Staying alive in English waters? ....

[Viduka]

I'm fairly new at the game and have been coasting along quite well so far, but as my career progresses and I get sent further and further abroad on patrols, i'm finding myself in understandably much trickier conditions.

On my last patrol, my very first outing in a VIIC, I died for the first time, at the hands of a group of destroyers/patrol boats just off the south coast of England - pinging me with sonar and then depth charging me.

My question is - what is the best way to stay alive in this situation?

As I understand it, sonar will be tracking me using the shape of my boat so going along silently isn't going to help terribly once i've been detected?

From reading this topic - http://www.subsim.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=32249&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 (which was quite helpful) it seems that the enemy use sound (hydrophones) to find you in the first place and then sonar to narrow down your position so they can launch DC's at you?

Judging by the differentiating veiws of tactics in the above thread link it seems it is no simple matter in keeping my sub from becoming an iron tomb on the bottom of the ocean floor :-?

[Kalach]

If you hear pinging move your boat as fast it goes and gain depth, when you are told of DC's in the water turn your rudder hard over either direction.
If there is no pinging, order silent running (Z) and set your speed to 2kts, moving at 2kts seems much quieter than the default 3.

Remember, depth is your friend :yep:
If you are at 160m the enemy DD may still be right behind you, but you have time to avoid any DC's.

[HW3]

If you are running The Channel, stay on the South side next to France in the deepest water you can find there.

[Deimos01]

One question. You said southern coast of England. Do you mean the English channel? If so then I would reccomend staying out of there at all cost, especially as the war progresses. Between air patrols, DDs and Pt boats, and in the case of my modded game, mine fields, the english channel can be a death trap. Plus it shallow so not much room to manuver.

Like other have said. Depth is your friend. If you are being actively hunted and the DDs are using their ASDIC then try to get down to 150m and run silent. If they start pinging you (the pinging will get faster) wait until it stops and you can hear the DDs screws from the control room. Thats a good indication they are making an attack run on you. Go ahead flank and when your sonar guy reports DCs in the water do a hard rudder turn. As soon as the explosions stop go back to silent run and rudder amidships. Now what you wanna do is try and keep either the bow or stern of your boat pointed towards the DD. This limits your profile and makes it harder for them to pick you up on ASDIC. Keep in mind that you want to try and work your way out of the area as well.

If you are in shallow waters (anything under 50m) then the same tactics apply for the most part, except for going deep of cours. But your chances get reduced significantly.

[Dowly]

But your chances get reduced significantly.

Nonsense! I survived bounding from 5 destroyers (I calculated 172 depthcharges) in depth of 28-35 meters! :) Ofcourse I had luck! I only got hit by 2 or 3 strings of bombs. that was my most intense and scariest patrol! :rock: After every explosion I started to shake more and more. Now THAT was fun! :yep:

And to add to the intense, it was WaW patrol. :)

[Deimos01]

Well, not saying its impossible. Just alot harder. Ive run the channel a few times and survived up until about late 1940. :|\ The one time I did get killed was because I wasnt paying attention and hit bottom, the noise of which brought the DD down on me and he was able to finish me off :oops:

[drEaPer]

But your chances get reduced significantly.

Nonsense! I survived bounding from 5 destroyers (I calculated 172 depthcharges) in depth of 28-35 meters! :) Ofcourse I had luck! I only got hit by 2 or 3 strings of bombs. that was my most intense and scariest patrol! :rock: After every explosion I started to shake more and more. Now THAT was fun! :yep:

And to add to the intense, it was WaW patrol. :)


What mods r u using, if any?

I usually dont get one hit, or I instant die.

[blackdog_kt]

A good idea is to manually operate the hydrophones when you are under attack,alternating between the hydrophone station and the navigation map.

When you are detected,draw a 2km circle on the map. Your aim is to get out of it as fast and as quiet as possible (there's a compromise here),preferably on the side of the circle which is away from the destroyer. That's why you need to periodically switch to the nav map view.

For most of the time you should be in the hydrophone room,tracking the DD. As the bow and stern of the boat presents a smaller surface for the ping to reflect,you should always try to present this view to the DD. That means turning in a way to keep the DD either at 0 or 180 bearing. Since we want to exit the 2km circle,start by turning to a heading opposite the destroyer and try to keep him at bearing 180 most of the time.

If he only has a rough idea of your position,keep silent. If you are detected there's no use keeping quiet,so try to put some space between you and push the pedal to the metal.

Assuming the DD has a good fix on you,he'll be on top of you in a short time and pinging you. I like to start diving from the moment the DD spots me,to a target depth about 2/3 of the maximum depth the boat can sustain. This way,when he's on top of me i have some room to maneuver in the vertical plane. Keep in mind that the faster you go the easier he can hear you,but also you can change depth and turn faster at higher speeds. Again,it's a matter of compromise.

When your boat is not turning,you can get an idea on which of your sides the DD is moving at by observing the bearing changes as you track him. This will come in handy for choosing your turning direction when you evade later.

