View Full Version : Dive or shoot?
iceflatline
10-20-05, 10:28 AM
planes, planes..., those pesky planes...
my policy has been to dive when encountering allied aircraft. However, recently i've stayed surfaced to see what luck I would have in bringing one down - suffice to say not much.
what are your thoughts? do you dive or shoot?
for those of you that have managed to bring one down, any tips? are you more successful using a crew member with flak quals or do you man the gun yourself?
when planes are brought down, are they counted as tonnage?(sp) If so, how much generally?
Serverdaemon
10-20-05, 10:38 AM
I take them on 90% of the time. Now, when I see 14 planes all lined up waiting to take their shot at me I tend to crash dive I will admit, but generally I figure that if they're going to fly the unfriendly skies around me, then I will undertake to teach them some manners.
S
Kissaki
10-20-05, 10:51 AM
I remember welcoming storms at first because "at least those planes can't fly in this weather". But then they came swarming (ok, maybe just one or two) during a full gale, and my men wouldn't man the guns :(
I have learn in air coverage area'a to say off surface during the day :D
and there is no guarantee even at night sometimes a lone plane with
spot you and attack :D Being a German U boat capt is risky :D
Lane :D
Sailor Steve
10-20-05, 12:18 PM
Sub skippers dive. Gamers shoot. It's different when you can die.
wetwarev7
10-20-05, 12:43 PM
Sub skippers dive. Gamers shoot. It's different when you can die.
Very true.....But then why did the subs have AA guns?
Sailor Steve
10-20-05, 12:48 PM
Sub skippers dive. Gamers shoot. It's different when you can die.
Very true.....But then why did the subs have AA guns?
British infiltrators installed them on the boats to fool unsuspecting U-boatmen into thinking they had a chance.
wetwarev7
10-20-05, 12:54 PM
Sub skippers dive. Gamers shoot. It's different when you can die.
Very true.....But then why did the subs have AA guns?
British infiltrators installed them on the boats to fool unsuspecting U-boatmen into thinking they had a chance.
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
Did they also manufacture the magnetic pistol for the TIIs?
Sailor Steve
10-20-05, 01:18 PM
Did they also manufacture the magnetic pistol for the TIIs?
Now that you mention it, the Germans and Americans both had problems with magnetic pistols (and contact pistols, and torps running too deep), but I don't recall reading about any British problems along those lines...
I usually fight it out on the surface till early 1942. Both sides are about even. After that I dive, dive, and dive deeper. In 1942, the a/c start getting the better weapons and equipment, while all the Uboats get are better radar detectors. So I go with the flow, diving a soon as it gets anything. That and getting attacked by 19 Short Sunderlands in 1943 tend to cure you of fighting it out!
The attack was a beauty to watch on the external cam. 19 Sunderlands attacking me. Altogether 6 planes collided with each other. Of course I got no credit for those!
Still, once you get the single/twin auto 37mm in late 1943(?). It is nice to shoot down a tommie every now and then.
Be very wary once the B-24s come into play, the can lob a lot of bombs at you from outside your effective gun range.
Kissaki
10-20-05, 01:30 PM
Sub skippers dive. Gamers shoot. It's different when you can die.
Very true.....But then why did the subs have AA guns?
Maybe this article can shed some light:
http://www.uboat.net/history/aircraft_losses.htm
iceflatline
10-20-05, 02:13 PM
I usually fight it out on the surface till early 1942.
Did you have any success? Did you man the Flak gun manually or have a Flak gunner do it?
wetwarev7
10-20-05, 02:15 PM
I usually fight it out on the surface till early 1942.
Did you have any success? Did you man the Flak gun manually or have a Flak gunner do it?
I have better luck with the deck gun than my crew, and the crew does better than me on the AA gun...
Kissaki
10-20-05, 02:19 PM
The attack was a beauty to watch on the external cam. 19 Sunderlands attacking me. Altogether 6 planes collided with each other. Of course I got no credit for those!
That really annoys me when it happens to me. Who's to stop me from recording them as kills? Who'd know?
wetwarev7
10-20-05, 02:21 PM
The attack was a beauty to watch on the external cam. 19 Sunderlands attacking me. Altogether 6 planes collided with each other. Of course I got no credit for those!
That really annoys me when it happens to me. Who's to stop me from recording them as kills? Who'd know?
The pilots? Of course, who are they gonna tell?
Kissaki
10-20-05, 02:31 PM
The attack was a beauty to watch on the external cam. 19 Sunderlands attacking me. Altogether 6 planes collided with each other. Of course I got no credit for those!
That really annoys me when it happens to me. Who's to stop me from recording them as kills? Who'd know?
The pilots? Of course, who are they gonna tell?
