Transiting the Kiel Canal in realtime!

[WargamerScott]

I have just installed the Grey Wolves super-mod and I am loving it! What a great improvement to the game! Thanks so much to everyone who contributed their efforts to make this a reality! :up:

Since installing it, and starting my career over (back to 1939), I decided to give the new Kiel Canal mod a try as it would save so many miles off my trip. However, it appears that the Kiel Canal has proved to be something of a trap as it is taking me forever to navigate it! For some reason, the vast majority of the distance I have covered (about the first 1/3) has been done at 1X---the game will not let me accelerate the time except for very brief periods. I thought you were only forced to go in realtime when there were nearby ships. Despite being alone in the canal, I am still forced to travel at 1X. Is there a way around this? At this rate, I should get out of the canal in about four to five hours of real-world time! Ouch! LOL!

Just curious.

Thanks!

[Sir Big Jugs]

You are too close to shore. Time compression automatically drops here.

Use SH3Commander to change the "When near land" option to more than the default, which is 4x.

[Henry Wood]

LOL! Yes, I found that too, though I did enjoy my first trip or two through it. Now I employ a Kiel Canal Pilot and sit back for a few minutes while we transit. :smug: You must change your time compression for when near land and I have done this using SC3 Commander. I have eventually upped it to 64x for near land and that is the slowest I go through. If I have plotted my course very carefully to be as near midstream as possible, I can navigate other parts of it at 2048x! (Always on the nav map, of course for the whole trip.) HTH.

[HunterICX]

:nope: I never ever go throught that canal again....i,m not going to sit 2 hours to get my boat out of that canal...I just go around it with 1024X TC :yep:

[Henry Wood]

:nope: I never ever go throught that canal again....i,m not going to sit 2 hours to get my boat out of that canal...I just go around it with 1024X TC :yep:

But you can go through it as fast as you like if you increase TC to 1024x for near land and only use that increase when in the canal. I like using it because it saves fuel for my Type IIA out of Kiel base.

[Stiebler]

The new Kiel canal and other canals in Grey Wolves and NYGM (and perhaps other mods) require users to download a revised file Terraindata.bfd (among other files) which occupies a staggering 242 MegaBytes *itself* (113 MBytes when compressed with 7-Zip).

This is a major reason why NYGM and GW are so huge to download and such a pain for those with dial-up modems. The benefit is, as stated by users in this thread, completely marginal. No one is likely to use the Kiel Canal after 1940, and the only way to get a speedy transit is to alter the time compression while traversing the canal. Then alter it back again afterwards.

I really would like to see this near-worthless burden removed.

Stiebler.

[bigboywooly]

The new Kiel canal and other canals in Grey Wolves and NYGM (and perhaps other mods) require users to download a revised file Terraindata.bfd (among other files) which occupies a staggering 242 MegaBytes *itself* (113 MBytes when compressed with 7-Zip).

This is a major reason why NYGM and GW are so huge to download and such a pain for those with dial-up modems. The benefit is, as stated by users in this thread, completely marginal. No one is likely to use the Kiel Canal after 1940, and the only way to get a speedy transit is to alter the time compression while traversing the canal. Then alter it back again afterwards.

I really would like to see this near-worthless burden removed.

Stiebler.

Yes I grant you its a slow process but if you are playing with limited fuel its a godsend
I normally plot my way thru Kiel and bugger off and do something else
Let the thing run itself to the end

[Fab]

The last thing I'd call the Kiel Canal is nearly worthless. That has to be one of the best features of the large mods. I am not averse to playing Type IIs out of Kiel, and believe me, that canal can add a week to your patrol. It takes one day to get through the canal on 1/3 ahead, it takes at least three to get out around Denmark. Double that for the trip back and you've added a week to patrol times.

It should have been included in the stock game. (I wonder how many times that has been said.)

[HunterICX]

I cant go 1024 throught the Kiel Canal..It turns on and off orange when I try go higher the 4X TC

[Henry Wood]

I cant go 1024 throught the Kiel Canal..It turns on and off orange when I try go higher the 4X TC

That is because you must have TC set to 4x when 'near land'. I changed it using SH3 Commander to 64x. I have found that quite safe as I would never try to run at a fast TC when in any other coastal waters.

Also, if you zoom right in on the canal when plotting a course through it and mark your course as close to the centre of the waterway as you can, there will be many stretches of the canal when you can move through at your max TC.

