When I say half, it's a gross value. It's not exactly half, but close to that.

Yes, 20% of engine power is what we need, and I had it planned for two weeks already. Just don't have the time to do it hand ship by ship. :damn:

I GOT IT!!

I increased the mass and surfaced/submerged desplacement by 10fold of U-boat VIIb.

Results.

-Stock (default) values:

1)
0kts->17kts in 30" , 300m run
during acceleration to max speed (ahead flank), the boat reaches 7kts in 4", 10kts in 6", 17kts in 30".

2)
17kts->0kts in 6'
during decelaration (engines stopped), the speed drops at 10kts in 20", 5kts in 1', 0kts in 6'.


-10fold mass and desplacement increase:

1)
0kts->17kts in 5' , 3000m run!
during acceleration to flank speed, the boat was at 7kts in 20", 10kts in 50", 17kts in 5'.

2)
17kts->0kts in 30' , 4500m run!
during deceleration (engines stopped) the speed drops to 10kts in 3'30", 5kts in 10', 1kts in 30'.


Moreover I looked into 12kts wind sea. The 10fold mass U-boat was feeling more heavy. Anyway, She was taking up to 10minutes to submerge!!

No modifications in turning rate/radius observed!


Conclusions.
The mass/desplacement appears linked to inertia in SH3, and appears have an heavy effect on acceleration/deceleration behaviour and a minor effect on pitch/roll stability.

I would suggest to increase the ships mass/despacement to change the acceleration/deceleration properties instead of modify the engine power (that might be increased close to the default value).

:shifty:

Follow me...

Mass 10, engine power 2. Mass/Engine = 5.
Mass 100, engine power 20. Mass/Engine = 5.

So what's your point?

Hi PT, yes you are right,

but just consider this: in the mod, the acceleration is slow down acting on engines power. But this has a somewhat effect on ship speed: for instance I played in the single mission Bismark, and all battleships were cruising at 3kts! I encountered the Aquitania and She was travelling at 3 kts near Gibraltar in heavy sea!

In other words, an engine power set at 2 (your example) could not have enough propeller torque to permitt the ship cruising in some sea state!


So, in order to slow down the sport-car acceleration and to permit a ship to decrease slowly the speed, (but without penalizing other characteristics like propeller torque) it might be better arise the engine power to default value and increase a lot the mass.

(probably in SH3 1kg is not modelled as 1kg! I mean, a 10.000ton ship maybe is handled in SH3 lika a 2000ton, even if the .sim value is 10.000!)

You're still not getting it.

Increase the ship mass and engine power will result in the same problem.

Engine power 10 and mass 10.000 is the same as engine power 1.000 and mass 10.000.000. All the maneuverability and sailing behavior will be the same. Can you see?

Like a car with 500kg and 80hp, and a truck with 5.000kg and a 800hp engine, they will have the same hp-per-ton constant.

Reduce the engine power or increase the ship mass is exactly the same thing.

:up:

I see..

but I meant:

we have eng_power 10 and mass 1.000 (ratio 1:100)?

okay, let have eng_power 100 and mass 100.000! (ratio 1:1000). So we will have nice turns and slow accelerations/decelerations.

Get the mass higher produce other effects than get lower the power.

In fact, my extra massive U-boat was able to stop after 4,5km after I stopped the engines! If I attempt to reduce the power, I'm not able to have this such of stopping length!!

Hi Sag,

interesting results. but what about underwater behaviour of the boat with a 10-fold mass and displacement? what happens when it has a leckage and water comes in? is the boat still able to surface? are 10 minutes to submerge realistic? it's a little bit long, i think.....i'm afraid of the side-effects, especially for uboats.

at a first glance, reducing eng_power to 10-20% of it's original value, as PT does, seems okay for me. perhaps, increasing mass/displacement is equiavalent to that? but there still remains the behaviour while zig-zagging (see Mikhayls posts). i think there has to be some research to see, how real ships behave in that situation and what is the best way: decreasing eng_power or increasing mass/displacement. we have plenty of time for that.

in 2 weeks my program is ready (with 80% propability) and can do the job for all ships with one mouseclick. one only has to choose the Sea-Folder of SH3 and the result will be a JSGME-ready folder-structure with the modificated sim-files. there can be made modification rules for each value in unit_Ship, depending on the UnitType (0=Patrol. 7=Destroyer Escort 103 = Tanker or something like that). contact me, if you don't want to make the changes by hand. and don't be afraid: it's still ThomsensShips-Mod. I'm only interested in a realistic game. Besides that, I will do own researches......

hey
 

I read through that supertramp thread, thomsen.. :D I am writting an answer here because.. It's easier here..
Say, you couldn't pick some "wil country like tibet or Australia"? But america...
Also, I read deepiron's advices.. And other..
LOL, thomsen, I really didn't know you are such a romantic adventuristic soul :up:

