My two cents worth
 

This mod is very frustrating. I happily acknowledge it is a technological materpiece, but there are practical problems. While each step in radar tracking is not difficult, my major critism is that there a too many of them. The number of steps involved seriously diminishes the practicality of relying on this mod to play full time with map contacts disabled. Here is my case.
(1) 3 to 4 plots to estimate course. This can be time consuming and involves the 3D DC mod, the range screen on the stadimeter, the Nav Map screen and plotting tools for each plot. I assume most stop the game to draw a plot before resuming;
(2) the periscope screen must be open and the stadimter screen opened to range for each plot--which is another 3 or 4 tasks;
(3) Using the stopwatch to obtain preliminary target speed calculation involves mulitple steps (i.e. opening the Nav Map and using the stopwatch and Nomograph);
(4) Plot the preliminary course (Ruler Map tool);
Now for speed estimate:
(5) Periscope Screen and switch stadimater to Aob;
(6) Turn off radar
(7) 3D TDC - enter target course
(8) Periscope screen - send to course to TDC.
(10) Lots more to do....
(11) Get the picture, etc. etc. Plus if the target gets too close and spots the sub, all is lost as the target will take evasion action and fire at it and/or change course. Once the sub takes precautionary measures by diving to periscope depth, radar is history, and all the effort is wasted.
(12) Tracking convoys and TF with radar appears to be extremely difficult.

While I am undecided, I seriously question the practicality of this mod. There are too many steps to dump on one person's lap. Attacks can take a very, very long time. The radar device has serious advantages in bad weather, as the increase in probabililty of a successful attack in bad weather may outweigh the increase in time it takes to execute a radar attack. But I am not sure I want to suffer through the myriad of steps all the time. Playing with map contacts enabled might be a compromise. Frankly, playing with map contacts off is beginning to get old in view of the number of tasks involved to effectuate a radar attack. (Short version: There are too many tasks for one person.)

'A' Scope vs PPI
 

Are you supposed to get a spike on the 'A' scope when the target is over 3000 yds? I got a good contact on the tankers in the 3rd mission with the PPI scope (20K), but couldn't get a spike on the 'A' scope when I put it into precision mode.

I did get a decent readout from the bearing-o-meter, and there were two triangles (green and white) in precision mode. When I aligned the two, I did get a range, but it didn't seem very accurate.

Color me confused. :ping:

Sounds like you're beginning to understand why they called it an 'ATTACK TEAM'. The captain looked through the scope, the XO would call out the bearing, The OOD worked the TDC, SONAR and/or RADAR would keep track of their range/bearing stats and update the OOD, who inputs into the TDC, the plotter would plot the attacks, etc. etc. Add the Helm, and the team gets pretty big in that little conning tower. That's 6 guys in that little room, and I'm sure I forgot a couple of stations.

Unfortunatly, with a single-person sim like this one, YOU get to do everything! Pausing the game while you make your plot or input your entries might be the best idea. So far, I haven't been able to keep up while me and the contact are moving. It got out of hand rather quickly - then the dog started shooting at me!

What would be neat if the multi-player online edition could be set up as ONE attack team over several computers for ONE submarine. I don't think it quite works that way, though.

rodger, rodger dodger
 

We are in agreement. It is not that any single task is difficult. It is the sheer number of them. It not that it is hard to say, "She slit sheets, how many she sheets did she slit?" It is saying it many times under time pressure that that makes uttering it accurately each time a classic tongue twister (even though it generates a laugh when it is not repeated correctly.) Same theory, sort of, here (except, I am not laughing when the tankers I have been tracking in practice Mission 3 sail off into the sunset.) I thought about the fact that this mod is best designed for more than one person's use during an attack run. The multiple computer idea is not probably possible at some very sophisticated level of gaming, but sadly that is not currently feasible in the single game protocol of our beloved SH4.

