Quote:
Originally Posted by Fahnenbohn
(Post 2372872)
This is the international law that made consensus at the time.
|
The Kellogg-Briand pact of 1928 which was signed by Germany states that nations should not use war to solve "disputes or conflicts of whatever nature or of whatever origin they may be, which may arise among them."
Now, we've danced around causes and effects in this topic, but the ultimate question "Who started World War II" boils down to who fired the shots, because until the actual outbreak of hostilities it cannot be classed as a war. If you wish to cite the invasion of Poland as the beginning of WWII, then I think we can all agree on the fact that Germany fired on Poland first. Poland did not invade Germany, nor, despite the best attempts of Goebbels, did Polish soldiers attack a German radio station.
At the point in which Germany invaded Poland it was not under threat of invasion from any other nation. Britain and France were hostile after being shown up by Hitler disregarding the Munich Agreements, but both were in a defensive stance rather than offensive. Poland was decided as the red line, if Hitler had not crossed that red line, then Britain and France would not have declared war. In fact, if Hitler had shown a bit more diplomatic acumen, he could have easily have drawn Britain and France into an anti-Soviet alliance. However he was too busy enlarging the German Reich to focus on diplomatic overtures, and resorted to force rather than diplomacy. So ultimately we wound up on the side of the Soviets against Hitler, even though we'd already fought the Soviets once already and up until the remilitarisation of the Rhineland...in fact up until the invasion of Czechoslovakia, Britain and France, Britain especially, saw the Soviet Union as the much greater threat to European peace. Both were desperate to avoid another great war, they wouldn't have thrown Czechoslovakia under the bus if they hadn't have been, but really Hitler pushed his luck too far and too fast. The rest is history.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joefour
(Post 2372883)
Speaking as an American, my country should have stayed the hell out of it. But there were many Americans who had the same view that FDR threw in jail. For one, Lindbergh would have ended up behind bars if he were not so beloved by the American public.
You may not know it, but FDR had evil designs on YOUR empire and played Winnie like an old violin.
|
Staying out of the war really wasn't an option for America, especially after Germany declared war on the Soviet Union. Because after that point one of two things was going to happen, either Germany would win, gain the massive land and manpower, then turn its sights on overthrowing America as a dominant power, or the Soviet Union would win and steamroller through the whole of Europe. Either which way America would have lost the foothold in Europe that gave it the power needed to rival the Soviet Union in the Cold War. Eventually the war would have come to Americas shores, and the enemy would have been twice as powerful as the ones America has faced before.
America wouldn't have been occupied, or any thing like 'The Man in the High Castle', but it would have been humiliated, and perhaps forced into disarmament and reparations.
So yeah, staying out was not really an option. Oh, and about FDR screwing us over, we were already screwed, between being screwed by Hitler or being screwed by FDR, it's better the screwing you know. :woot:
