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-   -   US Sub loses in WW II (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=105116)

dean_acheson 02-05-07 04:17 PM

CCIP,
Yes, I probably should have stated that, even though the Germans maintained a certain air presence over the Bay of Biscay at times.
While I doubt modeled in the game, U.S. boat had to, at all times, be very weary of 'friendly fire.' Reading some of these first hand books and patrol reports on the Pacific war, it strike me that the U.S. boats had many many close calls from friendly forces.

dean_acheson 02-05-07 04:18 PM

Steve, I should have said "U-Boats." (Even though I didn't know the story about the DDs...)

Sailor Steve 02-05-07 04:21 PM

Oh, I knew you meant subs, I was just pointing out that everybody had their occassional mix-up.

Torplexed 02-05-07 09:01 PM

U-557 was rammed and sunk by an Italian patrol boat which mistook her for a British submarine in the Med. Only incident I can think of offhand.

NEON DEON 02-05-07 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by I-25
3 US subs lost to enemy subs?

well i know the corvina (#23 on the list) was sunk by the I-176, i read the whole debacle from the japanese side of the war in the book I boat capitan but the other 2?

I just want to stress once again that these are estimates. That is why the method of how these subs met their end is sometimes followed by a “ ? ”.

As far as the other two US boats being sunk by enemy subs goes here is a bit more on how the estimate was given.

47) Kete: 03/20 to 04/16/1945 Presumed lost on patrol east of Nansi Shoto chain (sub?).

Navper statement:

“There were a few mine-lines in the Nansei Shoto Chain, but since KETE was already east of the islands at the time of her last message on 20 March and was heading home, loss through a mine is considered highly improbable. It is now known that a number of enemy submarines were in the area through which KETE was required to pass enroute to Midway. RO-41 was sunk east of Okinawa by a U.S. destroyer on 31 March 1945, and two other Japanese submarines were sunk southeast of Okinawa near this date. Conditions attendant to KETE's loss suggest the likehood that one of these submarines might have torpedoed and sunk her and been unable to report the attack before being sunk.”

49) Snook: 04/08 to 05/16/1945 Presumed lost on patrol near Nansi Shoto chain (sub?).

Navper statement:

“A number of enemy submarine contacts were reported in the vicinity of SNOOK's lifeguard station during the period in which her loss occurred. During April and May 1945, five Japanese submarines were sunk in the Nani;ei Shoto chain. The circumstances surrounding SNOOK's lose suggest the possibility that one of these lost submarines may have torpedoed her while she was surfaced during her lifeguard duties and it was not reported. It is known that such tactics were suggested to Japanese submarine commanders by their superiors.”

Tigrone 02-06-07 01:31 AM

The Lifeguard League
 
This was not a safe thing to do. Going close in and beating the enemy to downed pilots was one of the most dangerous duties of the war for submariners. 86 Submarines rescued more than 500 downed aviators from 1943 to 1945 including the first President Bush, who was then the youngest carrier pilot in the US Navy at age 18 (Grumman TBF). My father was picked up by Tigrone, close inshore, in May 1945. That was the trip Trigone broke the record for most rescues. Tigrone put in at Iwo to dump the Zoomies. Some of the pilots picked up by Tigrone were Australians, RAAF, who were flying P-51s off Iwo in support of B-29s over Japan.
http://www.submarinebooks.com/ZoomiesSubs1.jpg

NEON DEON 02-06-07 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCIP
Quote:

Originally Posted by dean_acheson
I don't think the Germans lost any boats to 'friendly fire,' unlike the fleet boats. Of course, I could be wrong about this, I just don't remember any U-Boats being sunk by a German DD or a JU-88....

In part, of course, because unlike the Americans, Germany had virtually nil air/surface presence in the theater. I really don't recall any incidents of this sort that I've read of.

There was one U-boat, U-222, which sunk with almost no survivors after being accidentally rammed by another U-boat
http://uboat.net/boats/u222.htm

U-99

"The boat, while inbound to Bergen with a sick crewman, sailed into the path of the German battlecruiser Scharnhorst and its scout plane mistook the boat for a British submarine attacking it causing damages that forced the boat back to Germany for repairs"

Looks like everyone was a bit jumpy when it came to submarines.;)

TheSatyr 02-08-07 05:04 AM

You know the old saying."The only good submarine is a dead submarine"

I-25 02-08-07 11:06 AM

Ro-41 got sunk on the 23rd not 31st.
but i still dont quite think jap subs got the snook and the kete...;)

Quote:

22 March 1945:
320 miles E of Okinawa. LtCdr Honda reports sighting an enemy destroyer. It is the last message received from RO-41.

SE of Okinawa. That same day, Honda attempts to attack units of Vice Admiral (later Admiral) Marc A. Mitscher's (former CO of HORNET, CV-8) fast carrier Task Force 58.
LtCdr V. J. Soballe's USS HAGGARD (DD-555) is acting as a picket 12 miles ahead of the formation. At 2342, a contact is detected by radar on the surface at 25,000 yards. HAGGARD and UHLMANN (DD-687) are detached to investigate. The contact disappears but HAGGARD acquires the target by sonar and drops depth charges. Just before midnight, a submarine broaches off HAGGARD's port beam. As the destroyer's 40-mm. AA rakes the submarine's conning tower, LtCdr Soballe goes hard left rudder and rams the sub's starboard side abaft the conning tower.
23 March 1945:
After midnight, the submarine - probably RO-41 - sinks by the stern with all 82 hands at 22.57N, 132.19E.**
read more here http://www.combinedfleet.com/RO-41.htm

you guys sould really read the book I-boat capitan.

NEON DEON 02-09-07 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by I-25
you guys sould really read the book I-boat capitan.


I-25, where did you get your copy?

I would like to get a view from the other side.


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