'Airlines terror plot' disrupted

[Captain Nemo]

For more info see http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4778575.stm

Nemo

[Kapitan]

Baby milk is said to explode if its packed in too tight dont know how true it is.

[XabbaRus]

Where did you hear that crap?

[TteFAboB]

Captain Nemo, you will get bombarded for posting this.

You are wise not to include any comments in your post otherwise it would get equalized with something else.

Nevertheless, I expect a link to some other story which has nothing to do with this event attempting to equate the two anyway.

[Kapitan]

lol my nan this morning i was half asleep so i wasnt realy paying attention.

[STEED]

It's to early to make any kind of real comment until more news is released thankfully it was foiled.

[Oberon]

Well, it certainly seems something was stopped, well, so we hope anyway. From what I can tell it was to involve some kind of liquid explosive hidden in a standard fizzy drinks bottle and detonated using some kind of electrical device disguised as a standard domestic electrical device. The entire UK airline industry has pretty much ground to a halt, but it seems that whatever was being planned has been stopped.
Our terror alert level has gone up to critical which means an attack could take place at any time (although officals stress they 'think' they have everything under control), and the US airport alert level has gone up to 'red' apparently.

[SUBMAN1]

When do we get to nuke these people? Or are we still being politically correct these days?

-S

[Oberon]

Well, since they're homegrown, we'll have to nuke ourselves. :damn:

[Konovalov]

My first post in a couple of months here.

This alleged foiled terrorist bomb plot sounds strikingly similar to the Bojinka plot of the mid 90's in terms of the aims. The Bojinka bomb plots aim was to effectively detonate onboard explosives on a dozen aircraft simultaneoulsy on flights to/from US and South East Asia courtesy of Ramzi Yousef who was responsible for the 93 WTC basement bombing.

The entire UK airline industry has pretty much ground to a halt, but it seems that whatever was being planned has been stopped.
Our terror alert level has gone up to critical which means an attack could take place at any time (although officals stress they 'think' they have everything under control), and the US airport alert level has gone up to 'red' apparently.

Tell me about it. I manage a small logistics and airfreight business only 10 minutes from LHR and I have been in the office since 5am this morning. I recieved a fax from the DfT (Department for Transport) outlining what was happening and the raised security threat. I will post later some of that fax which makes for interesting reading. Needless to say it has been a nightmare of a day for me trying to make alternative arrangments for all of my customers freight, in particular one of our main customers who deal in AOG's (Aircraft on Ground) shipments. I have a splitting headache. :damn: :damn: :damn: :damn: :damn:

[Linton]

Have a look at this report.It seems to be quite similiar in some areas:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Bojinka

[Konovalov]

Have a look at this report.It seems to be quite similiar in some areas:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Bojinka

As I mentioned in my prior post.

Anyone that has studied Int'l Terrorism would have immediately thought back to the Bojinka plot once this current event arose. Perhaps no coincidence. Then again we must remember that in the aftermath of 9/11 new secuity measures have been put in place ranging from a stronger aircraft cockpit door to stop terrorists from getting into the cockpit, increased number of Sky Marshals, and more thorough airport passenger and cargo screening. To me this foiled plot is just further evidence that terrorists are always looking for new ways to get around our defences and effect a successful attack.

My thanks to the services involved for preventing this alleged plot.

[jumpy]

Here we go again...
For me this time it's a little more personal - the woman I intend to spend the rest of my life with (one day) is away in Borneo for 21 days at the moment. I guess I should be greatfull that she's not coming back this week (flights to & from heathrow via kuala lumpor sp?), but on the 19th instead; having chosen to complete the second part of her tour of the national parks there, whereas others from her group are on the way home to the UK and elsewhere yeterday/today - hopefully she'll miss out on the majority of the disruption caused by this - and we get some more information as to what is really going on.
Air travel is always quoted as the 'safest' form of travel... maybe so, but if you have a small mechanical failure in a car you can pull over to the side of the road. In an airoplane a serious mechanical problem usually means game over for anybody who is on board. This latest 'threat' of terrorism only highlights the timorous nature of air travel, if you ask me.[/pessimism]

I shall not be entirely comfortable or relaxed until she is back home safely - and that was before all of this threat business lol. Ah well...:x

[Onkel Neal]

Hats off to the British Intel services :up:

[Egan]

Here we go again...
For me this time it's a little more personal - the woman I intend to spend the rest of my life with (one day) is away in Borneo for 21 days at the moment.

