View Full Version : So you would like a Destroyer Command 2?
I would like to have a Destroyer Command II what about you?
Every change I get I have used to ask for DC II (on the forum of UBI SHIII (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/ubb.x?a=frm&s=400102&f=857101043)).
They say that after the sales of SH3 would be good they would make a DCII and they also say that it is on the top of there list.
Why am I not certain of that maybe I am a old fart and don't trust those cooperate guy's but its quiet no word of any DC II yet the have announced a SH IV.
Maybe they lost there list? So I am thinking if you want DC II you have to do something for it. You (we) have to get there attention so head over to UBI and remind them that we want a Destroyer Command II. Best way is to reply on one topic and not have several topics about it!
POLL at UBI forum (SH III) http://forums.ubi.com/eve/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=400102&f=857101043&m=4441005903 Keep it at the top!
roverdog
09-20-05, 07:04 PM
Would love a DC 2 with the ability to control BBs and CA, CL. It would be even better if you could control the 40mm AA guns with a fire director like the main guns
GlowwormGuy
09-22-05, 10:59 PM
Just as long as they make it more bloody moddable. I hate how you have to have some sort of gnosis going (and all that specialized equipment and programs) before making a ship.
Mountbatten
Charleston
10-17-05, 04:22 PM
I'd rather hve an upgraded subsim set in the Pacific Theatre.
'Course if they included playable DD's I wouldn't complain. :)
I would love to see a DC2 with so many mods it really should be called DC20! Here is a very short (and by no means complete) list of some of the mods I would like to see:
* Realistic "round Earth" visibility beyond the current approx 12,000 yard limit
*Ability to order speed to the nearest .25 knot
*Enhanced real world wind, weather and current effects
*Enhanced ship dynamic response modeling
*A gunnery model that uses air resistance, projectile spin effects, muzzle velocity variation, etc.
*Realistic modeling of the differences in fire control directors, range finders, radars and computers (i.e., from the Mk I Mod 0 eyeball "That looks about right" method up through a Mk 13 Radar / Mk 38 Director / Mk 8 Rangekeeper / Mk 41 Stable Vertical combination)
*Multiple directors for ships that have them
*Incorporation of ship stability effects (have you ever seen your damaged ship list?)
*A realistic engineering plant
*An open system similar to MS Flight Simulator that easily allows third party add ons for ships, aircraft, scenery, navigation aids, etc.
Yes, I know this is a wish list, but none of it is too hard to do. Ubisoft, are you listening?
... Perfect statement! :yep:
There is a similar discussion going on at the moment at the SH IV forum. I don't cope with the common sub hype. What's more exciting than a big surface unit with her colours still flying ...?
Check these links if you‘re interested and you‘ll see what sort of sim some people miss in a modern version :hmm: :
http://www.german-navy.de/games/gnbna/index.html
http://www.gnbna.8m.com/
@CBDR I agree, excellent list
Realistic "round Earth" visibility beyond the current approx 12,000 yard limit
We both know to our cost what a bummer this is. The KM mod had manual gunnery as one of its central planks but that little item drove a stake into its heart.*A gunnery model that uses air resistance, projectile spin effects, muzzle velocity variation, etc.
Realistic modeling of the differences in fire control directors, range finders, radars and computers (i.e., from the Mk I Mod 0 eyeball "That looks about right" method up through a Mk 13 Radar / Mk 38 Director / Mk 8 Rangekeeper / Mk 41 Stable Vertical combination)
Have you ever seen Tony Lovell's Dreadnought project
http://dreadnoughtproject.org/
go to forums/ simulation development/Naval Fire Control equipment.
Also download his "video chapters" from simulation section
It doesn't take you into the radar age but the attention to detail is mindblowing.
A realistic engineering plant
Could you tell us a bit more on your thought abouit this .
@HS
thanks for the link on GNBNA ... I've heard so much about this game but the site warns how difficult it is to get hold of a copy. I casually tried ebay.co.uk last night and incredibly there was a copy up for sale .... I snapped it up.
On the topic of will there be a DC2 ...... we were given the general impression by Florin in Holland last year, that this was way down UBI's list . It's nominally in there as a possible title but it would only follow SH4 which I belive is scheduled for 2007. On that basis ( even if Ubi commit to it) it is not likely to appear until 2009/10. On the other hand people have been known to change their minds.
