I liked the crew management system.

If they took the best parts of SH3 (with GWX) and SH4... man would that be a sweet game! :)

I also give SH4 a thumbs up on the crew management. It's neatly done, imo.

I had problems completing the patrol assignment until I downloaded the Flavor to Taste mod. Now I only need to be within roughly 50-100nm of the star I've met the patrol area requirements.

If you feel like continuing on with your missions but are out of ammo, go to a viable harbor/base(Designated with a blue anchor on your nav map) and refit. This reloads you up with everything and fixes damage. If you already knew this, my bad.

I do not have this Sim,and this is the first Naval Sim released since the Comodore times I have not bought but for me that Ubisoft is completely disregarding the possibility of having decent Multiplayer combats that is Subs vs escorts and give this ridiculous "Board like" game for destroyers to fight subs was the final drop.
if they think the sales are not enough they must think why a lot of people that bought SH2/DC saga started to lose interest with SH III and have not even bought SHIV

When we had real MP combats between escorts and subs the comunity was alive, we had fleets, tournaments, online activity.

SHIII Multiplayer was pathetic and SHIV MP is an offence.

I have been supporting and buying Naval games including supporting with donations Projekt Messerwetzer and other Subsim projects.

Ubisoft is not listening, not even supporting properly the customers that bought this basically handicaped single player game by not even fixing the bugs. :down:
I feel sad having made this post and I feel sad by not having a good naval sim to have interesting and exciting Naval Combats like the ones we had on the past playing SHII vs DC.
You cannot expect have succesful sales in 2007 relasing a sim with not a good MP capability.
Do not blame that the Naval market is small. The Naval "market" is enthusiastic, loyal and commited to a sim provided you listen to the comunity.

SH2 and DC were deeply flawed games mate, plus they are making a 1.3 patch.

Of course they were bugged games, this is why we had to make the mods, but besides this we had COUNTLESS hours of Multiplayer gamming human vs human. Fleet Tournament, Subsim Tournaments....................................... .....
No AI can match human behaviour on MP game.
SH IV has great graphics but this is all, have same or more bugs than SHII and DC at their release and no MP possibilities.
Of course if you just enjoy sinking dumb escorts and harmless merchies that would be just fine but if you like some realism... well..... sorry
it still does not fill my expectations

My multiplayer experience with SH2 & DC consisted of this:

Destroyer swerving, sub staying a periscope depth the whole time and just shooting torps at the oncoming destroyer at point blank range. :roll:

The only time it didn't was when I dove and tried to evade. That was pretty fun but I never saw anyone else doing it in a sub. Bleh.

Just to let everyone know my first two photo reckons went well, I hope the boss did not throw a fit after my snap shop of a passenger ship I sunk it.

While I am on the subject do you pick up extra renown for more pictures of other ships in port?

I disagree, but only because lack of a real career mode was the worst bug of all and can never be fixed. I remember two years ago when at least one member claimed that SH3 was just as bad as SH2. I gave him the same answer.

So no Career mode, no real MP (I would not call the avalaible MP a real MP combat)
What does this game have better other than graphics which is normal considereing how the graphic engines have changed the last years?

I welcome any Naval sim Steve, but I think it is a pity they are neglecting such basic things on new games. Must be some kind of marketing, but this marketing is not making many of us happy.
Now imagine this game, this very one, with a true and realistic career mode and a Multiplayer possibility versus a destroyer Command counterpart.
Imagine the possibilities.
I am not asking for something that have not already been done on the past.

I can imagine the possibilites but you have to imagine what the market is looking for as a whole. I'm thinking the market is looking for a zoom around blast them up game. Which in part SH4 is. I would say as a whole, the market is not looking for hardcore type simulations with all fronts represented. They are looking for the Sims, Warhammer online type games. This is how it looks to me at the moment.

What does this game have other than graphics? Playability and immersivness if you let it. I always felt it took some imagination to play any of the SH series. This one is no different. I also believe it is best played as single player and not MP. The action is much to slow as compared to say IL2 MP. IMHO.

I agree with you on most points, this is a marketing decision. The swifted the target marekt. Before such sims were intended to the hardcore comunity and adding a entry level to allow new people to get the ropes of the "naval warfare".
Now they prefer to aim for a more "general" market using more candy eyes stuff.
Well whatever the reason they have lost me as customer because I am not buying SH IV the way it is now.

