[Hollowtics] Do we need a seperate forum for Political discussions ? [Archive]

Drebbel

07-26-06, 03:01 AM

Personally I am getting a bit tired (to say the least) by all offending political discussions in the general forum. Every week some others countries political views or actions are being bashed or made ridiculous. Calling countries terrorists or criminals and no good seems to have evolved to a standard around here.

There for I was thinking if it would be a good idea to have a seperate forum for all political discussions ? I would really like to be freed from all the insulting and annoying threads and headers.

But hey, maybe I am just getting old :D

Drebbel (NOT with my moderator hat on)

PeriscopeDepth

07-26-06, 03:06 AM

Hell yes. With any political discussion on the general board promptly moved to the political/current events forum.

PD

LoBlo

07-26-06, 03:09 AM

Political discussions seem perfect for a "General Discussion" section, so I voted no. If there were no politics on the GD section what would be left on it? Just trash spam really... besides too much partitioning can give even a active forum too much of a feel of "deadness". I voted no.

What I have always wanted though...:hmm: ... was a "Technical" subsection (pershaps a subsection of the GD section) where we can talk sub technology and platform stats. Right now all that's being done as OT post on the DW sections.

07-26-06, 04:14 AM

Yes.

There are lots of stuff in the world other than politics to discuss about.

Music, arts, beers, good wines, girls ('n boys for girls), cars, random happenings in everyone's life, etc etc. Currently the General Topics forum IS politics forum. And it's boring. And tiresome. Those discussions don't lead anywhere, they just end up being bashfests for different countries and flame wars between people.

Might as well make a "Politicians" -member group and set the said forum visible only to those who wants to join the group :lol: I know I won't.:smug:

Gizzmoe

07-26-06, 04:43 AM

too much partitioning can give even a active forum too much of a feel of "deadness".
That´s one of the main reasons why I´ve voted No. GT is a lively forum, I really don´t want to see it split up.

If some of you find some of the topics annoying, insulting or boring just ignore them. You want to see more diverse topics? Well, then start a topic that you would like to talk about, one that has nothing to do with politics or religion.

Drebbel

07-26-06, 04:59 AM

If some of you find some of the topics annoying, insulting or boring just ignore them

Hmm, that is a real good solution. And we do not need moderators anymore either, we can just igonor all annoying and insulting threads :D

Skybird

07-26-06, 05:09 AM

No. Neal just said it yesterday, and I agree: if there is a new forum, it is only a question of time until people will complain again that that place is "out of control". Also, the GT is a lively place with a wide variety of things, and that'S what it is there for. i also think that political debates are not so much the porblem, even when going hot. The start to become a pain when one or two individuals start to think they must no longer care about basic manners and behavior since the other has an opinion that qualifies him as a dumb head that does not deserve even the minimum of politeness. Problems of the past not so much have been WHAT some one says, but HOW he deals with the others. and bad behavior can show up in any kind of discussion, not only in political ones.

Takeda Shingen

07-26-06, 05:28 AM

We have too many forums on this board as it is: A World Cup (now over) forum, a Chess Club forum (that no one uses), a Submarine Book forum (also seldom used), two SH IV forums (despite the fact that we have not seen as much as a screen shot yet) and a forum dedicated to a single Dangerous Waters campaign.

At this rate, I will have to scroll past 37 other forums just to find the one that discusses only blue jellybeans.

Drebbel

07-26-06, 05:31 AM

Gizzmoe

07-26-06, 05:35 AM

a Submarine Book forum (also seldom used)

That´s not only a book forum. "The catch-all for discussions about submarine and naval books, movies, scale models, and other media."

two SH IV forums (despite the fact that we have not seen as much as a screen shot yet)

There´s only one.

Gizzmoe

07-26-06, 05:40 AM

and totally forget about what people living in those countries will think when they read the threads.

It´s impossible to please everyone. If they don´t like what they read they can either counter it if they know better or they should simply ignore it.

Skybird

07-26-06, 05:41 AM

i also think that political debates are not so much the porblem,

I think they are, people seem to forget people live in the countries they are bashing. They talk about politics as if it was science, and totally forget about what people living in those countries will think when they read the threads.

And hey, it does not matter what Neal says. I still remember the days that there was 1 forum, amd now SubSim has 28 public forums :D
:lol:but is there so much country-specific-bashing, currently, with the exception of the war in the ME? currently things are tame on the US, on France, it seems to me. Cannot remember what the last dedicated country-nbashing thread was, with regard to these three, for example. but maybe I'm getting old and my brain already desintegrates...

Drebbel

07-26-06, 05:44 AM

We have too many forums on this board as it is: A World Cup (now over) forum

Agree, lets merge it with GT forum

a Chess Club forum (that no one uses),

Merge that one too

a Submarine Book forum (also seldom used),

That forum is quite popular and has over 1500 posts

two SH IV forums

2 ? I only count one.

(despite the fact that we have not seen as much as a screen shot yet)

Does that matter ? It is a lively forum with over 3000 posts, so it is proven there is a "market" for this forum. And we certainly can not delete the first ever SHIV forum in the world because there are no screenshots available for the public yet ! :-)

and a forum dedicated to a single Dangerous Waters campaign.

