Update:

I'm adding in the SCX graphics to the database and found several missing things. I guess some maybe graphics from Stock SC.

If someone could decompress their 3d.grp file, find them and send them to me or Molon Labe it would help a lot.

ChPROP.bmp
PL4PROP.bmp
Sauro1.bmp
Cimarron.j3d and graphics
Bougainville LPD j3d file and graphics
Colossus CV J3d and graphics
Xiangyang Hong AGI j3d and graphics

also some of the harrier files are missing but I'm really concerned about them right now since we have the default harrier.

Regarding doctrine "SubAvoidAir":

IF Init THEN {

Unknown = true
PreventingSnorkel = true
PreventingComms = true
SetEntVar "TooBusyForComms" ( GetEntVar "TooBusyForComms" + 1 )
SetEntVar "TooBusyToSnorkel" ( GetEntVar "TooBusyToSnorkel" + 1 )

During my tests to allow AI subs to fire at Air platforms I realised that the 'INIT' event gets called twice for this tactic doctrine!
Can somebody retest this? I'm using LWAMI 3.08+DW1.04...perhaps it's a bug in the engine. If so perhaps the coding needs to be adapted?

couple of questions billiard from me:

1: what sort of doctrine was the kilo running?
I mean, if it shot torp after torp, I dont doubt that if it was like that, then no problem with you dodging it. Considering that a kilo has x amount of tubes and it depends on if the kilo was firing wire guided or auto seeking torps.
I'm not expert, but I am a member of the surface community as you know already, hardware and software limitations allow for a maximum amount of what the particular unit can fire and control.

this goes for both surface and sub-surface units, no matter the weapon.

as for which ever type of craft you were running, a 180 degree turn would mean you should have been fish food.

so,
2: do you know of currently developed anti-torpedo defence docurine? and what a surface ship's required manuvering docurine should be in such event?
could it be pre-programmed into the game where the OOD of the ship (ai or player) should order the vessel into such manuvering?

edit: can i get someone to change my rank? I'm no seaman :p

[quote=Kookee]couple of questions billiard from me:

1: what sort of doctrine was the kilo running?
I mean, if it shot torp after torp, I dont doubt that if it was like that, then no problem with you dodging it. Considering that a kilo has x amount of tubes and it depends on if the kilo was firing wire guided or auto seeking torps.
I'm not expert, but I am a member of the surface community as you know already, hardware and software limitations allow for a maximum amount of what the particular unit can fire and control.

this goes for both surface and sub-surface units, no matter the weapon.

I assume it was running the standard Subattksurface (or whatnot) doctrine. I was in the FFG and the Kilo was firing mostly 53-65K and USET-80 torpedoes so by turning 180 I left no wake for the 53-65K to home on because by the time it reached intercept I was never there. BTW I was on a 90 degree course off the bearing of the TIW.

I read a book not so long ago that discussed real anti-torpedo manuvering. I want to pick it up again from the Library and scan those pages.

Post more. Also I think that Neal will give you whatever custom rank and avatar you want since you are really in the military.

try this: next time preprogram the map so that you'd have to be chased off by those trops again
but see if performing a long series of 's' turns at different frequencies, and of course speed.

i say speed is that one could always run it at flank, but if someone is streaming nixie, you cant go anything above 15knts safely w/o breaking the things off

I've done the S Turn for evaiding torpedoes in more harry situations. Normanly I make a 180 degree (relitive to torpedo bearing) turn run at flank for a while then make another turn. I drop buoys at each turn so I can pinpoint the location of the torpedo then I ajust my evasion course based on its location. If its a wakehomer I do another S Turn then slow and deploy the APUs and move out of the way at low speed.

So the Nixie breaks off at 15 knots... intresting we might have to include a maximum nixie speed in the next LWAMI. What about the TA? I know your DDG dosn't have a TACTAS but any idea?

The NIXIE device can not is destroyed on any speed of the ship - even on maximal. This is incredible...

Don't know if this is a repost, but here is a pretty intresting video of a mk-48 "hit" on a warship for your damage models. My 2 cents is that a mk-48 should be capabable of taking down most modern warships with the obvious exceptions of the kirov, carriers, large crusiers etc, but again, my 2 cents, looking for realism.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vaImLvZbPw

Also I would love to see the SSM, vs SAM sorted out. I feel like harpoons should be slightly more effective than TASM's, and maybe all SSM a little harder to hit? I don't know, again, looking for realism. Don't really care about platform balance as I only play single player.

Also I lurk and don't post much, but big thanks to Luftwolf Amiazur. There's a lot of us out here that aren't involved but use your stuff. Thanks again.


-edit- I heard something about sonar chaning with the 1.04 DW patch? And this changing things with LwAmi mod? That would be good if sorted out. Oh and SM-1's for the FFG.

