Iranian Rocket Torpedo

[Bort]

I personally think that it was Iranian developed with Russian assistance, what do you think?

BTW, don't know if anyone else saw it, but Jon Stewart did a pretty funny piece about the Hout on last nights Daily Show. I'll post a link if I find it!

[Kapitan]

The bought a lot off of the ukrain, who in turn bought them off russia.

But the irans could have been assisted to build thier own seeing as they dont want to have to keep placing orders.

[The Avon Lady]

The bought a lot off of the ukrain, who in turn bought them off russia.

But the irans could have been assisted to build thier own seeing as they dont want to have to keep placing orders.
Ukrainian denial (http://en.rian.ru/world/20060403/45139994.html).

Ukraine has always come up being accused of supplying rogue regimes in the Middle East with modern weaponry. Why is that?

Is it a blame game or is there smoke where there will be a fire?

Remember the accusations against Ukraine of them supply Iraq's Republican Guard with the latest sophisticated anti-tank weaponry?

[Kapitan]

Avon get an unbias source please, russia and ukraine will deny it, american's wont so get something in between.

Butiful source to prove bias there.

[The Avon Lady]

Avon get an unbias source please, russia and ukraine will deny it, american's wont so get something in between.

Butiful source to prove bias there.
Don't shoot me. I'm only the messenger.

Something in between? Searching Icelandic news sources now.............

[Kapitan]

Do you honestly think a strong ally like ukrain and russia would ever tell the west they sold weapons to a rouge nation.

I dont think so.

Americans will go at anything to accuse anyone of anything ifthey can get thier own way and when it fails they pay you off.

Two biggest liars in the world Russia and america.

[The Avon Lady]

Do you honestly think a strong ally like ukrain and russia would ever tell the west they sold weapons to a rouge nation.

I dont think so.
If you'll read (again) what I personally commented after linking to the Ukrainian news article, you'll see that I very much question Ukrainian - and Russian - intentions.
Americans will go at anything to accuse anyone of anything if they can get thier own way and when it fails they pay you off.
For example?
Two biggest liars in the world Russia and america.
China doesn't lie?

Europe doesn't lie?

I simply have no way to measure who's the champion.

I would think the winners would be N. Korea, Iran, etc. They come up with some doozies! :doh:

[SmokinTep]

I say they got them or help from Russia. Russia did say they were going to sell some of theirs.

[Kapitan]

And they have the VAE-111 which is the export version.

There was an incident in a war torn country i forget what it was gambia or some african state, anyway navy seals were sent in to evacuate the embassy, the americans bribed the warlord with over $3 million USD to let they staff get out safely.

[The Avon Lady]

There was an incident in a war torn country i forget what it was gambia or some african state, anyway navy seals were sent in to evacuate the embassy, the americans bribed the warlord with over $3 million USD to let they staff get out safely.
Other than "money talks", what is your point? :-?

[Kapitan]

If america gets into a stiky spot all they do is wave thier cheque books under the oppositions nose and say how much.

Stops advers publicity.

[Kapitan]

That move i descrived also threw "we dont negotiate with terrorists " right out of the window didnt it,

What do thier soldiers say "no one gets left behind" plenty left behind they could have bought back.

[Oberon]

It's amazing what money buys...Iran has lots of money, and Russia doesn't...you can see the cash-flow diffuse from an area of high concentration to an area of low concentration. All it needs are a couple of rich men to approach a couple of the scientists who worked on Skhval, or know the basics and offer them the right amount of money. It's not that difficult...all the scientists have to do is look over some ideas, correct some mistakes...

Et Viola
One Hout, probably developed with Russian assistance without the Russians even knowing they were assisting.

Alternatively, it was with full knowledge that they were assisting...and the plot thickens somewhat.

But, the main issue is, Sure the Iranians have a super-cavitating torpedo...but can they actually make it hit something? :hmm:

[Konovalov]

But, the main issue is, Sure the Iranians have a super-cavitating torpedo...but can they actually make it hit something? :hmm:

Similar to the Iran has F14's debate from many years ago.

[Oberon]

I reckon the best way for Iran to use their Skh...err...Hout...(Skhval sounds SO much better) so to fit it to a small 'torpedo boat' and use it medium to short range against merchant shipping.
Unless their imported Kilo's sonar suite is as good as what the Russkies have at the moment, it'd have to be a pretty dumb CVBG that allows one to get near it...and even if it did it'd be a definately one way trip.
Skhvals (ask anyone who's played a SC or DW match) are weapons for a knife fight, quick release...designed more to scare your opponent than to actually hit them (though if you do manage to hit them, they don't know WHAT hit them [Conn, sonar, torpedo in the BOOM!!]) If you're gonna fire a Skhval you need a damn good FCS because you can't (yet) change its course. It's like an old WW2 torpedo...just much, much, much faster.
And by the time you've got THAT close to an Allied fleet...you've got a Spearfish or Mk48 in your hull.