I shall not be entirely comfortable or relaxed until she is back home safely - and that was before all of this threat business lol. Ah well...:x
Ditto, Jumpy mate. I know exactly how you are feeling. My GF is in San Fransisco just now visiting family. She just got there yesterday.

The last time I freaked out about the news was a few months ago when that bomb went off in the market area in Dheli. My Mum, Dad, Brother and sister-in-law had just arrived about 6 hours before...

[Egan]

Hats off to the British Intel services :up:

American too, from what the news is saying. :up:

[waste gate]

Hats off to the British Intel services :up:

American too, from what the news is saying. :up:

And the Pakistani intel service as well:up: .

[waste gate]

Is anyone else picking up the phrase 'home grown and of Pakistani decent'? Is this PC code for muslim? If so, by now we should realize that the followers of Islam have no allegience to any state (political entity). Their allegience is to the Quran and Islam and by extension the destruction of all people and institutions which do not convert to or are followers of the 'religion of peace'.

[Onkel Neal]

I find it terrifically heartening that US, UK, and Paki services are working together successfully. If the reports are true and there were bomb plots against passenger planes thwarted, think of all the innocent people they saved. Could be someone we know. Three cheers for the good guys!

[Onkel Neal]

Is anyone else picking up the phrase 'home grown and of Pakistani decent'? Is this PC code for muslim? If so, by now we should realize that the followers of Islam have no allegience to any state (political entity). Their allegience is to the Quran and Islam and by extension the destruction of all people and institutions which do not convert to or are followers of the 'religion of peace'.

Well, perhaps some followers but let's not overgeneralize.

[Konovalov]

Well, perhaps some followers but let's not overgeneralize.

For my sake, thanks. :up:

[waste gate]

Well, perhaps some followers but let's not overgeneralize.

You are right of course. Yet how many denunciations for acts of terror do you hear from the so called moderate Muslim community. The moderate community is not actively involved. By the silence their complicity is manifest. Our inability to identify the problem will not make us more secure or change the nature of Islam.
Like an addiction to alcohal or drugs, if you do not admit the problem exists you cannot fix it.

I liken my position to that of holding a wolf by the ears. I don't much like it, but I dare not let go.

[Skybird]

Walter Laqueur: "probably a national, inner-British terror cell not instructed from people in Afghanistan or Pakistan" ; "England's tolerance-policy now fires back" ; "this must be a great dissapointment for the government, for no other European government tries so hard to embrace it'S Isliamic immigrants" ; "BBC just had to admit in a study that 30% of British Muslims approve the use of terrorist violance - amongst young Muslims, the quote is even higher."

German language: http://www.welt.de/data/2006/08/10/993139.html

Walter Laqueur is historian and a leading Western expert on terrorism, that is not just an introductory statement by which the interview is opened, but I say I red the author and confirm his reputation, I have three of his books myself, and they are a damn good and substantial reading on the theme of international terror. Some of his books are available in English as well.

I also want to note how carefully Scotland Yard's Paul Stephenson avoided all questions if the arrested suspects are Muslims, giving vague replies like "this is not about a religious community". German radio and internet press is already mocking about this. Some of you will hate me for it, but again: when you talk about this terror coup today, again you are reaching the themes of Islam, and absurd political correctness. I can't help it. In the next days they will carefully reveal their cultural background (and Pakistani are not suspicious of being Buddhist or Jewish or Christian by majority), and we will see the medias and the public immediately trying to take best care that Islam has nothing to do with it.

Don't worry, I do not dive deeper into it.

[waste gate]

I just heard a British talking head asking 'where did we as a nation go wrong and how can we fix it?' My God, its like asking a woman, who happens to dress provocatively, and was raped, what did you do wrong? The question would never be asked. Why are the victims (in this case the potential victims) at fault?

[Iceman]

If there was no Good left in the world it would all be Bad.Score one for the good side. :) :up:

[Konovalov]

Walter Laqueur is historian and a leading Western expert on terrorism, that is not just an introductory statement by which the interview is opened, but I say I red the author and confirm his reputation, I have three of his books myself, and they are a damn good and substantial reading on the theme of international terror. Some of his books are available in English as well.


