Legit tactic?

[Scorpius]

Is this a legitimate tactic?

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/2806/tactic5wr.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Normally when i find a convoy, i shoot the lead escort, then empty my fore and aft torpedos on targets, then dive to 25m and hide underneath one of the c2's or c3's until all my torpedos are reloaded.

The other escorts just lag behind and depth charge where i fired the torpedos from.

As soon as i am ready to fire again with all tubes i come out from my hiding place and let loose with everything i have got. And of course if i have any fish left, i go back under a c2 or c3.

Now my question is this: was this a real life tactic hiding underneath an enemy freighter for either safety or reloading?

[Salvadoreno]

not really. Neither is taking out the lead escort.. I never heard of any uboot hiding under a ship, but its possible.. i guess.. I never do it in sh3. I just shoot, and dive deep and away.

[The_Blockade_Runner]

Thats freakin aweaome :rock: :rock:

How do you line up directly under the c2? Do you have to use the Gods eye view? :hmm:

Id like to try that

[Scorpius]

The observation periscope is very useful. The good thing about this is that you can go flank and have the music blaring away and the escorts either wont hear you or cant do anything about you.

[Umfuld]

I don't buy it. If you've shot ships in that convoy already won't the ship above be zig zagging?

[Scorpius]

Yes they zig zag for a long while, so its hard to stay under. They only go at about 6-7 knots so its not too difficult. But, after a while without sight of my ship, they go back to normal straight sailing. Remember they cant see whats underneath them.

[Umfuld]

Fair enough.

[Keelbuster]

Yes they zig zag for a long while, so its hard to stay under. They only go at about 6-7 knots so its not too difficult. But, after a while without sight of my ship, they go back to normal straight sailing. Remember they cant see whats underneath them.

If it works then it works. I feel like it would be a less-than ideal situation from a manual-targetting point of view. To keep up with them you have to go flank, and hence they may detect you and start swerving before you get into a proper firing position. But maybe not. I was able to do something like this on a 5kt convoy in high seas, though I wasn't underneath a particular ship; I just kept up with them in between the convoy lanes. Because of the bad weather they didn't hear me at all (ahead one third).

Kb

[Scorpius]

Mate, i said you CAN go flank and they wont hear you. Not 'you must go flank to keep up'! Trust me, they are as deaf as a post when your beneath them.

[Umfuld]

Kelsey Grammer did this in that silly sub movie. Down Periscope, I think.

[Sailor Steve]

It is possible, and submarine captains in both theaters did it, but very occassionally. It works best if you're in a harbor and know can hide under a parked ship.

If you do it using external or God's Eye map view, it should be ovbious it's cheating, because that is something they couldn't do in real life.

[deadactionman]

Sometimes after I sink a protected ship in shallow water, I position myself along side the wreckage so the escorts can't use their DCs... it works a treat in Scapa Flow.

Eventually, they seem to lose interest a resume course. :yep:

[tbarak]

It's a good tactic in SH3, I've used it lots, but I couldn't see it working in real life. A u-boat's submerged speed is a misery 3 - 5 knots while destroys can do almost 30 knots. Also the u-boat has to eventually surface to recharge its batteries and replenish its oxygen. The destroyers would simply wait the u-boat out and kill it once it surfaced. In SH3 I've noticed the destroyers will give up pretty easily and eventually take off. Not in the real life though.

But it gets harder as the war progresses. I'm in late '43 and the days of waltzing into a convoy, wreaking havoc and slipping merrily away are definitely over. I'm not sure whether it's this particular convoy I'm shadowing right now, but the destroyers are absolute killers. I've slipped in once and got one tanker, but they get me every time. I've tried every trick in the book to no avail. Of course having perfect weather (0 wind and 0 fog) for four days doesn't help. Never get that good weather when I need it. I'll try in heavy fog but geezus it seems almost impossible at this point.

[Khayman]

not really. Neither is taking out the lead escort.

You haven't been reading the U-Boat Commander's Handbook that Donitz kindly gave you. :D

"Troublesome sweepers of the enemy escort must be destroyed, if an opportunity offers to attack them. The destruction of covering ships, above all, of cruiser escorts, destroyers etc., is in the interest of all the submarines which are already in contact with the convoy, or are to be used to attack it" Taking out escorts is not only fine, it's your duty.

I've never heard of U-Boats reloading while hiding under surface ships. Reloading takes some time, and even slow ships will be doing some 6 or 7 knots. You'll end up with little battery power for when you have to withdraw.

[Scorpius]

Ahh that is while i have a full battery before i enter a convoy, and the fact that i just dive to my max depth when i am ready to depart. The destroyers never have a chance.

[Salvadoreno]

i=pwned.

But i was pretty certain Donitz also said (in later war years) that sub commanders are to avoid contact at all times with destroyers. Only in very favorable were uboots to attack escorts. VERRRRY favorable rare situations..