If you have a visa, 6 months whatever, find a job in usa.. and you are good.. FOR A tourist.. I don't know how is it right now, but my friend went there a year ago, been for 4-5 months, worked there, used a flat with 5 others, earned enuf money for sightseeing and had a fun.. From his telling, it is not so scary.. But then again he went there with 1-2 people..
Canada must be even easier than usa.. If you can get in.. and stay in..
BUT how come you can move from a place like BRASIL, DAMMIT, to a place like Canada!?!? Soccer left out for snooker!?!? Who kidnapped the real thomsen? There must have been one? aliens?
:rotfl: It's not like I don't like Canada(blame canada for everything, some would say).. But how can you go from sunny atmosphere to snow and police horsemen??
It's Canada you are moving into.. :rotfl:

You, thomsen, must be on drugs.. :rotfl:

And you say stufff like "People work to earn money to pay bills, and have children to perpetuate the mankind. In my head this is freaking redundant!"? And go to Canada??
:rotfl:
Damn, man, go to madagascar or south africa or some other wil country if you are talking stuff like that.. :D
RDP will shurely tell you that moving to canada is not a wise idea :rotfl:

P.S. Wizardmatt! Aston Villa?? More EURO cups than Hajduk, Chelsea and Arsenal? Let me see.. 0 1/2 1/2.. Probably, but Hajduk had a bad luck in past to meet Ajax, St.Etienne and PSV in their peaks.. ;)
FREEDOOM!!!!!!! ;))))

You still don't understand.

The weight of the ship is not important. The important is the power-weith ratio.

Before (GWX) it was 1:1000, and I changed to 1:100, and now you want to make it go back to 1:1000, so basically you would be going back to gwx's patter.

Simple...

I HATE HEAT! I LOVE COLD!
I'm polish decendent... white skin.

I can't stand one more year in this place... I'm literally melting.

I want to live in a place where the hottest day is around 10ºC.

she was an underwater massive thing, too! Anyway, it was only a test to see the mass impact on sailing behaviour. Yes the boat was able to get again on surface, but very slowly, and depth changes were slow too! It's not realistic at all. I rammed a steam cargo: she had some explosions on the deck, but without sinking.

H.sie, thank you for your program, it will be cool!


About PT:
you convinced me, my only point was about ship deceleration when engines are stopped or back full. I guess a massive ship has a better deceleration in SH3 water, instead of keeping mass as it is and lower the engine: a mass increasing changes the mass/water_drag ratio.

PS. do you need cold? meet the Canada: now there are -15°C here where I live!!

-15????

SWEET!!! :D

last Jenuary, for one week, we had -33°C during the night and -29°C during the day!! :yep:

the spring normally arrives in May, and usually the summer temperature is below +25°C here in Alberta.

"Freedoom"? Free-doom. hmmmm........is that a new word? :p :rotfl:

for Asanovic7: there are not police horsemen here... The Mounted Police is in high-tech vehicles nowdays! Canada offers a very beutifull nature, have you never been on canadian Rocky Mountains? in Ontario? Nova Scotia? Newfoundland?? The canadian cities are quiet, they haven't at all that such of crime that you can see in US cities!! Are you scared by extreme cold? here you have all goods to fight it!

for PT: from Italy it's pretty easy enjoy a work into Canada by Canadian Embassy. I don't know from the Brazil, but you can get informations about. Just contact your Canadian Embassy in your Country! Or, try in northern Europe.. Norway? Sveden? They can speak english very well..

Thanks for all the info! I'm planning on going next year.

How about I pay you a visit? :hmm:

Canada is a beautiful Country!
I live roughly 2 hours south of Canada and have been there many times.
And I have found the Canadians to be just as friendly as
the people around my home area.

It just depends on what part of the U.S.A. you go to that you see
the most common portrait that is concieved by most of the World.

Stay out of the Biggest Cities?
And if you have an accent?

You'd be over run with Women,
Everybody would want to talk to you,
and you'd be hard pressed to pay for a drink!!
:rock:

:yep:

Hmm. I found Chicago to be very friendly. But maybe that's cos of all the "Irish" people there. :hmm:

:yep: :yep: :D :rock:

Chicago is probably the friendliest Big City I've been to here.
And I have been in them all!

Houston is really cool also!!
Heck!
The Grey Wolves stumbled all over that place and had a GREAT Time!
:rock:
Most of the Cities in Arizona are really fun and easy going.
Any Major city in Alaska is cool.

And Hawaii?
OMG!
I'd move there in a heart beat!

Some of the Southern States can be a bit 'off'.
If they hear a Northern 'Twang'.

But for the most part?
The U.S.
Just like other Countries?
Is a collection of simple people that have nothing to do
with what the Government of the U.S. carries on
with in other Countries.

Just as Your Government does things that you don't like,
and can't control?

There be us!