who wants rid of the EU?

[Kapitan]

simple who wants rid of the EU state your reasons and what not here

[retired1212]

This is for businessmen only. You follow what the bunch of politicians from other countries want. Heard (not sure) that EU asks Finland to close some sugar factories.

[Drebbel]

Is this Q for real ??

How could Europe economically survive with all the old borders+import taxex+regulations+..... back ??

IMHO main concern is for people that now Europe moves from a economic union (which very few people where against) to a "United States of Europe".

IMHO borders are stupid man made thing. I am a world citizan !! So take down those borders if we can !!!

[Happy Times]

Don t see see an option in tearing it down. Economically inpossible. But it needs restructuring and coming from Finland, i cant tolerate the corruption in some countries. :stare: Plus we have to make Romania,Bulgaria and the rest of Balkan countries the last ones taken in. Even with them its going to be a battle of values. To the Ukraine a special status must be created with maybe a possibility to join, maybe. Theres no way in hell that Finns are going to except the Turkish as members. Special status to them maybe. And to Israel naturally. Then the doors are closed and we can start sorting the mess we call Europe. :doh:

[XabbaRus]

Flat no to Turkey and Israel.

[Happy Times]

This is for businessmen only. You follow what the bunch of politicians from other countries want. Heard (not sure) that EU asks Finland to close some sugar factories. Its not just factories, its the production entirely thats threatened. They have just decidede that its going to be produced in France,Germany and Poland. The point is that if economics is to determine these things there wouldnt be any kind of agriculture in Finland. But personally i am not ready to give up self suffiency and trust Europe to feed us in all conditions.

[retired1212]

Its not just factories, its the production entirely thats threatened. They have just decidede that its going to be produced in France,Germany and Poland. The point is that if economics is to determine these things there wouldnt be any kind of agriculture in Finland. But personally i am not ready to give up self suffiency and trust Europe to feed us in all conditions.

Phew!!! Where those people will go who are going to loose their jobs. :roll: Perhaps someday the condom factories will be transfered to other conutries too.

hmmm...time to flee. I am going to escape to some other European country or to Alaska, US. :-j

[diver]

Get rid.

It's ludicrous, Australians with one British Parent or Two British Grandparents will soon have less rights to live/work/holiday in Britain than some bloody German who has no connections to the UK.
:damn:
The UK is prostituting itself to Europe and slapping its commonwealth brothers in the face. :hulk:

Shame on you Tony Blair :down:


That and I think the EU's economic policies are extremely unfair to other countries throughout the world, particuarly those in the developing world. Europe is becoming too self absorbed, and frankly too open to itself, and closed to others. Others weho have been far more friendly to particular EU nations than other euro countries have ever been.

[Type941]

please, I don't want the United States of Europe (or the new USSR with Blue Flag). I want to stop accepting new members from places like Turkey just because the US says so. I also want to have countries like Germany and France to actually follow the growth directives of EU.

So overall, I want to stay in EU, but I don't want the borders diluted more. I want to travel anywhere without visas, and trade without currency fluctuations and whatnot, but I don't want to unify with every single country, because that's just impossible.


OH, and it's funny to hear those opine on the matter who are not actually a part of EU! :huh:

[TteFAboB]

The economical EU is a good idea, if it can be sorted out and done correctly enough, even if that turns Europe into a strong block hard to fight against subsidies, but the political EU is bad.

[Happy Times]

If the EU brakes up i would like to see the new Kalmar Union/Hansa Union type of thing :hmm: With Iceland, Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland , Estonia, Latvia. We would have everything we need to be self sufficient and large enough size in the global world :up: 30 million very homogenious people with a lot of common history,culture, religion(Lutheran) would be easy to build on compared to EU. :) Comments my fellow nordic people?

[Oberon]

Getting rid of the EU?
Give it a couple of years and it'll self destruct anyway ;)

[retired1212]

I wonder who have select the options in this thread to alter the results :stare:

[XabbaRus]

Get rid.

