Unwanted truths

[Skybird]

by David Warren


I’ve touched upon “just war” several times in this space, during the last few weeks. I will continue touching it today. The issue is already an urgent one; its significance can only grow in the foreseeable future, as the encounter between fanatical Islam and the West spreads from mere terror incidents to open guerrilla warfare on various fronts.

We see in the Middle East just now, how the conflagration is spreading. Hezbollah enjoyed little support in the Arab world, when it kidnapped two Israeli soldiers, and began firing rockets at an unprecedented rate into northern Israel. The Arabs feared Hezbollah’s aggressive sponsors -- Iran, principally -- even more than they hated Israel. The Saudi and Egyptian governments were among those which actually criticized Hezbollah more sharply, at first.

But the conflict in Lebanon has gone on for nearly a month, and the hatred of Israel comes back to the fore. Both Western and Arab media have had the opportunity to direct rage against Israel, over the deaths of civilians. Neither make an issue of the fact Hezbollah’s whole fighting strategy involves the use of women and children as “human shields”, or in some cases of which I am aware, as “live bait” to lure Israeli soldiers into ambushes.

The Israeli military policy is to hold fire against any building in which soldiers believe civilians are sheltering, even if they believe Hezbollah fighters are also present. This policy goes well beyond the Geneva Conventions, which anyway don’t apply to combat with irregular fighters. Moreover, by slowing Israeli progress in destroying Hezbollah, it grants time for pressure against Israel to be built, internationally.

The entirely predictable result of the media effort, to sensationalize “Israeli atrocities” -- including one at Qana last week that was probably faked -- has been to trigger waves of anti-Semitic rage, across the Muslim world, and on the Left side of the political spectrum throughout the West. (Events, such as the shooting spree in the Seattle Jewish Federation office the Friday before last, do not give sufficient pause. But was that not a natural consequence of anti-Israel incitements?)

As I write, Shia demonstrators are now rioting against Israel in Iraq. Add this to the effect of constant terrorist attacks, on Shia targets, by Sunni “insurgents” -- supplied, like Hezbollah, by Iran and Syria -- and the prospect of a civil war becomes real. One which can only serve Iran’s interests.

Meanwhile, those of you who missed the Nuremberg rallies, and Herr Hitler's progress through Germany in the 1930s, may now review President Ahmadinejad’s latest speech this week in both video clip and translation at memritv.org. Before a huge crowd, chanting “Death to Israel”, and then “Death to America”, he dwells upon various blood-libels against the Jews, mixing these together with a reprise of what the media have been reporting from Lebanon. He boasts of Iran’s nuclear technology, and looks forward to the imminent “Fire of the Wrath”.

What difference has been made, by Israel’s, and the West’s, “just war” policies -- with either the enemy, or the media? Every allied accident is presented as purposeful, and where there was no accident, “collateral damage” is made up. Moreover, the object of Hezbollah’s fight is not to defeat Israel -- it can’t -- but rather to whip up an international “anti-Zionist” frenzy, and turn it specifically to the advantage of Iran. They “think globally, but act locally”.

The way Israel is now fighting -- and the U.S. and allies are fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan -- must be reconsidered. The enemy is himself quite indifferent to civilian suffering, as he shows by using his own people as pawns. He consciously uses our own, Western, moral reticence against us.

By openly stating that we will, under no circumstances, attack targets where civilians are present, we “hand the foe a blueprint of our acts, incite him to step over our carefully drawn line, encourage his vice and incur our own defeat.” (I am quoting a priest who has considered the broader implications of the Catholic just war doctrine.)

Even “just war” acknowledges that, as in medicine, real mercy can sometimes require ruthlessness. We have forgotten this in the West. If we want to save civilians, over the longer run, we must resolve to call the enemy’s bluff. Show him by our actions that hiding behind baby carriages will not save him. For the enemy will only stop using “human shields” when they cease to serve his purposes.



http://www.news.faithfreedom.org/index.php?name=News&file=article&sid=339

text markings in bold and italic by Skybird

[scandium]

Not these old worn out (not to mention in so many cases, totally false) excuses AGAIN.