Good stuff deserves a forum. And I think some one decided this is good stuff

At this rate, I will have to scroll past 37 other forums just to find the one that discusses only blue jellybeans.

Just close the groups you are not interested in, and hey, you better sell you computer if you hate scrolling.

I also think political discussions belong in the GT, but I am totally fed up by insulting threads of people that think that the world consists of criminals and they have the solution for everything by just reading a couple of news papers, browsing the web, from their chairs.

I have made proposals to split thing up before and I know it will not make it. But maybe a thread like this will make some people realize that the world is about people, and politics too, and do not judge those people from you good old sweet home by listing every wrong step those politicians make.

We all goof up, in personal live, in business, in science, and in politics. But we all also do many good thing.

These people seem to forget they are human too and just as no good as the average human being !

:arrgh!:

Takeda Shingen

07-26-06, 05:45 AM

[quote=Takeda Shingen]That´s not only a book forum. "The catch-all for discussions about submarine and naval books, movies, scale models, and other media."

Call it whatever you like; it is still seldom used.

There´s only one.[SH IV forum]

I see that now. However, last week the SH III forum read: SH III/IV None-the-less, we still have a forum for a game that is still Pre-Alpha.

Drebbel

07-26-06, 05:53 AM

I see that now. However, last week the SH III forum read: SH III/IV None-the-less, we still have a forum for a game that is still Pre-Alpha.

Yes, that is so amazing about subsim. SubSim has a popular forum about a future game ! :D Friends and Enemy where surprised, SubSim diod it again :up:

And actually there are 5 pre-game forums on SubSim ;)

Takeda Shingen

07-26-06, 06:03 AM

Have it your way Drebbel. You feel that I seek to, somehow, undermine Neal Stevens, and regret is what I feel for having entered this discussion.

How again goes it? Ah, yes:

Geh' hin, Knecht!
Kniee vor Fricka:
meld' ihr, dass Wotans Speer
gerächt, was Spott ihr schuf. -
Geh'! - Geh'!

By my troth, I am off!

Drebbel

07-26-06, 06:21 AM

No, not afraid for undermining. Sorry mate if you got that impression, did not want to chase you away at all.

Your poem looks like a mix of African and German, I recognized a few words but it basically is still a deep dark secret.

I remember many zears ago I was against Neal to split up his forum in multiple forums. I just wanted to keep everything one big forum :-)

But now I have get accustomed to more forums and think it is a good idea. Ofcourse there are some forums that I never visit but I do support the multiple forum system, there suggested one more, the political forum. But the moment I started the thread I knew it was a lost battle.

But please don't take the SHIV forum away. I like it :-) Besides, SHIV will be announced officially soon :up:

STEED

07-26-06, 06:56 AM

I see where your coming from Drebbel, but once you start down this road you end up fragmenting the General Topics Forum and I don't think anyone wants that. Do what I do and no doubt others here as well, if your not interested in the topic don't read it or reply to it.

Torplexed

07-26-06, 07:02 AM

It's a fact of life....when things get hot in the world they are gonna get hot here.

Maybe we need a political mosh pit section. "Enter at your own risk, don't enter if easily offended and don't complain to the management"

Oberon

07-26-06, 07:09 AM

Maybe we need a political mosh pit section. "Enter at your own risk, don't enter if easily offended and don't complain to the management"

Did someone say Political moshing?!

http://politicalbetting.com/upload/Blair%20guitar.jpg

"Wild Stallions!!" *crazy solo* :rock:

scandium

07-26-06, 08:12 AM

I'm the lone (so far) "maybe voter"; I voted maybe because I can see both Neal's and Gizzmoe's points, but as Drebbel says, politics, and I'd add religion to this category (these two are increasingly intertwined here) are polarizing and turn people off.

But I remember on the Chess Server I played on, there was a General Discussion channel but politics kept coming up and aggravating many people so a Politics channel was created. Then the Iraq War became a hot topic in the Politics channel and again people got annoyed by that discussion a "Current Events" channel was created for discussion of the Iraq War (which I thought going too far).

I think a seperate Politics forum has merit only if you include religion there as well (Politics and Religion) and leave that forum at that.

Just my 2 cents.:up:

bradclark1

07-26-06, 12:14 PM

People can put POLITICS: or RELIGION: before the title to warn sensitive people or those that don't care about the subject. Have you noticed that the hotter the topic gets the number of views skyrockets? Kind of like public executions, everyone hates them and complains about them but all the seats are filled and it's standing room only.

The Noob

07-26-06, 12:22 PM

Yes, we need one. :yep:

SUBMAN1

07-26-06, 12:25 PM

I don't care either way. Some days I feel like participating and some days I just ignore the particular threads. Maybe it might be better to seperate it however so that if you feel like starting a war of words, then you know the place to go.

