Ayaan Hirsi Ali Again!

[Abraham]

Just in: Ayaan Hirsi Ali will announce tomorrow that she will leave her seat in the Dutch Parliament.

Ayaan hit the news again last week when she admitted that she had lied about her name and her personal circumstances in order to get the Dutch nationality. Her political party, the VVD (right wing libereal party) knew about this when she became a candidate for the Parliament. The minister of immigration policy is the hard-line Rita Verdonk from the same party, who told Ayaan that she would have refused her the Dutch nationality had she been a minister at that time. Recently a Turkish family was refused the Dutch nationality and sent back when it was found that they had lied during the immigration/naturalisation procedure.

Ayaan is invited to join the American Enterprise Institute in Washington per September 1, 2006.

One thing is for sure: never a dull moment with Ayaan!

[bradclark1]

I'll bite. Who is she?

[bradclark1]

She's a critic of islam so must not be too bad.

[Abraham]

I'll bite. Who is she?
Ask The Avon Lady, ask Skybird, ask Google...

She is an extremely outspoken and an attractive - even charismatic - black (former Muslim) woman who was sexually mutulated in Somalia, was about to be married off to - I think - an uncle, when she fled to Germany and consequently to Holland.
She worked as a cleaning woman and later as translator for threathened Muslim women while studying political science. She became a member of the centre-left Socialist (PvdA) Party think tank but changed in three years ago her political affiliation to the centre-right VVD.
She wrote the script for the controversial movie "Submission" which was directed by one of her friends, cineast and publisher Theo van Gogh, who was consequently murdered as an act of terror by a Muslim fanatic. A death threath-letter to Ayaan was stabbed on the chest of Van Gogh. She is now under permanent police protection. She has written books about the suppressive character of Islam towards women and homosexuals.
During the recent "Cartoon-farce" she publicly defended the right to offend religions at a press conference in Berlin.
Less than a month ago some neighbours won a court case against the Dutch State to force Ayaan to abandon the "safe house" she is living in due to the extreme inconvenience it caused to her neighbours.

[TteFAboB]

You lead by example.

She must apologize and make clear she regrets lying, and hopefully discourage similar acts by other desperate Somalies.

Afterall, we're lied to all the time about Islam and Somalia.

I guess she made a bad choice, there are easier European nations to immigrate to and get citizenship, The nether underworld of Holland is certainly among the tougher ones, since all citizens must be able to put their finger in the hole on the dam.

[Wim Libaers]

The minister of immigration policy is the hard-line Rita Verdonk from the same party, who told Ayaan that she would have refused her the Dutch nationality had she been a minister at that time.

As it should be. Is it possible to revoke her citizenship now that it is known to have been obtained through fraudulent means?

[Abraham]

This thing is turning into a disgusting story by the hour in Holland.

Rita Verdonk, the Minister of Integration and the "Iron Lady" of the VVD, who is now in a (primary) race to become party leader, published today the preliminary result of her investigation. It turns out that Ayaan Hirsi Ali, of her same party, illegally got the Dutch citizenship. Ayaan will have 6 weeks to apeal.
It has unknown but extremely serious consequences that a member of the Dutchg Parliament will be considered an illegal. Tomorrow Ayaan will give up her seat in Parliament. The consequence will also be that her 24/7 protection will be revoked and that she will be easy meat for radical Muslims who have attempted to kill her before. She will probably become stateless, which means that she will not be allowed to enter into the USA and she might lose her job at the American Enterprises Institute think tank since she will not be the coveted Member of Parliament with a Dutch passport. There might even be a criminal prosecution against her.

Mind you, all this by a Minister - Rita Verdonk - who has been caught lying to Parliament time after time.

In my opinion Hirsi Ali has lost the value she had for her VVD party three years ago an is now being given an imperial dump to promote a would be VVD party leader.
Ayaan Hirsi Ali is certainly a controversial figure, but treating her like this after the valid contributions she made to this country - at a very stiff personal price - is a bloody shame in my opinion. It shows that in Holland the rules are made not to serve the people, but the other way around.

Don't try to be someone special in Holland. We have our rules to make you as mediocre as the rest of us.
:down:

[Drebbel]

The consequence will also be that her 24/7 protection will be revoked and that she will be easy meat for radical Muslims who have attempted to kill her befo

The Dutch government is responsible for the safety of all people in our country. Citizans/Criminals/Tourists/Illegals, that does not matter. If she needs 24/7 protection she will get it !