[Khayman]

i=pwned.

But i was pretty certain Donitz also said (in later war years) that sub commanders are to avoid contact at all times with destroyers. Only in very favorable were uboots to attack escorts. VERRRRY favorable rare situations..

Could be. The Handbook is the 1943 edition, later ones may have said something different about escorts. I personally give them a wide berth. So even though I quoted the handbook I don't really follow it :D

[Dowly]

Kelsey Grammer did this in that silly sub movie. Down Periscope, I think.

Wasnt it 'Up Periscope'? Anyways, I liked the movie. :rotfl:

[robj250]

Forgive me for being stupid, but how did you get a snap of your sub submerged. I've tried F12, but can't see under the surface waves.

[bigboywooly]

if you use the > button it will show all ships close to you with yours being first

click on the screen and you can move around your sub outside

[Scorpius]

Forgive me for being stupid, but how did you get a snap of your sub submerged. I've tried F12, but can't see under the surface waves.


Ahh another realism buff. You have your underwater settings up so far you couldnt see a mine if it was 2 feet in front of your boat.

I have my underwater settings set for 'realistic for a game' so that i can see underwater - just not that far. Hit the . key to go to camera mode which is locked to the boat. If you keep pressing the . key you will go through all the detectable boats in the vicinity.

[Sailor Steve]

Kelsey Grammer did this in that silly sub movie. Down Periscope, I think.

Wasnt it 'Up Periscope'? Anyways, I liked the movie. :rotfl:
It was 'Down Periscop'. 'Up Periscope was a pretty good action movie made in the early '60s with James Garner.

[Sailor Steve]

Forgive me for being stupid, but how did you get a snap of your sub submerged. I've tried F12, but can't see under the surface waves.
Use the keypad: 1 moves you down, 7 is up, 4 is left, 6 is right, 8 moves you closer, 2 moves you back.

[Type941]

Sometimes after I sink a protected ship in shallow water, I position myself along side the wreckage so the escorts can't use their DCs... it works a treat in Scapa Flow.

Eventually, they seem to lose interest a resume course. :yep:


:up: :hulk:

http://img480.imageshack.us/img480/1667/scrrenshot94rq.jpg[/list]

[robj250]

Type941. Cannot find your latest SH3 Skin as listed in your post.

[Rosencrantz]

About hiding under the ship:

I think in RL the problem would be "streams" caused by the propeller(s) of the ship above. Submarine near the surface vessel could lost it's depth control and colide with the ship.

During the Cold War years russians sometimes tried to "fool" the SOSUS by giving a "whale" to a SSBN boat = The submarine meat a freighter and followed it in the close range over the SOSUS line. After that the sub and the surface unit separated. This tactic wasn't really effectiv neither the captains of the SSBNs liked it because of the risk of collision.

So, if I'm under the convoy in the game, I try to find caps between the ships. No hiding under the vessels.

Greetings,

-RC-

[Heibges]

i=pwned.

But i was pretty certain Donitz also said (in later war years) that sub commanders are to avoid contact at all times with destroyers. Only in very favorable were uboots to attack escorts. VERRRRY favorable rare situations..

Could be. The Handbook is the 1943 edition, later ones may have said something different about escorts. I personally give them a wide berth. So even though I quoted the handbook I don't really follow it :D

I would agree that due to the nature of the game design, this particular tactical rule from the Uboat Commanders Handbook makes the game less releastic.

[tbarak]

I don't know, shooting at escorts seems like a last ditch move. I mean, they're worth next to nothing in tonnage and renown. I can see in early war if say there's a juicy convoy (without deck guns), the weather is calm and there's maybe one or two escorts. I would sink them and have a field day. They're easy to hit and normally take one torpedo each. But the convoy I'm working now has six of them and the merchants have deck guns. No way to slip in unless I get some really foul weather.

[Seminole]

It is possible, and submarine captains in both theaters did it, but very occassionally. It works best if you're in a harbor and know can hide under a parked ship.




What in game harbours are that deep?

The few I have been into were usually only 12m deep or so with hardly enough depth to submerge much less "hide under" a merchantman. :shifty:

[Yahoshua]

I might as well pop my question:

When I receive reports of a convoy, I uasually sprint ahead of the convoy (as far as 100 km to do so) and then engage the convoy.

After I'm done loosing my fish I plot an approximate direction they'll be heading, surface a safe distance from the convoy (usually about 8km south/north and behind them) and sprint on average 40-50 km ahead of the convoy and listen for escorts/merchants and position my sub. When I have an opputunity I then attack them again.

I stop when I run out of torps. I suppose one could consider it a cheap substitute for the wolf-pack tactic, and a good deal of the time that when I've re-positioned myself (a good 2 or 3 hours after the first attack) the convoy is making a bee-line towards port.

Does anyone else use this tactic? I called it the "Leapfrog Tactic"