This should be a good buy, horsa. GNBNA is one of the very few sims I frequently come back to. That's remarkable for a 1992 sim, isn't it. In the long run few things can beat a detailed and dynamic campaign system, combined with detailed influence on single ships (damage control, gunnery directors, floatplanes, etc.). - The later versions GNB2-5 are less interesting from my point of view since the gameplay is not as good and the quite realistic dynamic campaign system that was part of the original GNBNA is missing.
Unless you haven’t got an old 486 you probably will have to download DOSBox and amend the dosbox.conf file in the DOSBox folder before you get started with GNBNA on a modern PC. Read the DOSBox instructions/ tutorial carefully. It took me some weeks of try and error during my sparetime to get this brilliant game running on my WindowsMe machine (o.k. I’m not exactly an IT or PC genius ;) ). But it was worth the effort in my opinion. Should you have similar problems send me an EMail, perhaps I can help and prevent you from reinventing the wheel again.
Should you have similar problems send me an EMail, perhaps I can help and prevent you from reinventing the wheel again
Thanks. I anticipated this would be a problem so I'm glad I can turn to someone who's had a similar experience. :D
Horsa,
Here are my thoughts regarding what should be modeled for the ship's engineering plant.
* A realistic grouping of boilers by the compartment they are located in. For example, on a Fletcher class DD boilers 1A & 1B will be in the forward fireroom and boilers 2A & 2B will be in the aft fireroom.
* Incorporation of the correct number of cross connects between boiler groupings. On a destroyer there is usually only one cross connect between the forward and aft groups; on a capital ship there may be multiple cross connects.
* Realistic light off times for boilers, and the boiler supplies no propulsion power until it is actually on-line.
* The power required to propel the vessel is proportional to the cube of its speed, and conversely, the maximum speed available is proportional to the cube root of power available. For a four boiler ship, having one boiler on-line means the maximum speed available is about 60% of maximum speed; two boilers will get about 80% of maximum speed; three boilers will get about 90% of maximum speed and the fourth boiler is needed to attain maximum speed.
*Fuel consumption is proportional to power produced (reasonably true for most steam plants), modified somewhat by the plant line up. I ran some tests awhile back regarding the Fletcher's simulated endurance and it was way off.
* A bit more trealistic modelling of the numerous fuel tanks and their effect on the ship's stability, list and trim. On a capital ship it would be interesting for the player to counterflood to offset the results of a torpedo hit.
* For the real masochists: Since DC allows the player the man an AA gun, why not allow the player to operate a boiler (i.e., control fuel, air and water input to the boiler; produce steam at the correct pressure and superheater outlet temperature) or the main engine throttle (maintain ordered RPM without dragging the boiler off-line)?
Aside from the engineering plant, another feature I think would be used quite a bit would be a terrain modifier utility, similar to what X-Plane has. I can imagine some dedicated modders simulating the Panama and Suez canals, detailed ports, etc..
I have seen the dreadnought project site and you are absolute correct - it is a fantastic sight!
Thanks Don. excellent information as always :up:
@HS
GNBNA arrived yesterday and all I can say is WOW. No wonder this is always spoken of lovingly. What a joy it is to get a really well set out and comprehensive manual. Why is it games publishers have bypassed this feature in recent years ? I suppose one reason is the trend to DVD size cases rather than the bulkier box sets. Wouldn't a return to an indespensible manual reduce ( but not remove ) the incidence of pirating ? As long as games come with electronic manuals and/or no need for manuals digital copying is too easy an option. Hackers always find their way past protection devices and can post up on the net but having to scan a manual and make avaiable would be so much more hassle.
Anyway that's a separate issue .... back to GNBNA . I've not had it installed yet but the manual gives me a very clear impression of what makes this game tick and what a well designed game it looks. I can easily see why simmers would want an updated version of this game. I would guess that means mainly the graphics ( and maybe the sound which I've not been able to sample yet) . The basic design seems very sound . I'll take your word for the dynamic campaign - but the fact that it has one and this is what everyone craves for must make this feature a winner.
Strange how Fighting Steel moved away from the FP action inside the ship. As far as I know no-one has really attempted this for a BB since the early nineties ( along with Jutland and maybe Task Force 1942 ?) All were DOS games , yes ? ..... Before my time as a PC gamer LOL.
What a joy it is to get a really well set out and comprehensive manual. Why is it games publishers have bypassed this feature in recent years ? I suppose one reason is the trend to DVD size cases rather than the bulkier box sets. Wouldn't a return to an indespensible manual reduce ( but not remove ) the incidence of pirating ? As long as games come with electronic manuals and/or no need for manuals digital copying is too easy an option. Hackers always find their way past protection devices and can post up on the net but having to scan a manual and make avaiable would be so much more hassle.