And lets be honnest, SP on the Pacific is not really a challenge.
Japanese escorts did not had a decente radar if they even had any and their sonar suits suck. While the british had airplanes with radar the Japanese had not..........On real life US subs had the upper hand all the time above the Japanese Navy. Now translate this to AI escorts.

If the Allied AI escorts in SHIII that were supposed to be the best ASW platforms of the moment with the latest ASW stuff can be confortably deal with, I wonder how you do not find boring SP in the Pacific warfare.
Of course I understand our US colleagues that have the joy of driving a US boat instad a German one. but I guess they miss a real good Career mode as well.

Some people think normal to come from a patrol having sunk 25 ships, bus since I am not of this kind,I was looking forward for a good MP capability where human player can level off.
Graphic and cinematics are good and welcomed but on my case that was not enough.

Maybe I may look like the guy just bitching the "beloved sim" and giving nothing possitive but I just say that such a leading software company as Ubisoft that had previous experience on SHII vs DC should had not neglected this "extra" option.

Anyway and honnestly I wish you guys have a good time with this SP sim and the sales are good enough to make the next of the saga include a sub vs surface real MP (Although they promised the same by SHIII)

I do not agree that before such sims were created for the hardcore but have changed over time to simplfy it for a larger market. Janes WWII Combat, CFS1,2,3, IL2, all have simplfied modes for those that want to learn it. The SH series have simple modes and more simulation like modes. It is unfortunate however that we can not have an option for kick butt AI. Just options for submarine to make it more simulation like. There is a bit more than eye candy and I would dare say if you have not purchased the game and played, I have to take your view on it with a grain of salt. It would be best to delve into the game for a better assessment of it. There is a mix of great DD and bad DD. The great DD you encounter drop DC with precision. It is a nice mixed bag but you should encounter more great DD IMHO.


Sure, the Japanese were far behind with radar/sonar development but the ASW vessels did not all suck. Ask the 52 subs on eternal patrol. Yes, the US subs had the upper hand for sure, you asked to translate this to he AI escort, I believe they have then at this juncture. The US subs in the game have the upper hand.


I'm not certain how you surmise that that the AI DD in SH3 are comfortable to deal with unless you are playing the vanilla version of the game. All the major mods dealt with that issue and all created nasty DD and very effective DD. When GWX showed up for SH3, there was riot over the very good DD to the point a thread was started and stickied so people could figure out how to handle them. The GWX guys were quite clever with their adjustment to the AI. The DD reaction was dead on. It was years in the making of the excellent major mods, SH4 is a babe in the woods, give it time and all the guys who dig making mods will handle SH4 in such the same way. Study the Pacific, read about it, translate it into the game.



Some people do believe sinking 25 vessels is normal only because they have not read the history of the subs. These are the people that the marketers target because there are more of them as paying customers who like to speed around the oceans blasting everything in sight. This is a great time for them and the explosions are great, tonnage out the wazoo, more renown and upgrades!!! Fun times and this is how they like to play it. These are also the folks that like to buy grand theft auto. Then there is you and I that prefer the realism and more realistic tonnage, AI reaction, hardcore. Currently, like the other in this series, we wait for the modders to do their work for the love of realism.



You are entitled to your opinion of the game but in all honesty, without playing it, your assessment is a bit biased as a result. The only thing I see negelected here is the fact that the game was released in the unfinished state. UBI has listened and implemented features that players asked for with SH3. We asked for better crew management, it was done, for example. I no longer spend time juggling crew. Better, more realistic damage control, UBI listened and created one but it needs a fix...basically a hull % damage displayed and fix the cannon/AA that does not seem to get repaired. I like the damage control configuration now, furthermore, the damage repair time is more realistic.




Well, hey, thanks....I'm having a ball with the game in the vanilla version! I'm not betting on the next saga so I'm putting my efforts into SH4. As far as MP, this game has it but as a result of rushed sales, the time was not put into it. Such is life. As I stated above, my thinking is submarine MP just takes so much time and does not lend itself to fun filled action as say a flight sim of fighter aircraft. IMHO, sub sims are single player and require a good imagination for great game play. BTW, if you are wanting to have the next saga and sales are good enough for it to be considered, go out and buy the game. Be a part of the solution.