It's ludicrous, Australians with one British Parent or Two British Grandparents will soon have less rights to live/work/holiday in Britain than some bloody German who has no connections to the UK.
:damn:
The UK is prostituting itself to Europe and slapping its commonwealth brothers in the face. :hulk:

Shame on you Tony Blair :down:


That and I think the EU's economic policies are extremely unfair to other countries throughout the world, particuarly those in the developing world. Europe is becoming too self absorbed, and frankly too open to itself, and closed to others. Others weho have been far more friendly to particular EU nations than other euro countries have ever been.

That I do understand.

My daughter was born in Moscow, as I am British she automatically gets British citizenship and passport BUT, and get this, If my daughter gets married to a foreigner OR tp another Brit who was born OUTSIDE of the UK, then she cannot automatically pass her citizenship down to her children IF they are born outside of the UK as I passed my citizenship down to her.

This pisses me off, it also pisses of my wife who sees that my daughter has less rights as a British person/half English than the children of non-British people who are born in Britain.

Especially up here in NE Scotland where we have tons of new-EU nationals, not that I have anything againsts them personally but it does piss me off that my daughter has less rights and she is half British/English.

Tony Blair is a wanker. But then again if Britain gives up her rebate, which I guess would be fair, then France MUST give up her massive farming subsidies.

[August]

I'm an American so i figure its none of my business...

[jumpy]

Tony Blair is a wanker. But then again if Britain gives up her rebate, which I guess would be fair, then France MUST give up her massive farming subsidies.
:rotfl: :rotfl:
pigs might fly! hehe
But what you describe in the rest of your post, Xabba, sure as hell ain't fair in my book.

Flat no to Turkey and Israel.
Damn right... at the risk of offending too much, both of them are arab countries anyway, that is they are part of the middle east, not europe and as such if they want to join a union of countries, why not join with their fellow middleastern states and not bring all of their human-rights baggage and political/terratorial and religious problems to the table to envolve us in?

However, I must add that I'm not keen on 'Europe' in general, I'm sure there are some financial benefits somewhere... don't see how it's fair for the EU to dictate legisalture or policy for countries where sweeping laws don't really fit the individual though. Another case of too many cooks spoiling the broth; the age old problem with democracy is that the majority will always override the minority, weather it's in their (minority) best interests or not. Part of the problem with the UK joining is making sure that 'our' voice is not part of that minority.

Good old 'island' mentality can't be beat! hehe just a few more miles of open water between me and frenchy :lol:
To be fair there's always alot of discussion and talk about 'Europe' but nothing ever seems to get said outright, you know what I mean? You've obviously got 'for' and 'against' camps, but over here (and I include myself in this to a certain extent) if you ask people why they do or do not want to be part of europe you don't tend to get many constructive answers, largely I believe due to the sheer volume of oppinion on this matter clouding the logical arguments both for and against joining/remaining part of 'Europe'. Leastways that's how it seems to me. I guess what it boils down to is 'what do we stand to get out of it, and what do we stand to loose?' - so far I've not heard any really clear answers to that one, so on that basis I cannot commit to a full EU membership without reservation as so far it all seems like smoke and mirrors.

[Type941]

I'm all for the Hansa Union! :D Although I'm not sure Latvia is a part of that, culure and language wise, they are different to nordic countries. They also are completely messed up in politics, with their nazi salutes and minority problems.

[FERdeBOER]

First of all, UK is a strange case in the EU. They do not use the €, they follow all USA instructions... and they have the "British bill", an unfair economic compesation... for don't grow their agriculture! I have traveled to Portugal, France, Italy and England, and was in England where I felt less "European".

The actual EU is an economic one despite a social one and, to tell you the truth, I feel closer to South-American people than Germany, or Netherland... but we are NEIGHBOURS, and is normal that european countries try to get close as the group of near houses joins on a villaje despite being dispersed.
The union of Europe is no a modern idea and had being tried many times during centuries (most of that times by the force).

