. Credit crush, picking away at the exports. Voilá, there we are in the deepest recession since the founding of Germany. thanks, but no thanks.

And it is not just Germany. It is all the globe America has pulled with itself into the abyss.

Yes, it has been America'S fault this time, beyond any doubt, known since years. And we - especially Germany - told you so since three years, and warned for the need of safeguarding agaisnt it by reducing the freedom for abuse and casino-gambiling by those that were protected by Washington - and still are - and then, surprise-surprise, did what they were to be expected, and ruined the show for all. The deeply unhealthy financial policy of America, its enormous defict, its enormous trade disbaöance, its enormous dependency on foreign finacial drips since it live totally and completely beyond its means - all this has caused the mess we now are in, and still we here america's model is well, and the greatest, and regulations serving as safeties shall not be added to it to correct at least the worse flaws and faults in the system.

You have no right to be in a huff. But we have all legitimate reason and right there is to be very angry with you. and even now, while the drama starts to unfold in all its glory (so far we have had the overture only), America seem to be too stubborn to learn and to reflect about itself and to see that the old ways can no longer be seen as valid ways again. the same business practices that led to the first credit crunch, now are unfolding a new phase of suprime crisis, right now. That is what your laissez-faire leads to, and your self-regulating market: the got away with it the first time, so now they do it again. If they were successful with betraying the community and absuing the flaws of the system - why should they give up such personally lucrative practices, if no rules and supervision is hindering them?

Yes indeed, Neral, this time it is America's fault, and that'S why I - and many others! - pojnt finger at you in anger, becasue not only did you damage yourself - you also caused massive damage to us, damage for which we are not responisble, but you and you alone.
your great fantastic business model encourages human faults and flaws taking advantage by abusing the holes in your system. It triggers them, and produces them. And you stubbornly defend against closing these holes, and called that repair a "planned economy". The simple truth is: your system failed, and very costly.

12-20 years for what? And I am talklijg about the economic basis of your country only, not the whoole country like culture, mentality, science, arts. But economically, it is a mess, and causes havoc in others as well. Just think of this economic cancer used as a weapopn, called hedge fonts. Even minimal supervision for these had been repelled by Washington, and so they move on, ruining healthy companies, and leave them behind as hulls with high debts and all blood sucked out. Hedge fonts should not be reglated - they should be forbidden since they villate every reason andaegument for healthy economics. Destroying healthy parts of economy is not in the interest of anyone except those gamblers hoping to mkae a profit by killing a company and rob the dead or too-weak-to-resist corpus.

Fate may have mercy with us if chruchill was right. That american strategy he describes may easily prove to be too costly for us, our civilisation, and our planet.why always waiting for destater having taking place, and then repairing and clenaing up? why not trying to safeguard against it in advance, to prevent it? does one always need to die first - just to accept that one had been in danger to one's life?

A national conscious to emerge on the issue of market regulation. It hasn't even been considered by more than a handful of people until recently.

And if you think hedge funds are bad, credit default swaps are several times more vile.

Our (bloated) financial system funds our (and the world's, to a degree) economy. Everybody was holding crappy assets, and got caught. Only a few people realized how bad it was, and all these people held off on that realization in the interest of profit. You can only fudge your P&L for so long.

PD

P&L? What'S that?

Because a few people get far too rich off it before everybody else gets pissed off. And it may well take another major war to sort out.

The American populace is certainly not the only one in the world to be overly complacent. What makes us unique is that we are one of a few (realistically, the only one in a conventional war) that presently has the power to change the world through force.

PD

Sorry, I was referring to a company's profit and loss sheet.

http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-pr...-statement.htm

PD

Yeah, right :rotfl:

Yes Neal, simply this: right. You have no reason to laugh at all.

If the German members here are an accurate representation of the average German voter, then the German education system has much to answer for.

To be an arrogant race is one thing, but to be stupid and arrogant is dangerous and leads to the kind of nonsense posted in this thread.

I'm sure there are other Forums better suited to your gifts, Skybird, and where the intellect level might be low enough for people to buy into your BS.

Do us all a favor and try one.