[Wim Libaers]

Mind you, all this by a Minister - Rita Verdonk - who has been caught lying to Parliament time after time.


That the other side is worthy of contempt too doesn't mean the fraud was OK.

[Abraham]

@ Drebbel:
The consequence will also be that her 24/7 protection will be revoked and that she will be easy meat for radical Muslims who have attempted to kill her before.
The Dutch government is responsible for the safety of all people in our country. Citizans/Criminals/Tourists/Illegals, that does not matter. If she needs 24/7 protection she will get it !
Really?
Well, purely theoretical this is true. Practice is much different though.
With the constant gulf of liquidations in Amsterdam it shows that the State doesn't take the safety of all people very serious... Solving those liquidations was never a priority till the liquidation of Wim Endstra in 2004.

@ Wim Libaers:

Mind you, all this by a Minister - Rita Verdonk - who has been caught lying to Parliament time after time.


That the other side is worthy of contempt too doesn't mean the fraud was OK.
Yes, but then Rita Verdonk should be merciless to all who defrauded during their immigration and naturalisation procedure. And apply the same standards to herself, each time she lies to Parliament and is forced to admit it. Mind you, Ayaan came to Holland in a period that a little lie for good reasons was hardly frowned upon, and often encouraged by immigration lawyers, social workers etc. Furthermore, Ayaan never made a secret of the fact that she had lied, dhe told it in a TV shop several years ago and Rita Verdonk and her party knew it.
Ayaan has been too outspoken in the eyes of many - whit which I can agree. Now she is a liability for some in her party and a chance for Rita Verdonk to show off how tough she is.
Thanks Ayaan and bye, bye...

[Sixpack]

Don't try to be someone special in Holland. We have our rules to make you as mediocre as the rest of us.
:down:

Bingo !

Narrowminded mediocre friggin little Holland :down:

But that being said: Ayaan really has to go without honor. She lied and had her share of fun in Holland. Yessir ! She is a masochistoc cynic at worst and masochistic idealist at best and in it mostly for her personal gain. Simple as that.

Anyway, screw politicians, screw lying immigrants (be it pro of con islam of whatever). Bye bye

[Wim Libaers]

Yes, but then Rita Verdonk should be merciless to all who defrauded during their immigration and naturalisation procedure.

Of course.

And apply the same standards to herself, each time she lies to Parliament and is forced to admit it.

While that would be nice, I'm afraid this is the kind of thing most citizens would like, but that might have serious problems being accepted in parliament, regardless of who wins the elections.

Mind you, Ayaan came to Holland in a period that a little lie for good reasons was hardly frowned upon, and often encouraged by immigration lawyers, social workers etc.

Which is part of the reason why there are serious immigrant problems in some regions, so it's good to abandon that system and correct some errors of the past.

Furthermore, Ayaan never made a secret of the fact that she had lied, dhe told it in a TV shop several years ago and Rita Verdonk and her party knew it.

The problem should have been solved earlier. But better late than never.

Ayaan has been too outspoken in the eyes of many - whit which I can agree. Now she is a liability for some in her party and a chance for Rita Verdonk to show off how tough she is.
Thanks Ayaan and bye, bye...

Standard politics.

[Skybird]

In this context:

http://online.wsj.com/article_email/SB114782915681854954-lMyQjAxMDE2NDE3ODgxMjg5Wj.html

[The Avon Lady]

Goodbye, Holland.

Abraham, take a hint.

[Skybird]

http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0519/p09s01-coop.html

After the cartoon row, a lot of talking there has been on the shameful behavior of Europe not giving the Danish the needed ammount of support. I wonder why noone talks of the shame, that certain people thankfully take the fact that she lied (to escape her former home and find a new one in the Netherlands) as a foul excuse to remove her, practically, and spread the impression that peace and tolerance, and law and order as well, have won over an evil that threatened to disrupt the silence of the European idyll. Now she is leaving, problem solved, one more Islam-critical voice successfully silenced and moved out.