Well reasoned and I agree. I wasn't aware that you had read any of his books on such a subject having read so many of your long posts. I have metioned him quite often in the past on this forum with regards to my analysis of terrorism. The first book of his that I read was "The New Terrorism - Fanaticism and the Arms of Mass Destrucions." Others from him that I have read are "No End to War", and "Voices of Terror". I have one other book of his in my bookcases titled "The History of Zionism" which I haven't as yet had the time to read. But hey, that is the beauty of owning books. THey are't going to go anywhere or 'go off'. :D

[Torplexed]

Hats off to Britain for saving our donkey today....

Innocuous on their own but potentially deadly when mixed. In the light of today's events I expect to see these two items tightly regulated. :lol:

http://zioxville.homestead.com/files/mentos.jpghttp://zioxville.homestead.com/files/soda.jpg

[Skybird]

<p> Well reasoned and I agree. I wasn't aware that you had read any of his books on such a subject having read so many of your long posts. </p>
Actually he has influenced my view on and understanding of terror quite a bit. But I take from your words that you and me must have understood him very differently. :roll:

[Sea Demon]

Very happy this thing was caught. Could have caused an even greater disruption to our societies. But know this. As we read this, some of these Islamic murderers are planning something else. I'm sure they only see this as a minor setback. I hope more people today are taking the threat seriously as a result.

[Skybird]

But know this. As we read this, some of these Islamic murderers are planning something else. I'm sure they only see this as a minor setback.

You are probably right. Not to mention this religious madness:
http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=NWNmMWM5MjhhMzVjZTM0ZmI1ZmJlYzAxNzU3NDEyMWI=

People over here simply do not have a realistic impression what kind of thinking they are dealing with. If an alien is too alien, he is not even recognized as alien anymore - in fact, he turns invisible in people's perception. Psychology mode off.

I have red Bernard Lewis myself, and hold his older books (those few that I know, since he has been an institution and wrote very many) in high honour, but I agree with those saying that in the recent past he has shown a strong tendency to softwash his own conclusions from his analysis of Islam, adapt to political correctness, and join the chorus of those who leave out all aspects of Islam that violate their view of it as peaceful, reasonable, tolerant, anti-violant. For some reason he has choosen to become very inconsistent with his own findings.

I hope more people today are taking the threat seriously as a result.
That hope is in vain, I fear. It violates Western cute and kind views on reality too harshly. The West may trigger wars for foolish reasons easily , but in no way it knows anymore how to successfully fight them, so it bogs down again and again. America is not Rome. But not only the Iraq war, Kosovo, Afghanistan, but read about the IDF's frustration and anger about the incompetence of their political leaders here:
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1154525850003&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FPrinter

[Konovalov]

<p> Well reasoned and I agree. I wasn't aware that you had read any of his books on such a subject having read so many of your long posts. </p>
Actually he has influenced my view on and understanding of terror quite a bit. But I take from your words that you and me must have understood him very differently. :roll:

Obviously. Rolling eyes back at you.

[Captain Nemo]

I just heard a British talking head asking 'where did we as a nation go wrong and how can we fix it?' My God, its like asking a woman, who happens to dress provocatively, and was raped, what did you do wrong? The question would never be asked. Why are the victims (in this case the potential victims) at fault?

I'll tell you where the UK went wrong:

Afghanistan
Iraq
Immigration policy over the past thirty odd years.It's too late to fix.

Nemo

[Sea Demon]

I just heard a British talking head asking 'where did we as a nation go wrong and how can we fix it?' My God, its like asking a woman, who happens to dress provocatively, and was raped, what did you do wrong? The question would never be asked. Why are the victims (in this case the potential victims) at fault?

I'll tell you where the UK went wrong:

Afghanistan
Iraq
Immigration policy over the past thirty odd years.It's too late to fix.

Nemo

I really don't want to get too involved with this topic. But I will say in regards to your post, Islamic Terrorism against the west (UK included) goes back a long time before any of the things you listed. Even if the UK wasn't involved in Iraq/Afghanistan, and had a more sane immigration policy, Islamic terrorists would still view the UK as a nation of infidels that must convert or die.

