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Quote:

Originally Posted by DeepIron

http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/02/04/f...ics/index.html

The ACLU's Steinhardt doesn't believe it will stop there.
"This had started out being a program to track or identify criminals," he said. "Now we're talking about large swaths of the population -- workers, volunteers in youth programs. Eventually, it's going to be everybody."

I hate the premise that I will feel safer because of this. Heck, the US can't even stop uneducated illegals from entering the country...

What??? Against it? Why, you liberal fools!
Don't you know that BIG GOVERNMENT knows what's best for you?

How dare you question this proposal!!!

<(aiming directly at the mike)> Why, I fully endorse this idea, and in fact, Bush, and his administration, should be kept on for 8 more years to ensure that this project is completed. Screw privacy! That'll keep us safe from terrorists.

Anyone who doesn't see 1984 fizzing up like a coke bottle with a mento in it isn't paying attention. :o

Quote:

Originally Posted by August

So from that Franklin quote you must also oppose having a military or police force right? I mean how dare they risk your essential liberty by providing temporary security from terrorists, criminals, fascists and axis hordes. That's the problem with general quotes like that. They are way too vague to be directly applied to specific situations and therefore easily countered.

Actually, most of the Founders were against having a military. Over the years they've been proven wrong, and ours is subject to civilian oversight. Not really making a point, just mentioning it.

Quote:

Again, tell me what specific problems I will have if the Feds have my fingerprints and retina map on file. If you want to persuade, not just me, but the rest of your fellow citizens, that this is something we should oppose then provide concrete and realistic examples to illustrate why this is such a bad thing. If you just stick to non specific quotes from long dead sages and undefined threats you will loose the argument, which if what you say is true that is a bad thing for us all.

And now for something completely different: as much as I'm opposed to any kind of government intrusion, I tend to agree with you on this. So far I've seen no argument made concerning palm-prints and retina-scans that couldn't be applied to fingerprints as well. My opinion isn't completely formed, but I fail to see how this could be applied to references to 1984 or even privacy invasions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

That's my problem in a nutshell Steve. I agree in spirit but it's difficult to argue against something when I can't point out the downside except in the most general terms.