[Konovalov]

Skhvals (ask anyone who's played a SC or DW match) are weapons for a knife fight, quick release...designed more to scare your opponent

Hardly ever loaded my Akula out with them to be honest. One thing for sure is that everyone knows where you are when you let one loose. :o

[Kapitan]

Well america is worried about one little roket torpedo and to put it bluntly its not that effective even if it is super cavitating!

I would have thought that america would realy have jumped on the band wagon when it heard Russia is assisting china to develope not only SSN submarines but also SSBN.

[Kapitan]

Konovolov that is very true it makes such a racket that its impracticle to ask a sub to stay stealthy with thease weapons, what platform are they going to fire them from?

Kilo's tubes cant handle them.

[The Avon Lady]

Konovolov that is very true it makes such a racket that its impracticle to ask a sub to stay stealthy with thease weapons, what platform are they going to fire them from?
Remember that Iran has recently displayed some home-baked sub that they produced.

We're talking about Iran? Suicide subs comes to mind. :yep:

[TLAM Strike]

I reckon the best way for Iran to use their Skh...err...Hout...(Skhval sounds SO much better) so to fit it to a small 'torpedo boat' and use it medium to short range against merchant shipping. Wow how wasteful is that?!? A advanced underwater rocket to do a job a weapon left over from WWII could do for a fraction of the price.

[Kapitan]

yea suicide subs, so why in gods name put multi million dollar torpedos in them if they are going to blow themselves up?

Kinda stupid huh pay all that money for squat.

Also as xabbarus said thier new subs looks nothing more like a sang o mini submarine i doubt it could even load two of these torpedos on it let alone have the capibility to fire them.

[Oberon]

We're talking about Iran? Suicide subs comes to mind. :yep:

I was just thinking that myself...but would they want to trade one very expensive submarine (that'll take them a fair while to build again, especially under fire) for one US ship...and to be fair, although there IS a chance they could somehow (if they're real clever) sneak inside a CVBG and nail the carrier...one Hout isn't going to do the job, and even if it did then within a couple of weeks there'll be ANOTHER carrier in the Gulf and several dozen very angry US air squadrons blowing the crap out of anything that moves in Iran from an altitude that Iran can't reach.
Unless the Iranians have a very well defended port then that'll be the first thing to go, the Kilos and their homebaked sub won't be able to dock, if they try a replenishment at sea then they're going to get picked up by a ASW patrol and sunk. Although the US Navy isn't invincible (not by any stretch of the imagination) it's a lot more powerful than four Kilos, a homebaked sub and some super-cavitating torpedoes.

[Kapitan]

That one is true to tlam but thier kilo's cant realy fire them torpedos unless thats why the recently been upgraded by russia for.

Thier new subs id strongly doubt could even load them onto the subs.

And i think it would be a good weapon to use against say a FFG or DDG fire and forget but likely hood of getting close enough in a PT boat is small especialy with the type 45 if and when it comes into service and also the burkes.

[Bort]

The Daily Show clip is online! http://www.comedycentral.com/shows/the_daily_show/videos/most_recent/index.jhtml
Click on Persia 2.0 The part about the Hout is 3/4's of the way through the vid. :up:

[Oberon]

* Bort]The Daily Show clip is online! http://www.comedycentral.com/shows/the_daily_show/videos/most_recent/index.jhtml
Click on Persia 2.0 The part about the Hout is 3/4's of the way through the vid. :up:

"Iran is not Iraq."
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

Great link :up:

[TteFAboB]

It's either an empty useless bluff, or they have something so smart under their sleeve we can't even think of what it is.

[GunnersMate]

Can they even get their Kilo's operational?

[Kapitan]

I think so not long since they were upgraded. so no reason why they shouldnt be.

[nattydread]

Id suspect that iran couldnt produce or purchase enough Houts and platforms to fire them to be considered a real threat. It'll take a whole nest full of of them to sink a carrier anyway. When it comes to a war of attrition, the Iranians dont stand chance(thought the American pubilc wouldnt be too supportive of such a war). We could throw enough steel at the Iranians to absorb the entire stock of the best they have and still keep on coming.