[Captain Nemo]

I just heard a British talking head asking 'where did we as a nation go wrong and how can we fix it?' My God, its like asking a woman, who happens to dress provocatively, and was raped, what did you do wrong? The question would never be asked. Why are the victims (in this case the potential victims) at fault?

I'll tell you where the UK went wrong:

Afghanistan
Iraq
Immigration policy over the past thirty odd years.It's too late to fix.

Nemo

I really don't want to get too involved with this topic. But I will say in regards to your post, Islamic Terrorism against the west (UK included) goes back a long time before any of the things you listed. Even if the UK wasn't involved in Iraq/Afghanistan, and had a more sane immigration policy, Islamic terrorists would still view the UK as a nation of infidels that must convert or die.

I couldn't agree more, but Islamic terrorism is now within the UK being orchestrated by British citizens which, I would have thought, makes it much more difficult for the intelligence services to detect and much more easier for the terrorists to commit atrocities (e.g. London tube bombings last year).

Nemo

[goldorak]

I'll tell you where the UK went wrong:
Afghanistan
Iraq
Immigration policy over the past thirty odd years.It's too late to fix.

Nemo
No, the Uk, and to a certain extent France, and Germany went wrong was with the immigration policy over the last 30 years.
The first 2 causes you speak of are only contingent and do not explain why uk born citizens (most of them under 24 years old) have embraced jihadism.
Its not as if they lived under a totalitarian state. ;)

[Captain Nemo]

I'll tell you where the UK went wrong:

Afghanistan
Iraq
Immigration policy over the past thirty odd years.It's too late to fix.

Nemo
No, the Uk, and to a certain extent France, and Germany went wrong was with the immigration policy over the last 30 years.
The first 2 causes you speak of are only contingent and do not explain why uk born citizens (most of them under 24 years old) have embraced jihadism.
Its not as if they lived under a totalitarian state. ;)

The first two are used as an excuse for terrorism. I believe that the reason under 24 year olds have embraced jihadism is because the UK's immigration policy has been very lax to the extent that it has let in to the UK some very undesirable people such as extemist Islamic clerics who go on to brainwash young Muslims. This kind of extemism must be stopped in its tracks if we are to have any chance of rectifying the situation. However, in my view it is probably too late and its not going to get any better.

Nemo

[Konovalov]

Tell me about it. I manage a small logistics and airfreight business only 10 minutes from LHR and I have been in the office since 5am this morning. I recieved a fax from the DfT (Department for Transport) outlining what was happening and the raised security threat. I will post later some of that fax which makes for interesting reading.

As promised Department for Transport notification from 2am Friday morning 5-6 hours before the whole foiled plot became public notice.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e323/BenKonovalov/dft1e.jpg

I will not post the annexes relating to specific security measures we have been required to enforce for obvious reasons though I'm sure news organisations have probably got their hands on this stuff by now.

[STEED]

I am getting fed up when I hear these British Muslims bang on about my country being attacked by the U.K. & America. These stupid morons are British and yet they don't think they are British, they were born British what is the matter with them? Only today on the radio I heard one of these morons saying we are spreading are evil democracy and freedom to the Middle East.

I want to see these vile people expelled from my country forthwith they make me sick, and yet are weak Government will not act against them. The time of bending over backwards for these people is over, time for action and stuff the E.U and U.N. if they kick up a stink. :mad:

[retired1212]

Well, perhaps some followers but let's not overgeneralize.

You are right of course. Yet how many denunciations for acts of terror do you hear from the so called moderate Muslim community. The moderate community is not actively involved. By the silence their complicity is manifest. Our inability to identify the problem will not make us more secure or change the nature of Islam.
Like an addiction to alcohal or drugs, if you do not admit the problem exists you cannot fix it.

I liken my position to that of holding a wolf by the ears. I don't much like it, but I dare not let go.


some credit for that fella (probably British Pakistani) who kept his life in danger, infiltrated among retards and saved many lives? That infiltrator was a Muslim too. I'd view his efforts as a denunciation from moderate Muslims.

The problem is that Media won't invite Muslims to denounce these acts because such programs won't get enough sponsors...The idiots and retards make the headlines and normal moderate people acting normally just doesn't make a "sexy" news story.