Just learned these days that H.-P. Raddatz, very critical and sharp Islam-expert whose books I know very well and share their opinions completely, also has left Europe a while ago and settled down in the US. He lived under threats of murder for years, and was heavily bodyguarded by the police which now is said to have told him they cannot guarantee his safety any longer. From an editor of a regional newspaper, whom I know from former work and still am in contact with, I was told in private, that amongst insiders there is another story told: that there is a governmental order to stop protection for Raddatz, which can only be motivated by getting rid of him, for his constant criticism is too uncomfortable for Europe's wish to become Islamic.

Who knows - it would be ironic if in twenty years or so I find myself, too, begging America for political asylum in order to escape Islam. :88)

[Abraham]

Goodbye, Holland.

Abraham, take a hint.
Not so pessimistic Avon Lady. Holland has not drowned yet.
Ref: my next posting!

[Abraham]

Ayaan Hirsi Ali is a very brave woman, who is not leaving Holland out of fear, but only because she can get a good position at a think tank in the US.
As she said on her press conference, she can live with threats and fear. But she also confirmed that since last year her plan was to leave Parliament at the next elections, sceduled for the spring of 2007, because the personal protection she needed made her work as a member of Parliament ineffective.
After the court order to leave her house, last April, she decided to speed things up and start her job in the US per September 1, 2006.

The remarks of the Minister of Integration Rita Verdonk that Ayaan Hirsi Ali had lied - she had given her mothers name "Ali" instead of her grandfathers name "Magan" to the Dutch authorities and mentioned 1967 as her year of birth instead of 1969 - when she came to Holland in 1992 and thus not received her Dutch nationality in 1997 triggered this whole affair. Since only Dutch citizens can be members of Parliament, Ayaan was forced to give up her position.
The action of Rita Verdonk - very tough on immigration and admired by no one less than Ayaan - was motivated by her attempt to win a leadership campaign of her party. She had already announced that she was willing (read: eager) to become the next - first female - prime minister.
Ayaan - controversial within her own party and about to leave anyway - was the perfect case in a growing list to set an example how "straight" (her benchmark) and dominant Rita Verdonk was.

The whole plot has backfired big time on Rita, who succeeded in unifying almost the whole Parliament, including her own party in a motion against her, deeply dividing her own party, annoying the prime minister big time, totally isolating herself within the Cabinet, getting Holland a bad reputation abroad and Ayaan an extra shot of world wide publicity and sympathy.

After firmly announcing (actually she announces everything firmly) that the law is the law and that she could do nothing for Ayaan on Wednesday, she announced in a political debate with her opponent that Ayaan would "of course" get the Dutch nationality 'pronto' if it turned out that there were procedurel problems in the past.
This statement left many of her party members wondering what the fuss was all about then, and others contemplating how on earth a person like Rita with a talent to mess things up and alienate collegues could ever become the leader of a major political party, let alone this country...

In order to clarify her straight 180 degrees change of course I have to say that Rita Verdonk has very little leeway left, since prime minister Balkenende made a unique public statement that he would "personally supervise" this matter, placing Rita more or less under 'wardship'.

This week Rita's husband was complaining on T.V. that he did not she her enough lately.
He's probably the only one in Holland...
:D

[Abraham]

... I wonder why noone talks of the shame, that certain people thankfully take the fact that she lied (to escape her former home and find a new one in the Netherlands) as a foul excuse to remove her, practically, and spread the impression that peace and tolerance, and law and order as well, have won over an evil that threatened to disrupt the silence of the European idyll. Now she is leaving, problem solved, one more Islam-critical voice successfully silenced and moved out.
Skybird, EVERYBODY in Holland discusses ALL aspects of this political tornado. It seems she lied when she came in 1992 in order to escape the wrath of her family if she would be sent back. After all a distant cousin had come over from Canada and had asked her father one of his daughters as a bride, after which her father pointed her out. As you know, escaping an arranged marriage is seen as disgracing a family and should be "revenged" by death, in some Muslim countries.
Later, in her publications and on T.V., she mentioned the name of her father and her proper year of birth.
As she said on her press conference: "I will leave, but the questions for Holland and Europe remain." She also said that she would be happy to remain a Dutch national and that she would continue to participate in the debate...
So Skybird: No Fear!

Who knows - it would be ironic if in twenty years or so I find myself, too, begging America for political asylum in order to escape Islam. :88)
I'm relieved YOU count on twenty more years!