But, Turkey, Israel, Ucrania... they NEVER had been Europe (well, some yes with the Roman Empire).

I think is a very good idea (I love traveling with only my Spanish ID, with the same currency....) but at the moment is not well done.

A curious thing: do you know that USA couldn't be a member of the EU (If it would be the case?)
It's because they have capital death and have a very big economic debt.

[Ramius]

...., and was in England where I felt less "European".....

You ever think the reason you felt like this is maybe we don't want to be classed as Europeans ?
Personally i like being able to call myself English (not sure how long some damb beurocrat in Brussels will allow that though :damn: :damn: :damn: :damn: :damn: :damn: )

At the end of the day - i'd be perfectly happy if someone would demolish the Tunnel. Kick out all the imigrants, who travel thru every other "European" country before getting to the UK, and basically tell Brussels to get stuffed :rock: :rock:


BTW. if you hadn't guessed already - i voted "rid of the EU" :rock: :rock: :rock: :rock: :rock: :rock: :rock: :rock: :rock:

[XabbaRus]

Something that hasn't been mentioned but I will.

Even with the rebate that Britain gets from the EU we area NET CONTRIBUTOR TO THE EU BUDGET. France with its subsidies is a NET TAKER.

Teh daft thing is in France you can get a grant if you have a bloody apple tree in the garden.

Basically it goes back to French law where the estate has to be divided equally so you'd get farmland that in some cases got divided down and down until the land was split into small patches (unless someone bought the other out) between god knows how many grandkids. Well it would still be classed as agricultural land and thus can get a grant.

In the UK farming became rationalised and more efficient so less reliant on subsidies.

I understand that if subsidies were drastically cut in Frnace many farmers would go out of business. My answer is that they need to learn to be efficient and sink or swim.

I am not against the EU as a trading block with few trade barriers, but as a super state I disagree and think that lines should be drawn.

Also the Euro to me doesn't seem to have been the big thing that it was made out to be and am glad the UK is out of it.

[mog]

I voted "get rid of the EU". The EU is burden on liberal Britain, who risks being dragged down by the socialist bureaucracy of the mainland. The same applies for those countries with the Euro whose responsible economic management comes to nothing because other Euro countries like France and Germany continue to wreak havoc with the currency through their profligate policies.

The benefits of the EU such as open borders and free trade do not require a massive central government, so there's no reason these benefits would not remain with a downsized or abolished EU.

[XabbaRus]

oh yea France and Germany break all the deficit rules concerning the Euro.

France really wants to run europe and also keep tabs on Germany who she still feaqrs in a deep down way.

Personally I think the French govt can't get over that France was dumped on at Trafalgar and Waterloo :D :D

This should be fun.

[diver]

OH, and it's funny to hear those opine on the matter who are not actually a part of EU!


Well as a (previously) potential UK passport holder I think I can comment.

60 Years ago my Grandfather was a Navigator in the (British) royal Air Force. He flew missions to bomb germany, and German fighters flew missions to shoot him down.

Now, the grandchildren of those German pilots can walk off the plane and into Britain almost freely, whilst I must go through just as many security checks as an Argentinian.

I am a citizen of a commonwealth nation, I speak English as a first language, My countries flag has the union Jack on it, I play two of the most English of sports (Rugby Union and Cricket), and I was taught English history in school.

Now I know the war is long gone and we all are friends now, and i have nothing against modern day germany, but...
the grandchildren of a former RAF officer a 1 in 3 chance of dying on every combat mission have less rights and freedoms in the country he defended than the grandchildren of a former enemy.

I can see absolutely no justification in that. Nor in allowing French, Danish, Spanish, Italian, Belgians, etc... and soon possibly Turkish citizens to stroll freely into the UK whilst Australians, New Zealanders, Fijians, Canadians, South Africans, etc ... get treated with suspicion.