Yeah, and even if they survived, I'm sure they'd be more than happy to corroborate my version of the story. Wouldn't you rather say you were shot down than crashed into your friend? :P
wetwarev7
10-20-05, 02:35 PM
The attack was a beauty to watch on the external cam. 19 Sunderlands attacking me. Altogether 6 planes collided with each other. Of course I got no credit for those!
That really annoys me when it happens to me. Who's to stop me from recording them as kills? Who'd know?
The pilots? Of course, who are they gonna tell?
Yeah, and even if they survived, I'm sure they'd be more than happy to corroborate my version of the story. Wouldn't you rather say you were shot down than crashed into your friend? :P
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
Good point.
I have one that still rings with disbelief. I was jumped by a Liberator, promptly crash dived and as I went to the periscope station to lower the scope, in comes the Liberator, doing a flaming cartwheel ahead of me and crashes! No, I didn't fire a shot.
I also didn't get credit for the kill ....bummer (i always c/d when approached by an aircraft).
FAdmiral
10-20-05, 03:26 PM
Now, what British commander in his right mind would send out
19 Sunderlands to attack one sub??? A German Battleship
maybe but one stinking little U-Boat, no way....at least not in
reality, only in gaming !!!
JIM
HKreutzkopf
10-20-05, 03:53 PM
I am very cautious about planes. To dive and hard turn is obvious in plane attacks because I got first ever damage in SH by plane attack (pump out, aft torpedo room flooded). I was somehow too slow in that case
But I had another kind of experience too. Just man the AA gun with a proper skilled man and man the bridge with AA-skilled WO. Let them to take shooting planes, but itself, be a captain, don't try to be a hero in all cases - try to steer the boot. As irreguarily as you can.
Result: 1 Hurricane and 1 Sunderland in one patrol. First attack including 4 Hurricanes (AM31) killed my default, skilled gunner.
I leave the AA work to my crew, only a few times do I man it myself.
I can hit the broadside of a ship, but not a pesky little a/c.
Although with the deck gun and late war automatic 37mms, those I like to man myself.
I forgot to add that the 19 a/c was with a vanilla version of SHIII.
snowsub
10-20-05, 06:03 PM
Was thinking of something last night, does the Deckgun elevate enough to shoot HE rounds at the planes?? :hmm:
One hit kill one would think.
None of this rat-a-tat-tat. Boom, goodnight :up: :arrgh!:
EkimRis
10-20-05, 07:46 PM
my buddy took down a plane coming in low with his deck gun the other day, must have been quite the surprise for the pilot!
panthercules
10-20-05, 09:11 PM
my buddy took down a plane coming in low with his deck gun the other day, must have been quite the surprise for the pilot!
Hey - if a Russian tank can shoot down my Bf-109 with it's main gun in IL-2/FB, then I should be able to shoot down a plane in SH3 with my deck gun - seems only fair :)
Cdre Gibs
10-20-05, 10:04 PM
When I'm being attacked by AC I place my Flack gunners (PO's) up and my Deck gunners (PO's) up and then man the DG myself. This is the only time I man the DG myself BTW. I let the Fack Gunner's take care of the AC from abeam to astern and I shoot down AC from abeam to Ahead. Its all in the timing with the DG as u only get roughly a 45° elevation so U have to wait till the AC is heading away and quite a ways out. Lead just enough and BOOM, 1 dead plane via DG. Best used on the Big ol slow bombers like the B4, Sunderland and Welly.
To many hours spent using DG's on Naval units in games leads to using them for every thing. :D
Did they also manufacture the magnetic pistol for the TIIs?
Now that you mention it, the Germans and Americans both had problems with magnetic pistols (and contact pistols, and torps running too deep), but I don't recall reading about any British problems along those lines...
Sure they did. At least with the air dropped torps. During the Bismarck chase the Swordfish from Ark Royal accidently attacked the Sheffield but as the toprs were set for magnetic thay all went off early saving on RN cruiser. They then swtiched to impact, one fish found Bismarcks' rudder...you know the story.
Kissaki
10-21-05, 05:50 AM
Check out clip #4 of the Otto Kretschmer interviews on this page:
http://www.uboat.net/men/interviews/kretschmer.htm
At the end of the clip he briefly muses over the German, British and American torpedoes. The other clips are also great :)
HKreutzkopf
10-21-05, 06:27 AM
Was thinking of something last night, does the Deckgun elevate enough to shoot HE rounds at the planes?? :hmm:
One hit kill one would think.
None of this rat-a-tat-tat. Boom, goodnight :up: :arrgh!:
Maximum elevation angle is too low. And the ammunition isn't proper.
But has anyone tried star shells against low-level planes at night?
Wel...... ALAAAAAAAAAAARM!!! FLOOTEN!!