The Human Shields lie exposed for what is:

http://www.hrw.org/english/docs/2006/08/02/lebano13902.htm

The Israeli government has blamed Hezbollah for the high civilian casualty toll in Lebanon, insisting that Hezbollah fighters have hidden themselves and their weapons among the civilian population. However, in none of the cases of civilian deaths documented in the report is there evidence to suggest that Hezbollah was operating in or around the area during or prior to the attack.

“Hezbollah fighters must not hide behind civilians – that’s an absolute – but the image that Israel has promoted of such shielding as the cause of so high a civilian death toll is wrong,” Roth said. “In the many cases of civilian deaths examined by Human Rights Watch, the location of Hezbollah troops and arms had nothing to do with the deaths because there was no Hezbollah around.”
And not only are they liars, they're hypocrits as well:

http://ancapistan.typepad.com/unfairwitness/2004/04/palestinian_boy.html

Border Police unit used four arrestees, including a 12-year old boy as human shields during the violent break up of an anti-security barrier demonstration on Thursday at Bidu. The other people arrested and used as human shields include RHR (Rabbis for Human Rights) Executive Director Rabbi Arik Ascherman, another Palestinian, a Swedish ISM activist and a 12 year old Palestinian boy.

The event occurred when local Palestinians and Israeli human rights monitors attempted to intervene after a Palestinian woman approached a group of activists and human rights monitors including Rabbi Accherman, to help her 12–year-old son who, she said was being beaten by border police.

According to Rabbi Ascherman “as we approached the police unit they tear-gassed us, without any provocation on our part. After the gas had dissipated I approached them, and asked them what was happening to the boy. At that point the commander, Pakad (Superintendent) Shahar Itzhaki told me I was under arrest for violating a military order by entering a closed military zone without permission. When I attempted to protest, he beat me, head butted me and had me handcuffed, together with a Palestinian man and a Swedish human rights activist”.

“The boy, crying, shaking from fear and eventually cold, was sat on the hood of a jeep and tied to the bars protecting the glass. The other three arrestees were bound and placed in front of a second jeep as human shields, to deter protestors from throwing stones at the jeep”.

“I repeatedly requested over the next few hours that we not be used as human shields, and that the boy receive medical attention and that the officers identify themselves. He also asked to lend his coat to the child and to stand in front of the child to protect him from stones. All these requests were met with physical and verbal threats, orders to "shut up," and/or derision”.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4314898.stm

Israel's supreme court has banned the use of Palestinian human shields in arrest raids, saying the practice violates international law.

The court issued a temporary injunction against the practice in 2002 after a teenager was killed when troops made him negotiate with a wanted militant.

Human rights groups who brought the case say the Israeli army has repeatedly violated the temporary ban.
From John Pilger, award winning war correspondent, film-maker and author:

http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/john_pilger/2006/07/the_heroes_of_hizbullah.html

I spotted another crusader seriously debating whether the Israeli army was still a "moral army". I read that one twice. In my experience of war and the Middle East, the Israeli army is one of the most craven. Every day, its soldiers humiliate defenceless, frightened old people and pregnant women at roadblocks and now its F-16 pilots drop phosphorous bombs on families fleeing in rickety vans.
And finally, exhibit D:

http://www.nationalvanguard.org/printer.php?id=9755

The Yesha Rabbinical Council announced in response to an IDF attack in Kfar Qanna that "according to Jewish law, during a time of battle and war, there is no such term as 'innocents' of the enemy."

"All of the discussions on Christian morality are weakening the spirit of the army and the nation and are costing us in the blood of our soldiers and civilians," the statement said.
Therefore if the enemy has no innocents, of what value would a human shield be to him? None.

Time to trot out some new IDF talking points Skybird.

[scandium]

Oh, and speaking of using civilians and "human shields", would you call these guys in the black hats and white shirts around the artillery, civilians, human shields, or is this just the new IDF uniform?


http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m230/jeckyll7/more20missiles20with20love_men1.jpg

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m230/jeckyll7/more20missiles20with20love_men2.jpg

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m230/jeckyll7/more20missiles20with20love_men5.jpg

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m230/jeckyll7/more20missiles20with20love_men20dan.jpg

The most moral and professional military in the world indeed. :rotfl:

[Onkel Neal]

Don't you guys ever get tired of this? :dead:

[STEED]

Don't you guys ever get tired of this? :dead:

Time out is needed it's boring alot of us. :roll: :p

[scandium]

Don't you guys ever get tired of this? :dead:

Yes. :-?