[irish1958]

The NYGM Tonnage War 2.0 mod has a feature to set the patrol course through the Keil Canal. If one uses this and sets the time compression via SH3CMDR to a reasonable level, the canal is a godsend as it adds a week to your patrol in a type II.
I would hope the GW team comes up with some sort of auto-plot for the canal.
When did the canal become unsafe for travel during WW2? And is there any records available that show it was used by U-Boats? After the French bases became available why would it be used?
irish1958

[Henry Wood]

I would hope the GW team comes up with some sort of auto-plot for the canal.

In RL commanders who were unfamiliar with the canal used the services of a Pilot; perhaps a mod of 'Use Canal Pilot' could teleport users from one end to the other if they wished to use it?


And is there any records available that show it was used by U-Boats?
irish1958

There is a report in 'First U-Boat Flotilla' (Lawrence Paterson) of U-13, Kplt. Karl Daublebsky von Eichain, returning to base in September 1939 after a mine laying patrol and developing serious engine trouble on the home run. After on-board repairs, the engines could only be run at full speed or not at all and Kplt. von Eichain requested permission to pass through the waterway at top speed instead of keeping to the usual speed limit. The authorities refused, thinking it was a crew trying it on to get ashore as soon as possible, so the commander immediately requested a tug to tow him through the canal. After further radio discussions, U-13 was finally allowed to proceed unaided at full speed through the '99-kilometre canal' and the 'remarkable sight of a small boat hurtling to her mooring against Tirpitz Pier in a flurry of spray was long remembered by onlookers on shore.'
(The book states '99-kilometre canal' but the one I pass through is nearer 150km, speaking from memory?):hmm:

[bigboywooly]

The NYGM Tonnage War 2.0 mod has a feature to set the patrol course through the Keil Canal. If one uses this and sets the time compression via SH3CMDR to a reasonable level, the canal is a godsend as it adds a week to your patrol in a type II.
I would hope the GW team comes up with some sort of auto-plot for the canal.
When did the canal become unsafe for travel during WW2? And is there any records available that show it was used by U-Boats? After the French bases became available why would it be used?
irish1958

Even after the French bases were open new boats would have still had to shipped out from Kiel to operational flotillas

Deutsche Werke, Kiel (http://uboat.net/technical/shipyards/dw-k.htm) (69)
Germaniawerft, Kiel (http://uboat.net/technical/shipyards/germania.htm) (131)
Howaldtswerke, Kiel (http://uboat.net/technical/shipyards/howald-k.htm) (31)

Even the Bismark used the canal on its way from Hamburg to Kiel and back



15 September 1940: The Bismarck leaves Hamburg for the first time. At 1658 hours, while steaming down the Elbe, collides with the bow tug Atlantik but neither ship is damaged, and at 1902, the Bismarck anchors in Brunsbüttel roads. During the night of 15/16 September, while anchored, there is an air raid alarm in which the anti-aircraft battery expends 13 x 10.5 cm, 136 x 3.7 cm, and 191 x 2 cm projectiles. No success observed. 16-17 September 1940: The battleship passes through the Kiel Canal assisted by tugboats. At 1448 on the 17th, the Bismarck enters the Kiel-Holtenau sluice, leaves the Kiel Canal, and then comes alongside Scheerhafen, Kiel.

Makes you wonder why my poor uboot has to go at T\C 4 because land is so close when that great big fat battleship made it
More than once

[Sailor Steve]

I completely agree with Fab (and others): the Canal is one of the best features of the game. If you live to play games and kill things, sure it's a waste of time; but if you sometimes wish you were a real sub commander, and leave the harbors in real time looking at the ships, then the Canal is lots of fun.

No, I don't do it in real time, I use 64x, but I come back to real time to look around at almost every town along the way. I love the Kiel Canal-I just wish it had the locks I saw in the photographs of the real thing.

And the Brunsbuttel docks properly located inside the locks.

[irish1958]

Vely intelesting!
Thanks for the info all
irish1958

[andy_311]

I never sucessfully gone through the canal half way through it I get a message sunk by collision.

[Fab]

On the Elbe (west) side of the canal there are docks and a town on the north shore. If you do the entire canal on the F5 screen, odds are the way I suspect most people would plot a course, you will crash into the docks and sink.

Transit the whole canal, but as you are nearing the western end, stay topside and keep an eye out. You'll see the docks and know where not to plot a course.

[bigboywooly]

On the Elbe (west) side of the canal there are docks and a town on the north shore. If you do the entire canal on the F5 screen, odds are the way I suspect most people would plot a course, you will crash into the docks and sink.

Transit the whole canal, but as you are nearing the western end, stay topside and keep an eye out. You'll see the docks and know where not to plot a course.