One bomb (small one if lucky) on the deck and you might as well go home, diving would become to dangerous. (in real life that is)
I use RuB so trying to fend of aircraft is suicide anyway.
What's going on here? :hmm:
I am having Air attack's approx 4am in morning just before dawn.
two times I have been jumped from above and took damage to deck
flak guns and decking happen at lease two times wind's to strong to
man flak guns just made a emg full flank dive. Explosion's rocked
boat on emg dive. Time is Feb 1942 I am using 1.4c with Rubini's HT1.46
I wonder if it may be the Airpower 1.4c HT special version?
I left St Nazaire Jan 1 1942 V11c have been on patrol since Jan 1942
have refueled 3 times from supply ships twice in El Ferrol and Las Palmas harbor Milk cow mod work's great :D Just wonder if anybody
else is getting Jumped at night on surface? I aml looking for my first
enemy ship can't find any?
Later
Lane U-553 :D
BaronVonSchnitzel
10-21-05, 08:37 PM
I'd dive. I typically cruise at at least periscope depth and use a lot of TC to travel quickly.
Submarines are designed to be stealthy and aren't terribly suited for fighting aircraft on the surface. I'm sure there are many exceptions.
rokket2001
10-22-05, 08:49 AM
As has been said before, DIVE!
Historically, the planes won. A Lot. Really a lot.
The guns were first installed due to ingnorance, and later, when the 3 extra guns were added, due to wishful thinking.
I've read various, inc. Herverb Werner's Iron Coffins. Planes win 99% of the time. They could be taken down, but rare and risky. Just dive deep and forget about it. A sub is NOT an AA platform. It's a stealthy torpedo platform.
Sailor Steve
10-22-05, 11:35 AM
Did they also manufacture the magnetic pistol for the TIIs?
Now that you mention it, the Germans and Americans both had problems with magnetic pistols (and contact pistols, and torps running too deep), but I don't recall reading about any British problems along those lines...
Sure they did. At least with the air dropped torps. During the Bismarck chase the Swordfish from Ark Royal accidently attacked the Sheffield but as the toprs were set for magnetic thay all went off early saving on RN cruiser. They then swtiched to impact, one fish found Bismarcks' rudder...you know the story.
Originally I was just trying to make a joke; but you're right-I had forgotten all about the Sheffield incident. Of course the Americans had that problem too, at Midway.
By the way, what if you are using the schorkel? Will you get jumped by AC's without warning or do you have to travel with the Observation periscope raised?
If not, using the schorkel seems way more dangerous than traveling on the surface where you at least have a change of spotting them..
Kaptan Tommy
10-23-05, 07:54 PM
I discovered during the turorial test for AA that if I man the flak gun, I can't hit anything. ANYTHING! But, if I leave the shooting to my experienced, top shelf, highly trained ( :yep: ) pumped up flak crew, I can clear the sky. Of course, I've never been able to get credit for even taking the test (not sure what that's about), but it's fun to watch them.
So, next time I'm attacked from the air (and I'm still operating at the beginning of the war), I'm going to let my crew of expert fools bring down the crazy attackers. They don't know who they're messing with... :rock:
Kissaki
10-23-05, 08:22 PM
I discovered during the turorial test for AA that if I man the flak gun, I can't hit anything. ANYTHING! But, if I leave the shooting to my experienced, top shelf, highly trained ( :yep: ) pumped up flak crew, I can clear the sky. Of course, I've never been able to get credit for even taking the test (not sure what that's about), but it's fun to watch them.
So, next time I'm attacked from the air (and I'm still operating at the beginning of the war), I'm going to let my crew of expert fools bring down the crazy attackers. They don't know who they're messing with... :rock:
Everybody knows that a captain who can't man the flak himself (and not simply delegate the duty to someone actually qualified), is a good-for-nothing landlubber :roll:
I've had the same experience, actually. Of course, when it comes to the deck-gun I'm a marksman, whereas my supposedly trained crew couldn't hit a C3 if we rammed it.
Kaptan Tommy
10-23-05, 10:59 PM
You're exactly right Kissaki. On the deck gun, I'm the king. And it's fun. But the flak gun? I'm just inviting death - to me. A landlubber first class. So, I'll continue to delegate those 'chores' that I'm a flop at. And push my way in to those that are in my MOS.
Same thing goes with torpedo targeting. I let the WO take care of that complex stuff, and leave the final button pushing to me. Wuss? Absolutely. I'm in this for the fun (and the death and destruction). :up:
I've engaged aircraft two or three times early on when I first started playing to get it out of my system. Now when my WO spots some aircraft I dive. They dont pay me to shoot down aircraft. They pay me to attack helpless merchant vessels who if I'm doing it right never knew what hit them. :)
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