[Onkel Neal]

Yeah, maybe a lot of people are like me. I find myself getting stuck on a certain topic and before I know it, it has become my main theme. We certainly have covered the Middle East/Israel subject pretty well, maybe we can take a holiday on this for a few weeks…. :hmm:

[XabbaRus]

Frankly I am getting bored with these threads. Especially when it starts off with a copy and paste of some article that backs up what a person believes.

Boring....basically we know pretty much most people's positions here, they aren't going to change them. Move on people, there are more fun things to talk about.

[bradclark1]

He did not use his tags on this thread. Possible tags could have been:
[Boring]
[Same old stuff]
[Political]
[Middle East]
Etc, etc. Even I'm getting :roll: with this stuff.

[August]

Oh, and speaking of using civilians and "human shields", would you call these guys in the black hats and white shirts around the artillery, civilians, human shields, or is this just the new IDF uniform?

Well, i'd say that if Hezbollah were to attack that particular artillery emplacement while those civilians were there and some or all of them were killed or injured in the cross fire it'd be their own fault.

Of course i'd expect you, Scandium, the self proclaimed forum icon of impartiality, to immediately make several dozen posts containing dozens of links to Israeli biased sources and using several nazi execution pictures to compare Hezbollah to hitler and his henchmen. Right?

[Onkel Neal]

And we're off and running again.....

[Konovalov]

Frankly I am getting bored with these threads. Especially when it starts off with a copy and paste of some article that backs up what a person believes.

Boring....basically we know pretty much most people's positions here, they aren't going to change them. Move on people, there are more fun things to talk about.

I'm with you there Xabb. :yep: :yep:

I left the forum for almost two months because it was like watching repeats of a sitcom on tv that you just can't stand. Coming back here it seems to not have changed too much. You could almost confuse Subsim General Topic forums for a mirror of Jihadwatch thanks to Skybird's almost daily postings on the subject of Islam and associated topics. This sums it up for me:

http://usera.imagecave.com/DavidHeidelberg/flogger350x450.jpg

[Konovalov]

And we're off and running again.....

Giddy up horsie. :D

[STEED]

Wake me up when we get some fun on here, all this doom and gloom is making me feel sick.

[Takeda Shingen]

Wake me up when we get some fun on here, all this doom and gloom is making me feel sick.

It even becomes more than my inherent pessimism can endure. Weh! Weh!

[scandium]

And we're off and running again.....
No, I'll let his remark go since I am in agreement with the opinions expressed by the community that this is a topic that is played out and I am as happy as anyone else to now abstain from beating this same tired, dead horse over and over.

Though that abstention is conditional upon the community that expresses its disapproval of the posting of these same tired topics here being consistent in it, because if I again observe the rampant applauding and cheering on of the killing of civilians in Lebanon (or anywhere else in the ME), the calls to nuke the Middle East, and the deriding of ordinary Arabs as "sand ******s", "camel jockeys", "ragheads" and other such epithets, then I will not be able to remain silent - not if its left unchecked like it was in the past.

And for those who wonder why I single out the ME and Arabs or Muslims, and who would accuse me of bias, then I will reply beforehand that the bias was already here and that if it were any other ethnic or religious group then the bandwagon would not be here with so many aboard it. But if things have really changed here then I'm quite happy to refrain from any such further (endlessly circular and tiresome) discussions.

[Drebbel]

Don't you guys ever get tired of this? :dead:

http://www.rockingham.k12.va.us/sound_sorting/initial_consonants/y/images/yawn.jpg
huh, what you say ?

[Fish]

Frankly I am getting bored with these threads. Especially when it starts off with a copy and paste of some article that backs up what a person believes.

Boring....basically we know pretty much most people's positions here, they aren't going to change them. Move on people, there are more fun things to talk about.

When I get boring, I leave the thread for what it is. ( Is this english?:hmm:) Should be: I wont visit anymore?