-S

Ducimus

07-26-06, 12:47 PM

SUBMAN1

07-26-06, 02:32 PM

Past experience in other forum communites, screams, YES there needs to be a seperate forum for poltics and religion. They are all consuming topics, and often lead to harsh feelings. It should be confined to one area, that way, it can be avoided if one wants to avoid that stuff. When its all in the general forum, you often can't avoid seeing it and getting invovled even if you didnt want to.

THe problem starts with thread hijackings, so its impossible to avoid it. Most conversations of this type I see don't start with a heavy political topic starter, just something suggestive politically, nothing more. From there is where it blows up. Not sure if a 'political' thread can stop this?

Maybe an experiment is in order. Start one and see how it goes.

-S

waste gate

07-26-06, 03:42 PM

If you have a seperate board we should not let anyone other than the admins lock other submittors from giving an opinion. And then, only for abusing other contributors. It is too easy to squash the opinions of those whom you don't agree with.

Ducimus

07-26-06, 03:57 PM

THe problem starts with thread hijackings, so its impossible to avoid it. Most conversations of this type I see don't start with a heavy political topic starter, just something suggestive politically, nothing more. From there is where it blows up.

I think thats because people have strong feelings/opinions/agenda's on certain topics, and it doesnt take much to give someone a excuse to vent it.

Honestly thoguh, all poltical and religous "discussions" are utterly pointless. Views in those topics are often derived from a persons core values. So they're not likey to change their views. Which to my understanding is the whole point. Regardless, all that ends up happening is people stating, and restating their view, 10 different ways. Kinda like a couple of Rams butting heads again and again and again.
http://www.milosphotos.com/wildlife1/dallrams.jpg

VipertheSniper

07-26-06, 04:37 PM

THIS (http://forum.rscnet.org) is a fragmented forum

Granted there are more active members than here, but the index page is HUGE

blue3golf

07-26-06, 05:04 PM

Yes, seems thats all anyone has anything to say about anymore is the political "turmoil" that is going on somewhere. Everyones an expert.

mapuc

07-26-06, 05:28 PM

As a veteran when it comes to debating I can tell you this.

It doesn't matter which political forum you're in or which country it is, Denmark, Sweden and so on. there's always person who calls all the others idiot a.s.o. when they can't debate or augmenting,

Markus

bradclark1

07-26-06, 06:36 PM

Yes, seems thats all anyone has anything to say about anymore is the political "turmoil" that is going on somewhere. Everyones an expert.
Thats probably because there is a lot of political turmoil going on. :know:
The world has not been this energized since WW2, so yes there are a lot of opinions.

Onkel Neal

07-26-06, 07:42 PM

The important thing to remember is

The People on this Forum are your Friends, not Your Enemies, even if they have Different Opinions.

Be nice!:yep: And it never hurts to say you're sorry if you go too far.

blue3golf

07-26-06, 08:02 PM

Bradclark1 wrote:

Thats probably because there is a lot of political turmoil going on. :know:
The world has not been this energized since WW2, so yes there are a lot of opinions.

There is no more going on now, especially in the middle east that hasn't been going on for decades. The only reason it seems like more is happening is because now we're in the information age where nothing happens without a camera or reporter around. It's just in your face more than it used to be.

bradclark1

07-26-06, 08:48 PM

No. I think not. Whats happening today will have far reaching affects on how we will live our future.

scandium

07-26-06, 09:48 PM

No. I think not. Whats happening today will have far reaching affects on how we will live our future.

Agreed. This is more than the usual turmoil in the region and 3 of the regional powers there also happen to have nukes, and two of them (Pakistan and India) have little love for one another and an ongoing, unresolved dispute with a recent terrorist attack thrown into the mix that has India claiming Pakistan's fingerprints are all over it... and that is only the tip of the iceburg in the current madness going on over there.

blue3golf

07-26-06, 10:07 PM

What happened during the Cold War had far reaching effects on our lives as well as any other major event. I agree this will affect us as well, all I'm saying is that everything seems bigger because its plastered everywhere you look now. And the nukes, they're still just a deterrant, even the madmen out there won't use them for the simple fact they don't want the consequences if they did. Just alot of people flexing their muscles and showing off what they got.

Gorduz

07-27-06, 04:44 AM

Yes I think we need a political forum. I get tired wathcing all the new threads on religion and terrorism. Sure I could just ignore them, but that would almost mean to ignore this forum entierly.

When I first joined this site(way before 9.11) I liked the political discussions here. They had a good spread in topics and seriosness. And you could acctually participate in the discussion. Now every topic has 5 pages of posts BEFORE I even see it. Sure you can say it my fault I dont go in and check subsim 5 times a day, but in fact I have other things to do.

So I would greatly appreciate a political forum, so I don't have to read the same discussions over and over again.

Skybird

07-27-06, 05:08 AM

Brad's idea to put a signal like POL or REL into the headline of a topic maybe is not a bad one. The past weeks I have more reacted to threads than starting politcal threads myself, but when i do in the future, I will pratice like this. I encourage others to do the same. that way, desinterested people are informed from the beginning and can stay out und must not enter to find out. New visitors of the forum should be informed of this practice, of course. Moderators could add the hint into the headline.