In the case of an Iranian war, we would likly do something similar to the 1st Iraq war considering all we need to do is destroy Iran's ability to produce fissionable material. So the Air Strikes, cruise missiles, etc will be the way to go. Carrier groups would be supportive instead of main battle units, we could likly keep them farther out at sea and use air borne re-fueling to get to and from targets. im sure stationary radar and SAM facilities are already mapped and programmed into cruise missiles as we speak, mobile sights will be hunted by UAVs and land or sea based strike aircrafts, research facilities are alreadt tagged and ready for JDAM and Bunker-Busters after Iranian air space is cleared of aircraft and SAM sights. No need to land troops and occupy any large portion of land, just drop Spec Ops, smash and grab and leave a smoldering crater where necessary.

We dont need Iran we just need them unable to produce fissionable material, we can assess iran as a threat afterward and use iraq and afganistan/pakistan as land based launch pads if neccessary in the future.

[Kapitan]

But that would leave the tankers very vunreble, seeing how the iranians have fighters Mig 25 and 31's not to mention some F14's place the tankers to close with in range of them and well bye bye gas station.

As for the rocket torpedo Kilo and that new one id doubt heavily if it could be used on them.

Surface ship be destroyed before it even got near.

[TLAM Strike]

But that would leave the tankers very vunreble, seeing how the iranians have fighters Mig 25 and 31's not to mention some F14's place the tankers to close with in range of them and well bye bye gas station.

Those tankers are going to be guarded like an Amish’s girls virginity on prom night! They will have F/A-18 and F-15 escort plus EW support to jam any attackers. :yep:

[TteFAboB]

Well, the plan unveils, now they also have flying boats.

If they can make a little flying boat powerfull enough to carry the torpedo, they got themselves a midget-flying sub.

AL wins, it's suicidal, afterall.

[moose1am]

That was just one of the good shows that Jon Stewart does ever week night. His show starts at 10 pm our time and is repeated again at Midnight, 9am and 7 pm the next day. And if you missed it on TV you can catch it on the web site.




* Bort]The Daily Show clip is online! http://www.comedycentral.com/shows/the_daily_show/videos/most_recent/index.jhtml
Click on Persia 2.0 The part about the Hout is 3/4's of the way through the vid. :up:

[Wim Libaers]

But that would leave the tankers very vunreble, seeing how the iranians have fighters Mig 25 and 31's not to mention some F14's place the tankers to close with in range of them and well bye bye gas station.

As for the rocket torpedo Kilo and that new one id doubt heavily if it could be used on them.

Surface ship be destroyed before it even got near.


The F-14's shouldn't be a problem. They require a lot of maintenance, and they didn't get spare parts for a long time. If they flew a lot, that would be a problem. If they didn't fly often, the pilots probably aren't very experienced.

[Neutrino 123]

Does anyone have reliable information as to whether the Shkval can turn after being fired as in DW, or does the sub need to be properly pointed before it can shoot?

[Kapitan]

From what ive seen of the Skhval and i have seen one first hand in a russian weapons museam, id doubt it could turn simply because it most probably disintergrate.

Il get some links in a few.

[Neutrino 123]

Whoops, I didn't mean turn when it was supercavitating, that would get messy :ping: . I mean: if the sub fires the torpedo, can the torpedo turn towards its target before it starts to supercavitate?

[Kapitan]

once it is ejected out of the submarine it takes a few seconds for the motor to kick in then it just runs, and once its been ejected untill that motor kicks in it has no power of its own, and there fore cannot turn.

Some useful infomation on the shkval

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/missile/row/shkval.htm

http://www.periscope.ucg.com/mdb-smpl/weapons/minetorp/torpedo/w0004768.shtml

The diagrammes are useful if nothing else.


It was believed and still is that one of these helped sink the submarine kursk, but we know it was a 65-76 "fat girl" torpedo that did sink her, and it was not the skhval.

Kursk did have these weapons on board at the time, this is why initialy the russian's said to the rescue divers do not go forward (once they had seen the damage).

cheomly made this missile or part of they are renown for there very high powered and very powerful missiles, they made the shipwreck and also the sun burn which are seen as thee most powerfullest anti ship missiles in any navys arsenal (more powerful than a tomahawk).

Shkval is a good air craft carrier killer that is what it was designed for but it wasnt realy designed to carry a conventional warhead, it was ment to carry a nuclear warhead.

The submarine was to get in close and fire a few of these at a carrier, once it had cleared a path to get to it (ie torpedoing the escorts).

The shkval is not a good weapon ok its revolutionary it super cavitates but every one knows where you are once you fired it.