Let's say for example that you keep the DD at bearing 180,you are in a depth of about 120m,he manages to approach you and starts moving to your left towards bearing 270. When you hear the first pinging sounds he is just trying to get a fix on you.

I think i read somewhere in this forum that ASDIC measures the distance from DD to U-boat in a diagonal line,so he doesn't know exact range in the horizontal and vertical plane. Also,the deeper you are the harder for him to get a decent fix. This changes if you have 2-3 DD's on you,in which case they can triangulate. Some players have reported having 3 DD's on them,making passes on by one as the other 2 keep pinging.

When the pinging gets faster,the DD thinks he has a good fix on you and is about to commence his attack run,so on we go to evasive action.

A short time after the frantic pinging stops,you will hear his screws slow down,then kick off again at a really fast pace. The DD is now officially on his attack run,based on your LAST ESTIMATED POSITION and he goes so fast that HE CAN'T HEAR YOU :up:

The moment you hear him pick up speed,go ahead flank and turn hard. You can also instruct your chief engineer to make a knuckle or double knuckle turn. This turn should be away from the DD,in the case of our example starboard. While turning,it's also a good idea to change depth,so either crash dive or go higher.

The depth charges are primed to go off in a certain depth,the one you were last in before he started his run. By changing depth and turning at the same time you are moving in a corckscrew fashion, not only putting some horizontal distance between you and the DD, but also moving away from the depth the charges will go off at. I prefer to move higher,since at bigger depths a single depth charge can do more damage,due to higher water pressure. During the DD's attack run and the subsequent explosions he can't hear much,so keep ahead full or flank to maneuver faster.

After 2-3 explosions order a crash dive and immediately afterwards go slow and silent. This has the nice effect that your boat will dive steep enough due to the crash dive order,while keeping quiet. It would be good if we could control pitch in degrees like the rudder,but since we can't this is a nice alternative. By the time the last of the charges goes off you should be moving back to your initial depth ready to dodge the next attack. You might want to count how many charges the DD dropped,so you can time your dive just before the last charge in his next attack run.

As the noise clears,reacquire the DD on your hydrophones and turn your boat away from him,trying to keep him at bearing 180. If possible,keep a mental picture of the direction his attack run took,so you can time your exiting turn while the charges are still going off and he can't hear you. With a bit of luck you might have him at bearing 180 and be deep enough and silent so that he doesn't know where you are after the charges have exploded.

Keep in mind that your sonarman will probably not pick up the DD when he's directly behind you. However,you can manually hear him through the sound of your own screws if you are doing 2-3 knots. One last thing,avoid or sink the hellish flower corvettes when possible,especially if you are in a sluggish boat like the type IX. They turn on a dime and thus are hard to escape.

From this point on it's rinse and repeat until you manage to go undetected or he decides to leave.

Good luck :cool:

[Dowly]

But your chances get reduced significantly.

Nonsense! I survived bounding from 5 destroyers (I calculated 172 depthcharges) in depth of 28-35 meters! :) Ofcourse I had luck! I only got hit by 2 or 3 strings of bombs. that was my most intense and scariest patrol! :rock: After every explosion I started to shake more and more. Now THAT was fun! :yep:

And to add to the intense, it was WaW patrol. :)


What mods r u using, if any?

I usually dont get one hit, or I instant die.

ATM I was using RuB and HT and various graphics mods.

[Viduka]

One question. You said southern coast of England. Do you mean the English channel? .

Thanks for the replies and helpful information. I think I have a pretty good idea of what I need to be doing now.

In answer to your question, I was just about to enter the english channel off the south east coast of England. I had been assigned a patrol grid just the other side of the channel and it 'seemed' the fastest way there, but it's not the fastest if you never get there at all! :dead:

It's true it is very shallow there which certainly doesn't help my cause. I think I will be taking the long way around now, up through Scapa Flow. I'm sure it will be busy there too but at least there's some nice deep water once i'm through the channel there.

:ping:

[CaptainEO]

Just a minor correction - depth charges are less dangerous at increasing depth, since the high water pressure contains the explosion. (although if you are very near crush depth, I suppose a charge could "put you over the edge")

[donut]

Blackdog_kt ,gave the best advice tactics,I've read yet,practice,the eye in the sky is helpful also,but not to real.Bring the crew home. :up:

[glenno]

Do not get your hull damaged .
Try not to go anywhere less than 100 mts of water .
If detected dive , dive dive . As deep as you can .
Use the hydrophones and turn so that the destroyer is aft . (least profile) .
Keep him at 180deg , keep silent . It might take hours to lose it .

[Bluewings]

I strongly advise everybody to stay out of the British Channel from 1941 onwards .

I am in February '43 and BdU sent me up Scapa Flow and I thought going through the Channel will spare fuel .

After gunning down 14 Aircrafts (!) I barely reached Southend on Sea and decided to go back .

Avoid the Channel , Kaleuns .

Cheers .