My docks show up on the F5 screen so I plot a course thru it anyway - all 3 of them in fact

http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/2343/screenhunter67dc.jpg

[Stiebler]

I've seen nothing here to change my earlier opinion that the mod is more trouble than it is worth.

Those who talk about saving fuel can always dock at Wilhelmshafen to refuel after going round Denmark. Then use SH3Commander or SH3Patrol to allow only one day's docking (or modify the basic.cfg file manually for time spent in base). This will actually be quicker in real time, unless you like crashing into a shoreline at tc=128 (or more). It is true that Observer's NYGM Kiel Canal mod solves the additional time-consuming problem of marking waypoints all over the place.

It is clear that some people really do like the Kiel Canal mod (but I'll bet they don't use a dial-up modem!). Fair enough, but all that this proves is that it should be available as an optional extra for those who want it, not as part of the standard main mod package. Then overlay it onto your major mod with JSGME. The Kiel Canal is a solution in search of a problem.

Stiebler.

[ref]

[quote=irish1958]
(The book states '99-kilometre canal' but the one I pass through is nearer 150km, speaking from memory?):hmm:

That was also the number I got when I make the canal, but the terrain in SH3 is 'a bit' distorted..., also it's about three times wider than in real life, also due to SH3 terrain limitations.

Ref

[ref]

I've seen nothing here to change my earlier opinion that the mod is more trouble than it is worth.

Those who talk about saving fuel can always dock at Wilhelmshafen to refuel after going round Denmark. Then use SH3Commander or SH3Patrol to allow only one day's docking (or modify the basic.cfg file manually for time spent in base). This will actually be quicker in real time, unless you like crashing into a shoreline at tc=128 (or more). It is true that Observer's NYGM Kiel Canal mod solves the additional time-consuming problem of marking waypoints all over the place.

It is clear that some people really do like the Kiel Canal mod (but I'll bet they don't use a dial-up modem!). Fair enough, but all that this proves is that it should be available as an optional extra for those who want it, not as part of the standard main mod package. Then overlay it onto your major mod with JSGME. The Kiel Canal is a solution in search of a problem.

Stiebler.

You'll also loose the Scapa Flow corrections.

Ref

[Seminole]

The Kiel Kanal is a superb addition for those willing to learn to use it properly.

[U-Bones]

The NYGM Tonnage War 2.0 mod has a feature to set the patrol course through the Keil Canal. If one uses this and sets the time compression via SH3CMDR to a reasonable level, the canal is a godsend as it adds a week to your patrol in a type II.
I would hope the GW team comes up with some sort of auto-plot for the canal.
When did the canal become unsafe for travel during WW2? And is there any records available that show it was used by U-Boats? After the French bases became available why would it be used?
irish1958

I am still trying to understand why another week is needed to expend the measley loadout of a II. Perhaps we should check our sailors for suntans, yes ?

[bigboywooly]

There is a seperate mod which adds the Kiel canal
Was available on uboat.realsimulation.com
Forget the name now

[ref]

There is a seperate mod which adds the Kiel canal
Was available on uboat.realsimulation.com
Forget the name now

http://files.filefront.com/Kiel_Scapa_Suez_terrain_modzip/;4821003;;/fileinfo.html

Ref

[bigboywooly]

Ah thanx ref
Not that I need it as I have in GW - just saying for those that dont
Does that one include the 3 ports along the canal as well ?

[ref]

Ah thanx ref
Not that I need it as I have in GW - just saying for those that dont
Does that one include the 3 ports along the canal as well ?
No, they're just the terrain mod, I'll have to look for CCIP's mod, when I find it I'll post the link.

Ref

[Henry Wood]

[quote=irish1958]
(The book states '99-kilometre canal' but the one I pass through is nearer 150km, speaking from memory?):hmm:

That was also the number I got when I make the canal, but the terrain in SH3 is 'a bit' distorted..., also it's about three times wider than in real life, also due to SH3 terrain limitations.

Ref

I'm glad to meet the canal creator and thank you very much for your work. It is a great boon to us Type IIA sailors. The reason I mentioned the different lengths is I was wondering if some big changes had been made to the canal post WWII? I must go searching online.

[WargamerScott]

All things considered, I find the Kiel Kanal to be too much of a pain to use. Is there a way to delete this mod once installed with the GW super-mod?

[cynos]

You'll also loose the Scapa Flow corrections.

Ref

I was quite gutted when I tried to escape via Kirk Sound and found that someone had built the Churchill Barriers about a year too early... then I downloaded Grey Wolves, solely for the eastern approaches to Scapa.