----

And now citizens of the commonwealth currently serving in the UK Armed Forces have been told to get UK citizenships and drtop their former countries citizenships immediatly or be discharged, BECAUSE OF EU EMPLOYMENT LAWS. Many of these personnel have served in Iraq and Afghanistan, proving their devotion and loyalty to the UK time after time some have given their lives and now because of a law passed in Brussels they are either going to have to give up their own nationality or give up their lifes work.
Yet somehow I do not see the French Foreign Legion breaking up.

[retired1212]

how about including Russia in EU? (keeping the neighbors close? ) :D

[Happy Times]

how about including Russia in EU? (keeping the neighbors close? ) :D : They wouldnt join EU but i bet they would let us join in to the Russian Federation :lol:

[retired1212]

how about including Russia in EU? (keeping the neighbors close? ) :D : They wouldnt join EU but i bet they would let us join in to the Russian Federation :lol:

oh yes! they are sending buses and trains full of pretty spies to convince Finns to join them :D

[Happy Times]

how about including Russia in EU? (keeping the neighbors close? ) :D : They wouldnt join EU but i bet they would let us join in to the Russian Federation :lol:

oh yes! they are sending buses and trains full of pretty spies to convince Finns to join them :D I was suprised how the Finnish Security Police announced that they know exactly the numbers and covers of Russian agents in Finland. A slap from some operation i think ;) Wont renue their visas, damn shame. :lol: But theres more where they came from.. Their numbers are back to coldwar level. Something interesting about little Finland? :hmm: http://www.helsinginsanomat.fi/english/article/Finland+tightens+policy+towards+Russian+espionage% 0D%0A/1101981646379

[FERdeBOER]

how about including Russia in EU? (keeping the neighbors close? ) :D

Well, I don't think Russian Federation would like to join the EU. And you understood very well what I mean saying that about neighbours, don't twist the meaning of that. :up:
Moroco is 12 km from Spain (and from UK due Gibratar) and is like they would be at 10000km due the cultural and historic diferences.

In the UK farming became rationalised and more efficient so less reliant on subsidies.

About agriculture and farming, the key is not UK rationalises better the field (probably is true, I believe you), but UK is mainly a Industrial region, as equal as Germany, despite Portugal, Spain, France and Italy have much agriculture and farming... one of those reasons because their climate.
So those countries (and others) have a hughe amount of them and thats one of the reasons of they get more subsidies than UK.

Think about it the next time you drink whine, eat oranges, bananas, Iberian jam... :up:

And I agree with the penalties to France and Germany. Being two of the countries who gives more money to UE does not exent them from applying the rules.

The benefits of the EU such as open borders and free trade do not require a massive central government, so there's no reason these benefits would not remain with a downsized or abolished EU.

If there would not be a centralised goverment I could go to Germany or France, or Italy.... and pay with €, yes, but having to pay more than other citizens for the only reason of not being from that country.

At the end of the day - i'd be perfectly happy if someone would demolish the Tunnel. Kick out all the imigrants, who travel thru every other "European" country before getting to the UK, and basically tell Brussels to get stuffed

How can you say that? UK has been expanding all over the world (South Africa, Australia, India and Pakistan, and so on...) and now you say that you don't want foreign people on your country? :hmm:

[Wim Libaers]

How can you say that? UK has been expanding all over the world (South Africa, Australia, India and Pakistan, and so on...) and now you say that you don't want foreign people on your country? :hmm:

Well, that's normal. The immigration has negative effects (partially because some fraction of the immigrants have less than desireable traits, partially because of the pressure it puts on social security systems esp. in cities), and therefore there is some protest against it. Just like many who didn't like being a colony protested and got rid of English occupation.

[Bellman]

I see no future for the UK in a political union. If we are sleep walked into it the bl**dy minded voters here
will jump right out at the first opportunity. Political Union is an over idealistic concept doomed to failure. :down:

We can live with a strict economic union, providing France and Italy play by the same rules. :ping: