Much like when the Catholic church in Africa having so much power, even though 1000's were dying of AIDS, they preached condom use was sin so many followed the belief. Having some power over governments, condoms were removed from schools, etc...no telling how many people died.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/...-a-879198.html

A state within a state, to 90% financially maintained by public taxes nevertheless, and claiming more and more sovereignity from the state, and increasing the number of institutions it calls its own.

Totally unacceptable.

same here. Church isolates itself from the general population, and becomes increasingly radical - the classic bickering between sub-groups and Orders leads to letters of hate and resentment that the church subgroups exchange. The public gets a few hints of the ongoing fights when they go to mass on weekends.

They really return to the 1700s.

The case of child molestation by priests and the cover-up by the high ranking Los Angeles clergy just got real interesting with the release by the diocese of some 12,000 pages of diocese internal memos, correspondence, and documents relating to the cover-up, as mandated by the local courts. The documents detail the extent to which the diocese, particularly under the rule of Cardinal Mahony, engaged in full-scale efforts to protect priests from arrest and prosecution. Here is a link to the documents as posted by the docese on its website:

http://clergyfiles.la-archdiocese.org/

You only need to read a few of these to really see how truly evil and self-serving these "protectors of the faith" could be in dealing with the victims...

<O>

Unfortunately, man can control everything but himself, therein is our problem and will forever remain so. Governments, Churches and Military muscle exemplify the need to control the masses, that they do not escape onto desolation row and finally find the freedom they crave.

Already some days, or even 1-2 weeks ago, it was revealed to what degree the victims had been brainwashed and intimidated by the offenders afterward. Some contacted the victims by themselves, others got apprached by them, and in both cases not few of the offenders tried to indoctrinbate them with things like "we are now linked together in the love of Jesus" and "God wanted it" and "What you got gifted by me with is an evidence for the love of God."

Get out the bullwhip.

Yesterday, arch cardinal Meisner, Germany, complained about a pogrom climate against the church, and that it is met with hostility instead respect.

Well. That is rich.

What stuns me time and again is that these slime bags often indeed mean what they say. With a wide, fat grin on their face.

Ekelhaft.

http://www.n-tv.de/panorama/Erzbisch...e10057636.html


Archbishop Mister Müller sees a Pogrom mood/ atmosphere against the Catholic Church in E. and N.A. that has the effect of Clerics get bullied on in certain Regions.

He paints the Catholic Church as victim of [propaganda] attacks that have their roots in nationalism and communism. The net and TV would be used to attack the Church, and directions of these attacks would be totalitary ideologies against Christianity.


Müller thinks that re-debating old points makes no sense.
Critical Lamen demanding female priests and the acceptance of homo marriage - that is an impossible demand for the church to take for church can impossibly accept that.
He also insists on celibacy, because being unmarried represents following jesu example.

Independent of my own Views and Opinions, i think it is safe to say:

-1) Society starts to accept Gay marriage.
Church does not. They stay behind the learning curve.

- 2) Society acceptts that women do as well on a Job as a man. Women are as capable to achieve something as a human with a dick.
Church refuses that idea. They stay behind the learning curve.

- 3) The risk of abuse, the need for sex and all that.... which leads to abuse - he holds on to Priests not being allowed to have any kind of intercourse with women "because Jesus didnt have sex either"
Indirectly promoting, or dare i even say defending the abuse of priests on Children.

- 4) all this is summed up as a war of the media against the church, and oh the poor church, we getting raped by the nonbelievers, the evil humanists, the atheists, nazis, the Commies and the antichrist himself.


How about this, church:
SOCIETY DOES NOT NEED, FEAR, WANT TO FEED YOU ANY LONGER YOU FRICKING RETARDS! WE MOVED BEYOND YOUR SICK RULES

:up:

Just noted that the chief of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Gerhard Ludwig Müller, gets quoted in news today of having complained, too, over the church being "mobbed".

I feel so very sorry for you, dear Sir. My heart cries big tears of heartblood when learning about your suffering and distress.

I'm not a religious guy but I read this and wonder who you think you are speaking for society.

Meh? I am speaking for myself.

1) when i see the changes in local and national, international rules, concerning nations allowing gay marriage

2) when i see women being allowed in the highest positions over all resentments and resistancey by male counterparts in many nations worldwide

THEN i say Society. Of course that mostly encompasses the christianized part of the world.

Nice to see you here. How about you stop thinking?

( i mean that in the sense of "how about you stop poking a stick at me - i know you can not stand me, as i am a liberal socialist commie European... i really do not coare for your presence in this discussion on Catholic transparency, thank you for leaving... me alone")

:D


Hugs.

Then what's with the "we"?

You presume to speak for everyone then you tell us to stop thinking. Illuminating...

Nono. YOU. AUGUST.
not "you, the world"

back to topic, and off the personal bickering...


German humanist Group Vicepresident Fink: It seems grotesk when Müller paints church as a Victim, in the face of decades of worldwide abuse and silencing of Victims. It shows how The roman Church reacts to reconnaissance (elucidation?) and criticism, even today.

that is nicely put. Very diplomatic though. Keeping the tone mild, yet getting to the point.

but then again, the man is right.
OPFER. das sind alles OPFER.:D:haha:

Meh. Why the Church is still around after the inquisition tells me all I need to know.

I'm really hurt and disappointed that you dislike me so much but never fear I can stand you just fine bud.