You are probably right. And yes, the manual is indeed another utstandig feature of the game.
Anyway that's a separate issue .... back to GNBNA . I've not had it installed yet but the manual gives me a very clear impression of what makes this game tick and what a well designed game it looks. I can easily see why simmers would want an updated version of this game. I would guess that means mainly the graphics ( and maybe the sound which I've not been able to sample yet) . The basic design seems very sound . I'll take your word for the dynamic campaign - but the fact that it has one and this is what everyone craves for must make this feature a winner.
A modern graphic engine for this game would be to good to be true. The general game design however is hard to improve. As to sound: It cannot compete with modern wav.files etc. Since I have both versions of GNBNA (German version Burning Steel) – the older floppy disc version and the CDROM version 1.2 – I would like to add, that sound issues seem to be handled easier with the floppy disc version. With the CDROM version I’ve experienced sound stuttering problems from time to time, choosing the thunder board within the sound.exe file seems to be the best choice. Perhaps you will have other or even better results with other settings, anyway, I would be gratefule for every hint on that matter.
Strange how Fighting Steel moved away from the FP action inside the ship. As far as I know no-one has really attempted this for a BB since the early nineties ( along with Jutland and maybe Task Force 1942 ?) All were DOS games , yes ? ..... Before my time as a PC gamer LOL.
Yes it’s really a market gap. Again, let me know if you have problems with the installation.
GNBNA installed successfully with DOSBOX but my machine is playing no sound at all. I've tried configuring from SOUND.exe but nothing seems to allow the PC to play the sound. :(
Have you checked the DOSBox FAQs? I'll try to send a longer reply tomorrow.
Horsa,
Do you use DOSBox?
Have you activated some relevant sound options in the DOSBox config file ?
Have you activated the sound option within the game itself?
Also check the gnbna site for relevant tipps on sound issues.
Since I use floppy disk and CDROM version of the game it seems to me that the CDROM is a bit more problematic when it comes to sound. After saving a game I have no sound from time to time when loading the saved game. What I do to get rid of this is to start playing with the gnbna sound.exe and the DOSBox config until the sound returns.
If nothing works enjoy the game without sound. It’s a strategic game after all and the game is still worth it. :up:
Regards
HS
Sorry, "Do you use DOSBox?" was strictly speaking not necessary. :oops: Just checked the GNBNA site, there is lot of possibly helpful remarks under the technical help section.
Just checked the site ( thanks) It seems the sound card I have is " almost impossible to congigure" ..... so that explains my problem . I loaded and tried on an old 98 machine and this ran the sound OK. At least there was some sort of synthetic music that came on before the machine curled up and died ( the resaon it was moithballed ) .. I never actually got to the gunnery bit .
So for the moment it looks my choices are no sound or no game. :D
turnerg
01-15-06, 07:09 PM
Horsa, Imagine walking on the decks of the USS Texas, in real-time 3D, just like at the subclub meet.... :rock:
Better yet......DREADNAUGHT (I know you'd love that!)
Personally, I'd love for DC2 not to be DC2, but Surface Command, maybe throw in an element of strategy, allowing you to command a whole task force, with carriers, so you can plan anti sub patrols, replenish at sea, do hunter/killer stuff... it could tie in perfect with SH3, so that the surface players could control a whole h/k group against the wolfpacks. wouldnt that be fun?
Then have massive BB on BB slugfests.....YES!!!! And I could paint ALL the ships with perfect, accurate patterns b/c hopefully there's NO MORE TILING IN THE TEXTURES!!!!!!!! :hulk:
Long time no see, soldier. :D
Doesn't all this seem a little .... well .... tame ...after you've sampled the real thing :D
Yep, nothing to compare with walking the decks of a real dreadnought ( even if it's not the original grandaddy of them all). :cool:
Next month I'm attending an international conference at the NMM in London on Dreadnought. Can you imagine ... talking about nothing except dreadnought for three days .... :cool:
I'm sure there's a surface combat sim in development somewhere ;) and when it comes the textures must be a lot more user friendly . :up:
It seems the sound card I have is " almost impossible to congigure"
That seems a bit strange since DOSBox seems to simulate old sound cards (see config file where Adlib and others are mentioned. :hmm: I’m using Creative Sound Blaster PCI 128 (bought in 2001) without serious sound problems.
roverdog
05-15-06, 04:11 PM
BUMP
I want Destroyer Commander 2!
