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-   SHIII Mods Workshop (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/forumdisplay.php?f=195)
-   -   Realism- and gameplay-related hardcode fixes for SH3.EXE (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=174225)

PapaKilo 09-29-11 02:12 PM
[QUOTE=Stiebler;1757833However, it is true that, once the convoy is detected, it needs only a sighting of a single ship of the convoy for the convoy to be 'recognised'.

Stiebler.[/QUOTE]

This might be right on the other hand.. Never tried to send a report while sighting only 1 ship out of all bloody convoy, since they were too far from home base anyway to call an air strike :hmmm:

rik007 09-29-11 02:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PapaKilo (Post 1757530)
From what I understand reading about how far is the horizon by altitude:

1.7 meters above ground - 4.7 km

100 meters above ground 36 km

Theoretically dstance till horizon in plain surface is somewhat http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/e/6...6eabf82a68.png where h is eye level altitude
If I check the bridge height of a type ViII the point of view will be around 5.2 meters above sea. Means that the horizon is 8,22 Km's (stock distance).

PapaKilo 09-29-11 02:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rik007 (Post 1757846)
If I check the bridge height of a type ViII the point of view will be around 5.2 meters above sea. Means that the horizon is 8,22 Km's (stock distance).
And we have 16 km :) Wrong or right ? It's not good that all the ships of course comes to visibility range together with horizon line. I bet there was no option or nor is now in GWX to make an object appear over horizon line in clear weather ? I understand the approach to make 16 km environment or even more, cuz there is no other way to make it happen.

rik007 09-29-11 02:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PapaKilo (Post 1757851)
And we have 16 km :) Wrong or right ? It's not good that all the ships of course comes to visibility range together with horizon line. I bet there was no option or nor is now in GWX to make an object appear over horizon line in clear weather ? I understand the approach to make 16 km environment or even more, cuz there is no other way to make it happen.
What I noticed is that the horizon line is not lower than the sea plane around the point of view (you expect the earth will curve the surface down) but it slightly curles upwards to the horizon and thus absorbing the ships (as the sea is higher than the ships at horizon) emulating 'above the horizon'. So 8 Km is a bit unnatural as there is no above the horizon (it should be a bit longer).

20K is a overstretched thing, 16 K is a limit.

Hitman 09-29-11 03:26 PM
@Rik: It seems that the calculations involved to have the ships be displaced downwards in the vertical axe as they go more distant were too complicated ... thus the expeditive solution taken by the devs was to curve the earth upwards (!) so that it would be the sea which would raise to hide ships instead of them sinking due to following the earth's curvature. You can give the earth in the scene.dat the correct curvature and the horizon is then beautiful, but you will see distant ships floating in the air because they did not stick to the water surface and instead kept their height in the same plane as you :damn: To cover the rest of the sea and prevent it from seeing it rendered behind the ship upwards, horizon fog was used.

Some clever mods like MEP3 use a combination of horizon fog and colours to minimize this effect, and the result is very close to what we want. But never perfect, and a high magnification in the optics will reveal the trick to the player.

complutum 09-29-11 04:15 PM
I'm thinking if would be possible that for first contact report you need to see more than 2 ships to ensure it is a convoy, but once you've send it and while you are shadowing for the wolfpack you could send next reports just only seeing one ship of the convoy. Perhaps this way could be lees dangerous shadow it

LGN1 09-29-11 04:29 PM
Hi,

am I right that shadowing without sending messages is no problem, i.e., the player can see/shadow the convoy without being detected?

Has anyone tried to lock on the ship/ships he can see (UZO on ship and pressing 'L', it might be required to increase the precise_range in the sensor file)? Usually, I can always lock on all ships I see (sometimes only for seconds, but that's enough) and then I can send a report :hmmm:

Regards, LGN1

PS: Once I thought that at the first encounter you have to see the number of ships that are given in the contacts.cfg file for a small contact/convoy. However, I'm no longer sure about that. Actually, I could never figure out a real pattern for how much ships you have to see in which situation :-?

PapaKilo 09-29-11 04:41 PM
LGN1 is also correct. If your WO spots the very first ship out of the rest of the convoy, it is possible for the player to spot and identify (or simply lock on them ) other ships nearby that are still not reported as sighted by WO.

But in this case the report should be send very quickly just after manualy identifying nearby ships otherwise they will get "out of visual range by WO" again :)

h.sie 09-29-11 05:04 PM
@Stiebler: I made a test mission with a convoy, consisting of some merchants and a single leading escort, which is located 2km in front of the other ships.

As soon as the leading escort comes in visible range for the first time (I still cannot see the other ships), I can send a contact report (sh3 engine seems to know that this is not only a single ship).

Could this difference between your and my results be inducted by NYGM/GWX differences?

Depth Charger 09-29-11 07:37 PM
Contacts
 
xxx

Stiebler 09-30-11 04:36 AM
@H.sie:
Quote:
As soon as the leading escort comes in visible range for the first time (I still cannot see the other ships), I can send a contact report (sh3 engine seems to know that this is not only a single ship).

Could this difference between your and my results be inducted by NYGM/GWX differences?
It could be so, perhaps.

Stiebler.

rik007 09-30-11 01:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hitman (Post 1757868)
@Rik: It seems that the calculations involved to have the ships be displaced downwards in the vertical axe as they go more distant were too complicated ... thus the expeditive solution taken by the devs was to curve the earth upwards (!) so that it would be the sea which would raise to hide ships instead of them sinking due to following the earth's curvature. You can give the earth in the scene.dat the correct curvature and the horizon is then beautiful, but you will see distant ships floating in the air because they did not stick to the water surface and instead kept their height in the same plane as you :damn: To cover the rest of the sea and prevent it from seeing it rendered behind the ship upwards, horizon fog was used.

Some clever mods like MEP3 use a combination of horizon fog and colours to minimize this effect, and the result is very close to what we want. But never perfect, and a high magnification in the optics will reveal the trick to the player.
Welll, Understood! That's what I experienced. The visual aspect of this mod and the recognition-distance could lead to a more sophisticated sensor model. Hopefully better surface attacks. Combined with the Wolfpack we should have all we hoped for since a long time....!

h.sie 09-30-11 04:51 PM
Wolfpack Alpha 2 available for download:

http://www.mediafire.com/?raxlajcdz1xsl

Details and instructions see here:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...postcount=2131

Changes compared to Alpha1:
  • Time between contact messages now up to 3 hours without penalty (without magnified risk of wolfpack losing the convoy). But in order to lead wolfpack to the convoy using the quickest route, you should send hourly reports whenever possible.
  • A LITE-Version can be switched on/off using Stieblers OptionsSelector (per default it is switched on). In the LITE-Version, time between 1st contact report and wolfpack attack is halved compared to the HARD version.
  • The Single Mission "Wolfpack" now is easier to play.
Happy hunting and testing.

Hitman 10-01-11 04:16 AM
D/l now, will report if I can patch it :up:

SquareSteelBar 10-01-11 04:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hitman (Post 1758600)
D/l now, will report if I can patch it :up:
If not let me know about...


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