Pentagon: Russia gave Saddam U.S. intel

[STEED]

http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/20060324-024120-5623r.htm

Well us lot here could had told you that. :yep:

[Torplexed]

Yeah...but deep down the Russians really love us. :roll: BTW the next time there is a Slavic sub that needs rescuing....there may be a little flipper-dragging.

[Perilscope]

BTW the next time there is a Slavic sub that needs rescuing....there may be a little flipper-dragging.:lol: :up:

But do not forget, we would have done the same…:D

[Torplexed]

But do not forget, we would have done the same…:D

Ohh...I suppose. Actually now that I think back on it, it was the British that pulled their last sub's bacon out of the grease fire. :hmm:

[Perilscope]

...now that I think back on it, it was the British that pulled their last sub's bacon out of the grease fire. :hmm:Huh! Its just that I don't understand which event you mean???
Wasn't the Scandinavians that pulled them out last time… if we are talking about the Kusrk? :hmm:

[Torplexed]

I'm thinking of the AS-28 Priz submarine with the Russian Pacific Fleet that got tangled in the net last summer. Could have been a bigger disaster if it hadn't been for those plucky Brits.....

http://www.csmonitor.com/2005/0808/p06s02-woeu.html

Hopefully the incident taught them not to be shy about asking for assistance. ;)

[scandium]

I'm not sure what to make of this:

"The unclassified report does not assess the value of the information or provide details beyond citing an Iraqi document that says the battlefield intelligence was provided to Saddam through the Russian ambassador in Baghdad."

That's a pretty vague and unconfirmed single source for the grand statements made later in the article. The basis for the whole article boils down to "an Iraqi document that says...". A single Iraqi document by an undisclosed author. I'd always thought that the standard for journalism required two independent sources prior to publication. Apparently if the story is sensational enough its ok to relax the standard though. Despite the debacle following the revelation that the Niger document citing Iraq was trying to procure yellow cake from Africa had been forged, the sensational pre-invasion stories by Judith Miller at the NY Times (among other so called journalists) whose primary source turned out, it seems, to be a discredited informant named Curveball (backed up no doubt by anonymous administration "officials" with a clear agenda to pimp the war), and on and on. I'm not calling it propaganda at this point, though if it were it certainly wouldn't be the first we've seen from the "left-wing media", but if there's more evidence to back up this sensational story I'd like to hear of it.

Without anything else to go on, I personally put about as much stock into this right now as I did the pre-war claims that Iraq had WMD.

[Perilscope]

Oh that event, I totally forgot about it, happy ending no good story as they say…
Well I read the news (old news), and I also think that Russia his slowly understanding…

I took this quote from the news, it's from: Adm. Viktor Fyodorov

"We have great admiration for the high professionalism and technical capability of our British colleagues, accomplished this difficult mission in just 3-1/2 hours."
The saving of the AS-28 Priz Crew
I think its one of the good Navy quotes that should be on subsim at one point… ;-)

...I personally put about as much stock into this right now as I did the pre-war claims that Iraq had WMD.Don't worry, we all take it indifferently… ;)

[Type941]

Yeah...but deep down the Russians really love us. :roll:

You deserve it because... ?

[CCIP]

NEWSFLASH

The US gave the Taliban and Osama bin Laden weapons. :roll:

I don't see anything surprising in this, frankly. The Russian government has yet to find a reason to really like American plans for the world. And the war in Iraq (and how badly it's been going) has been a HUGE boost to Russia's oil economy.
Mr. Putin is a happy man.

But don't let this give you an impression that every Ivan suddenly changed his mind about America. There is a growing disapproval of American foreign policy among the Russian public, but don't let it give you the impression that this has any more support in the common public than, say, what Mr. Kissinger and the CIA might have been doing back in the mid-70s. :hmm:

[Type941]

I think the US establishment has long decided that in order to live well, they need to stamp with soldier's boots on other nations, and if they can't do it literally, they will use the information war (which they are good at). For example if Russia used english as its main language (hypothetical) it could probably fight this information garbage that is trrown at it by EU and US (say through CNN) much more effectively. And I think the common people don't give a sh*t abot america in the first place, but they are fed up with these 'liberals' who'd sell the country to the americans if they could (Gaidar, and all that team, plus the oligarchs like Berezovsky whom UK harbours). Only reason EU and US are trying to break russia's back once again is because they don't want to depend on Russia for oil and gas, and generally they can't handle having anyone who disagrees with them. Mainly US, because EU has to double check everything it does with US.

All is irrelevant though, as it will all collapse when the crash happens and the US dolalr will become a piece of paper, banks will close down, and gold will be at about $1000 level or more. Than with the collapse of financial system the whole US will kind of implode into itself and will be busy fixing itself. And since we all depend on its economy, we also will be in deep pooopoo. :hmm:

Americans react poorly to the Roman Empire analogy, but really it's so similar in many ways, and just because the comparison hurts due to nastiness of Roman empire and how violently it ended, the comparison in general stands, it's fact.

[STEED]

the whole US will kind of implode into itself and will be busy fixing itself. And since we all depend on its economy, we also will be in deep pooopoo. :hmm:

I read an interesting article last year about America, that it is tearing its self apart and a possible situation America as we know it will cease to be one country, as it slowly fragments over the next 50 years. One of the situations was the U.S dollar will one day collapse inwards due to internal problems, one I remember was civil war.