Thanks for your interest. Here's what I can say about the damage model at this point: The ship in the video looks to be a small destroyer or frigate, probably a Leander class or something similar (I'm sure TLAM or others know precisely the class...). In any case, it's safe to say it's approximately Leander size, 3000 tons. In the existing database, the Leander has an armor rating of 350 and the ADCAP a damage rating of 400. So you get 14% overkill... which is far too low to be consitent with the video. (Edit: It was To Be, not TLAM, and it's a River class DE--the Leander was an improved River design)

Under my proposed damage capacity scaling, the Leander has 400 armor points. Torepdo scaling is not finished due to uncertaintly about how under-the-keel detonations will be handled. But the proposed scales range from giving the ADCAP 768-966, which is about 100% overkill and is far more consistent with what you see in the video. For comparisson, most destroyers (5000-8000 tons) are in the 600-800 range, with most cruisers (7000-1300 tons) being up around 700-1000. In other words, most escorts will fall to a single ADCAP, but some larger escorts might limp away, and capital ships will generally take two to kill.

As for missile defense balance, there isn't too much being planned there. pK is being adjusted for some SAMs, mostly down, some up. Luftwolf has mentioned that some doctrine improvements can be made to give appropriate missiles (like the Shipwreck) a high-low attack profile, which should improve their effectiveness. But most of the tweaks benefiting subsonic missiles have invovled adjustments to radar SLs, and those have already been done for the current version. So, I wouldn't expect any radical changes regarding weapons like the Harpoon (but they will probably benefit slightly from pK adjustment).

The changes to the sonar model in the 1.04 patch have been relatively minor and don't require any adjustments on our end. You can see the changes in the README_v104 text file in the DW directory.

The SM-1 replacement is something we can do and that at least two members of the team favor, but it won't be done without Luftwolf's express permission... and for what it's worth, my guess is that he won't favor it.

Don't make ADCAP more damage capable torpedo than 65-76 using "under-keel detonation" buzzword. :yep:

It's going to be close. There are several prossible scales that fit the data, in the ones where the UTK bonus is high and the diminishing marginal returns are high, the ADCAP is a little higher, for lower UTK and lower diminishing marginal returns, the 65-76 is higher. The general rule is going to be that the 65-76 will also be killing escorts in single hits and will kill just about anything with 2 hits.

Nope! Are you sure that 65-76 isn't equipped with under-keel detonator? Note WW2 German torps had such one. :know:

I'm not sure. Hence why I haven't given it one.:roll:

So which is it anyways? First you're whining about the UTK bonus being too big and now you want that bonus given to more weapons! Pick a side, man!

EDIT: Well, Gorshie, flip-flopping or not, I'm happy you brought this up. I ran a few more searches, and what I'm finding (from Janes in particular) strongly suggests that the wakehomers do the UTK thing as well. So, I've moved the 65-76 and 53-65 into the UTK column. In terms of balance, it doesn't make a huge difference... the 65-76 pretty much still blows everything to hell. The Screamer is going to kill some large-ish ships in single hits though...it has a larger warhead than the ADCAP so that should give everyone a pretty rough idea where it's at. But, the cool thing about this is that before, the I had several possible scales that all looked about as good and it was hard to choose between them. This change makes one in particular stand out as sensible (and makes one in particular look laughably ridiculous). So in future posts I might just assume that the scale I think is best is going to be the one that gets entered into the DB.

Yes, because your UTK bonus for ADCAP effectively doubled its warhead TNT equivalent! Therefore I though it was a cheat aimed at giving American side both UGST and 65-76 torpedoes all in one.
However if 65-76 and 54-65K wakehomers are also UTK capable so the first is the most powerful torpedo in the game and the second is in the same damage class as ADCAP.
Now I expect that one 65-76 hit should cause at least 60% damage to Nimitz-class carrier and one 53-65K hit should disable Tico-class cruiser.


My new DW database checking revealed two bugs in ASCMs parameters area. First bug is TLAM range set at 2400 km which is wrong because it applies to nuclear TLAM-N version only. Conventional TLAM-C Block III fired from submarine has range about 1350 km. The second one is SS-N-19 "Shipwreck" (P-700 "Granite") Armor/Damage parameter set to very low 375 value. Note that above TLAM has 500 Armor/Damage points! Obviously P-700 as a 7 ton supersonic ASCM should have this parameter in 700-1000 range.

Thanks for your attention!

UTK bonuses have been in the 20% to 50% range; I never approached 100%. And the Russians have had the UTK bonus applied to their acoustic ASUW torpedoes as well... all of which has already been in this thread so I have no idea where you're getting this.

Noted.

Seriously, half of this thread is about how I was rescaling the damage system. I know the current values suck ass, that's why I ****ing volunteered to do it!:damn::damn::damn::damn:

PS: New values: TASM: 556, Shipwreck: 1087 if treated as a skimmer, 815 if treated as a highdiver.