[Konovalov]

And we're off and running again.....
No, I'll let his remark go since I am in agreement with the opinions expressed by the community that this is a topic that is played out and I am as happy as anyone else to now abstain from beating this same tired, dead horse over and over.

Though that abstention is conditional upon the community that expresses its disapproval of the posting of these same tired topics here being consistent in it, because if I again observe the rampant applauding and cheering on of the killing of civilians in Lebanon (or anywhere else in the ME), the calls to nuke the Middle East, and the deriding of ordinary Arabs as "sand ******s", "camel jockeys", "ragheads" and other such epithets, then I will not be able to remain silent - not if its left unchecked like it was in the past.

And for those who wonder why I single out the ME and Arabs or Muslims, and who would accuse me of bias, then I will reply beforehand that the bias was already here and that if it were any other ethnic or religious group then the bandwagon would not be here with so many aboard it. But if things have really changed here then I'm quite happy to refrain from any such further (endlessly circular and tiresome) discussions.

Well said. :yep:

[kiwi_2005]

Let talk about CHICKS!:arrgh!:

[retired1212]

Let talk about CHICKS!:arrgh!:

Allow me to start first.
Who is your favorite pornstar? :D

[scandium]

I know, I have hedging down to such a science I should take up politics. :lol:

[Sea Demon]

I know, I have hedging down to such a science I should take up politics. :lol:

Yes. But may you never actually get elected to anything. :) j/k

[Takeda Shingen]

I know, I have hedging down to such a science I should take up politics. :lol:

Yes. But may you never actually get elected to anything. :) j/k

I agree, but I kid not. Scandium, you are far too sincere and honest to be a successful politician, and would not adapt well to taking the party platform.

[Skybird]

I know, I have hedging down to such a science I should take up politics. :lol:

Yes. But may you never actually get elected to anything. :) j/k

I agree, but I kid not. Scandium, you are far too sincere and honest to be a successful politician, and would not adapt well to taking the party platform.

Yes. Better skip the party stuff and head for the UN directly. :cool:

[Takeda Shingen]

You know, the repetitiveness of the agruments themselves do not bother me. We all know where everyone stands, and have a reasonable conception of what they are going to say before they say it.

It is like watching an episode of Happy Days. You know that Fonzie is going to pull Richie into something that he shouldn't be doing, and that Mr. Cunningham is going to catch them and ground Richie for two weeks after talking things over for thirty seconds and making it all right again. Blissful predictability.

[Skybird]

You know, the repetitiveness of the agruments themselves do not bother me. We all know where everyone stands, and have a reasonable conception of what they are going to say before they say it.

It is like watching an episode of Happy Days. You know that Fonzie is going to pull Richie into something that he shouldn't be doing, and that Mr. Cunningham is going to catch them and ground Richie for two weeks after talking things over for thirty seconds and making it all right again. Blissful predictability.
Perfect for the UN! :smug: Just the part saying "making it allright again", that still gives them trouble. :lol:

[Takeda Shingen]

So, Sky, how do you feel about the UN?

[Skybird]

So, Sky, how do you feel about the UN?

they are http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/b132.gif and totally http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/b269.gif and I really feel http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/a1453.gif and http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/l40.gif and I could .http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/o49.gif They are the true and only kings of http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/a1451.gif . - UN? http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/u107.gif! I could http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/b185.gif all day long. I really hope someone just would http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/b138.gif or http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/a1411.gif them, because they make me want to be like this http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/b133.gif myself.

[STEED]

So, Sky, how do you feel about the UN?

they are http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/b132.gif and totally http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/b269.gif and I really feel http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/a1453.gif and http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/l40.gif and I could .http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/o49.gif They are the true and only kings of http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/a1451.gif . - UN? http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/u107.gif! I could http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/b185.gif all day long. I really hope someone just would http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/b138.gif or http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/a1411.gif them, because they make me want to be like this http://www.langkawi.dk/smileys/b133.gif myself.

Now that's how to be sarcastic with style.

[Ishmael]

In times of Distress and World Tension, I always take comfort in a line Lily Tomlin once wrote:

"Things will get a lot worse, before they get worse."