[Type941]

I don't believe US would collapse on parts, simply because people there are similar. But the US Dollar thing is a fact, like it or not.

I'm working in the bank, and we talk with traders about this all the time. It's not a question of IF. It's a question of WHEN. 10 years is my very rough guess, or thereabouts. So far, the FED has been doing well to use interest rates to fight inflation, but I wonder how much can they go on doing this. They stopped publishing the M3 lately (a type of money supply) which decreases transparency in currency and that's worrying as to why they did it (real reasons). But that's off topic a bit.

[scandium]

the whole US will kind of implode into itself and will be busy fixing itself. And since we all depend on its economy, we also will be in deep pooopoo. :hmm:

I read an interesting article last year about America, that it is tearing its self apart and a possible situation America as we know it will cease to be one country, as it slowly fragments over the next 50 years. One of the situations was the U.S dollar will one day collapse inwards due to internal problems, one I remember was civil war.

I don't know about a civil war, but I'd imagine there must be some provision in the US constitution to allow a state to leave the union peacefully. Of course constitutions can be amended.

[STEED]

It's a shame I never kept that article, but I can not see a civil war at all. As for a state to break away. :hmm: Interesting.

[Type941]

i think we forget the reason states JOIN together is because it's hard for them to live on their own in the first place. But ok, if they are some oil rich Texas, who knows, but I think it's very far fetched. Anyway, use will chop off some parts of canada if it loses some territory to its mexian friends. :huh:

[scandium]

Anyway, use will chop off some parts of canada if it loses some territory to its mexian friends. :huh:

Been tried ;) Though in all seriousness, despite the antagonism both sides occasionally display toward each other (usually through proxies), our two countries are so closely intertwined that the US attacking Canada would be about as productive as the US attacking California. We do 5 billion dollars a day in trade. Not to mention mutually beneficial relationships through our membership in both NORAD and NATO. It would basically make about as much sense as Britain attacking France in 1939. No, it'd make even less sense.

[TLAM Strike]

...but I'd imagine there must be some provision in the US constitution to allow a state to leave the union peacefully. Of course constitutions can be amended. Nope thats what caused everything to go to S*hit last time! See Suprime Court Case Texas v. White (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_v._White):


"The union between Texas and the other States was as complete, as perpetual, and as indissoluble as the union between the original States. There was no place for reconsideration, or revocation, except through revolution, or through consent of the States."

"Considered therefore as transactions under the Constitution, the ordinance of secession, adopted by the convention and ratified by a majority of the citizens of Texas, and all the acts of her legislature intended to give effect to that ordinance, were absolutely null. They were utterly without operation in law. The obligations of the State, as a member of the Union, and of every citizen of the State, as a citizen of the United States, remained perfect and unimpaired. It certainly follows that the State did not cease to be a State, nor her citizens to be citizens of the Union."

[scandium]

...but I'd imagine there must be some provision in the US constitution to allow a state to leave the union peacefully. Of course constitutions can be amended. Nope thats what caused everything to go to S*hit last time! See Suprime Court Case Texas v. White (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_v._White):


"The union between Texas and the other States was as complete, as perpetual, and as indissoluble as the union between the original States. There was no place for reconsideration, or revocation, except through revolution, or through consent of the States."

"Considered therefore as transactions under the Constitution, the ordinance of secession, adopted by the convention and ratified by a majority of the citizens of Texas, and all the acts of her legislature intended to give effect to that ordinance, were absolutely null. They were utterly without operation in law. The obligations of the State, as a member of the Union, and of every citizen of the State, as a citizen of the United States, remained perfect and unimpaired. It certainly follows that the State did not cease to be a State, nor her citizens to be citizens of the Union."

I wish our own federalist situation in Canada were so clear cut.

[Iceman]

The topic goes from Russia giving intell to Iraq to the collapse of the US...you guys are like watching the sci-fi channel. LMAO... :rotfl:

[TLAM Strike]

The topic goes from Russia giving intell to Iraq to the collapse of the US...you guys are like watching the sci-fi channel. LMAO... :rotfl: Juse because you mentioned Sci-Fi, have a thing for religous quotes and I need something to do...

"Some would ask, how could a perfect God create a universe filled with so much that is evil. They have missed a greater conundrum: why would a perfect God create a universe at all?"

Sister Miriam Godwinson
"But for the Grace of God"

"And so we return again to the holy void. Some say this is simply our destiny, but I would have you remember always that the void EXISTS, just as surely as you or I. Is nothingness any less a miracle than substance?"

Sister Miriam Godwinson
"We Must Dissent"

"Men in their arrogance claim to understand the nature of creation, and devise elaborate theories to describe its behavior. But always they discover in the end that God was quite a bit more clever than they thought."

Sister Miriam Godwinson
"We Must Dissent"

and well has nothing to do with anything, I just love this one...

"I don't know but I've been told,
Deirdre's got a Network Node.
Likes to press the on-off switch,
Dig that crazy Gaian witch!"

Spartan Barracks March

All from the TSG Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri
More Here (http://www.generationterrorists.com/quotes/smac.html)