[micky1up]

what i find typical about the airlines on this incident is that as nobody is allowed to bring on bottles of juice or water they havent gien the passangers free water or juice they are still selling them for cash

[Spoon 11th]

what i find typical about the airlines on this incident is that as nobody is allowed to bring on bottles of juice or water they havent gien the passangers free water or juice they are still selling them for cash

Well you don't take your own drinks to restaurant either.
(Unless it's permitted. In Finland it's not.)

[Yahoshua]

http://www.nypost.com/commentary/hwood_morons_suddenly_clam_up_commentary_andrea_pe yser.htm

[micky1up]

what i find typical about the airlines on this incident is that as nobody is allowed to bring on bottles of juice or water they havent gien the passangers free water or juice they are still selling them for cash

Well you don't take your own drinks to restaurant either.
(Unless it's permitted. In Finland it's not.)


no i dont and this my friend isnt a restaurant alot of people take there own water onto airlines and juice becuase they fleece you with the price i agree that they have to stop the terroists which ever way they can but not at the expense of the customer and now they are clambering for compensation for the flights they have had to cancel i wonder whos going to pay that

[Vinay]

Is England becoming Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of England. Time for the trip to the Land of the pure. (Either as Mariners or as Faithfuls).

[STEED]

Is England becoming Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of England.

That's because political madness and bending over back wards for muslims has done nothing to sort this mess out. Are politicians are so weak they dare not speak out for being branded raciest by the liberal noodles who are now in control of England, we are sitting on a time bomb, riots or civil unrest will break out when I don't know. The whole country is a mess from top to bottom and no one wants to sort it out.

[tycho102]

Is England becoming Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of England.
That's because political madness and bending over back wards for muslims has done nothing to sort this mess out. Are politicians are so weak they dare not speak out for being branded raciest by the liberal noodles who are now in control of England, we are sitting on a time bomb, riots or civil unrest will break out when I don't know. The whole country is a mess from top to bottom and no one wants to sort it out.

America's getting there, too. You all get a lot of influx from the mainland (Chunnel), that's why you're so far along.

[XabbaRus]

micky if you fly Ryan Air or EasyJet they fleece you for drinks. If you fly a decent airline like BA or KLM you get free drinks.

[Skybird]

Do like me, guys - travel by merchant ships. Makes the travel experience far more intense and actually a real experience of doing a travelling. I came around quite a bit - but I never have boarded an airliner in my life, and do not plan to do that ever! Even if wanting to visit the US or Canada, I would go there by ship. I simply do not like these big flying brickets.

I only flew with sporting planes so far, and that was very rarely. I enjoyed it a lot.

Hm, Ray Bradbury was known never to have driven a car himself, and never to have flown in a big airliner. since he is one of my favourite authors, I consider myself to be in good company!

More travel advise: when checking a foreign country, do not move faster than the speed of a bike or a horse or a mule. If you check a foreign city, do not use a taxi or a bus - reserve ten hours a day and WALK.

[Yahoshua]

Ah yes...The Illustrated man was an excellent and entertaining book. I liked the story where the southerners tatooed another guy entirely black in revenge for his racism. I'd like to try that on a few people I knew.

[Skybird]

thread hijack alert---thread hijack alert---thread hijack alert---

Currently reading again "Something wicked this way comes", which is brilliant and one of my favourites besides The Martian Chronicles, and Dandelion Wine. I also consider his humorous Irish stories to be some of his best work, at least the part of his work I like best.

thread hijack alert---thread hijack alert---thread hijack alert---

[micky1up]

micky if you fly Ryan Air or EasyJet they fleece you for drinks. If you fly a decent airline like BA or KLM you get free drinks.


indeed my friend but not everyone fly's with klm or ba i found that travelling on klm to singapore was an absolute nightmare rude staff and after i just got off to sleep they woke me up to ask if i wanted an ice cream i was very upset but i still had the ice cream lol my point being even on the so called good charters they still fleece you and alot of people avoid that by taking their own drinks a friend of mine wasnt even offered a drink on a 3 hr flight during this crisis and i bet that jolly old tax payer is going to foot the extensive bill for this even if the goverment saved alot of expensive aircraft ( to these people the pasangers dont really count except for their cash)