But then, I am sure individuals like Nisgeis who are technically oriented and extremely detailed (see also his torpedo angle calculator mod [which, when I activated it, unfortunately canceled the Nomograph on the Nav. Map] and who may love these slowly developing, PRECISE attack scenarios, enjoys playing real time for a day or two to find, track and stealthily sink a flotilla or two while he is consumed with reading another book on how the mechanisms on submarines really work. Frankly, I am convinced the 3D TDC is the most sophisticated and historically accurate of the various attack schemes that have been developed to date (it is right up there with MoBo and the Solution Solver in terms of excellence), but it is prone to human error due to the number of tasks required to be completed to successful launch torpedoes at a target. Human error leads to missed shots. Missed shots lead to frustrated skippers, some who are demoted or resign, or become skippers who forgo using the mod for one that is less of a challenge to use with success.

Yes. Post a screenshot of what you have when you are trying to take a range reading.

IGD, you are overcomplicating the whole thing. Just take a step back and try to understand what each step does and what it's for and you'll find you don't need as many as you are using.

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/b...bearing304.jpg
PPI Contact Bearing 304

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/b...Prescision.jpg

PPI Contact Precision - Note no spike on 'A' Scope

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/b...946/AScope.jpg

'A' Scope - Triangles aligned reads 520 yds

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/b...ge-O-Meter.jpg

Bearing-O-Meter

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/b...46/AScope2.jpg

'A' Scope with spike. I wasn't moving the screen far enough

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/b...e-O-Meter2.jpg

Second bearing

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/b...946/NavMap.jpg

Nav Map Plot (Contacts on) Note 4 degree difference

Found my problem while messing around taking screenshots, then plotting between. Game on pause between actions, and while plotting. Still getting a 4 degree error, but may be because target moved even in that short a time.

TF and Convoy
 

I would like to hear if anyone has had success with tracking a TF or convoy. I haven't been able to get consistent readings even though I have been trying to fix the radar beam on a particular ship. It ends up that I have two or three readings that appear to be the same target. Then my beam seems to pick up another target and a much different range.

I don't worry so much about the accuracy of individual range and bearing readings. If you take enough plot points it will still average out to be accurate enough. I still haven't had a chance to play with this mod. But the unmodded radar was wildly inaccurate guessing game! Maybe I can try this mod tomorrow arvo

You will never be able to track an entire task force or convoy... it's too much work.

What I do is maintain whatever course I am on (ie don't change your relative position to the contacts) and track the last (or first... your choice) contact spike on the A-Scope enough to get a rough range and course. I plot that on the map and then get into a intercept position and wait for them to come over the horizon. Once you have a visual you can lock one target in the TBT. change course to match theirs and go ahead standard to slow their closing rate, spend a little time getting a pretty good solution on it and then get into a really good intercept position. Submerge, and use the periscope, stadimeter and AOB tools to get the shooting solution.

Then I let go with everything I have and make a dignified withdrawl.

JCC

JChanning
 

I hear what you are saying re TF/Convoy. However, once a warship spots your boat, surface time is limited before its begins to shell you. I believe, although I am not positive, that will prevent, as a practical matter, the use of radar to track, etc., unless a captain is willing to sacrafice his boat to fire from far away deck guns of the TF/convoy.

Or you could run at radar depth for a while.

You should be able to stay at about 5,000 yds and have visual contact without them spotting you (esp. at night). and still be able to lock the TBT onto the target. IRL the Archer-Fish tracked the Shinano at visual range and on radar for several hours before a bad zig by the Shinano put her squarely in Archer-Fish's sights.

Or sergei's suggestion will work but will limit your speed and increase the closure rate.

Trust me, with time and practice, it will come. Where I really started to get good at it was in an actual patrol. So far 4 enemy hulls are on the bottom, 12k tons, with an expenditure of 19 torpedos. Allowing for duds and misses this is the most histoprically accurate total for a patrol I have ever had.

And the most fun.

JCC

channing
 

no one has fessed up that have tracked a convoy/TF with success. Daytime is probably out, because if you are on the surface too long, you are dead meat. Night time is possible theoretically, if you can manage to track a single target on radar, which I have found to be very difficut.

And, if you do track one ship in a convoy or TF, what if it is a DD? If you are hunting the bigger fish, how do you transfer the TDC from the DD to a BB, for example? If that can be done, we are in business. (I am trying to figure that one out and am thinking about it.)

In a typical convoy the merchies will comprise a more organized "block" in the "middle" than the escorts/DDs. You can even set the radar to"focus" on a specific target and take its bearing and range.



.

All ships in a convoy will have the same course and speed, otherwise they wouldn't be sailing together.