You know the game is dead out when the stickys disappear!
Destroyer Command 2 sounds good me. :rock:
Malefactor
05-15-06, 05:31 PM
I'll gladly bump this thread.Although,I'm not entirely convinced UBI will actually do a DC2. :roll:
turnerg
05-17-06, 02:25 PM
Oh they will. Or else.... :stare:
I've wondered with sh3 if i could get an S-boat to work the same way as in sh2....
Time to Frankenstein my SH3!!!!
Bertgang
05-22-06, 08:36 AM
Ok for a DC 2, but with a little doubt.
On my point of wiew, online simulations aren't the top to recreate the taste of the WWII anti sub warfare; the main limit, until now, is that lone subs or wolfpacks have to try the attack during a time limit when their opponents are fully vigilant; what kind of sneack attack could be possible, when you need a meeting with your enemy?
Surface or ground combats are more realistic, under this side.
Floater
05-22-06, 08:56 AM
On my point of wiew, online simulations aren't the top to recreate the taste of the WWII anti sub warfare; the main limit, until now, is that lone subs or wolfpacks have to try the attack during a time limit when their opponents are fully vigilant; what kind of sneack attack could be possible, when you need a meeting with your enemy?
That's a very good point. When I've played SH2/DC in multiplayer, the main problem I had was that the DD knew there was a SS out there, and also knew exactly how many there were.
Doesn't stop it being great fun, though. ;)
Albrecht Von Hesse
10-26-06, 05:16 PM
Just got my copy of DC yesterday. I've been playing SHIII for about 6 months now, and it's a bit of a graphics-backwards step, a bit more than I expected, but nothing terribly disheartening about it. Just takes a bit of getting used to. :p
I've played with it enough to know I'd shell out quite a bit for DC2, if it was anything like SHIII.
Couple of quick questions:
1) Is there anything resembling a wiki entry on this, or online players documentation listing bugs, mods, etc.?
2) Is there any way of changing a file so that my up and down arrow keys move the visuals up and down, rather than the bass-akwards way it does now?
3) Are there any sites or forums or clubs devoted mostly to DC?
Thanks for listening!
Heer Kapitain
11-05-06, 04:03 AM
Will there ever be a DC 2 on the market and will it be compatable with SH II, III & IV?
I would love to see a DC2 with so many mods it really should be called DC20! Here is a very short (and by no means complete) list of some of the mods I would like to see:
* Realistic "round Earth" visibility beyond the current approx 12,000 yard limit
*Ability to order speed to the nearest .25 knot
*Enhanced real world wind, weather and current effects
*Enhanced ship dynamic response modeling
*A gunnery model that uses air resistance, projectile spin effects, muzzle velocity variation, etc.
*Realistic modeling of the differences in fire control directors, range finders, radars and computers (i.e., from the Mk I Mod 0 eyeball "That looks about right" method up through a Mk 13 Radar / Mk 38 Director / Mk 8 Rangekeeper / Mk 41 Stable Vertical combination)
*Multiple directors for ships that have them
*Incorporation of ship stability effects (have you ever seen your damaged ship list?)
*A realistic engineering plant
*An open system similar to MS Flight Simulator that easily allows third party add ons for ships, aircraft, scenery, navigation aids, etc.
Yes, I know this is a wish list, but none of it is too hard to do. Ubisoft, are you listening?
If this is what you like then IUF is for you! :yep:
Horsa,
Here are my thoughts regarding what should be modeled for the ship's engineering plant.
* A realistic grouping of boilers by the compartment they are located in. For example, on a Fletcher class DD boilers 1A & 1B will be in the forward fireroom and boilers 2A & 2B will be in the aft fireroom.
* Incorporation of the correct number of cross connects between boiler groupings. On a destroyer there is usually only one cross connect between the forward and aft groups; on a capital ship there may be multiple cross connects.
* Realistic light off times for boilers, and the boiler supplies no propulsion power until it is actually on-line.
* The power required to propel the vessel is proportional to the cube of its speed, and conversely, the maximum speed available is proportional to the cube root of power available. For a four boiler ship, having one boiler on-line means the maximum speed available is about 60% of maximum speed; two boilers will get about 80% of maximum speed; three boilers will get about 90% of maximum speed and the fourth boiler is needed to attain maximum speed.
*Fuel consumption is proportional to power produced (reasonably true for most steam plants), modified somewhat by the plant line up. I ran some tests awhile back regarding the Fletcher's simulated endurance and it was way off.
* A bit more trealistic modelling of the numerous fuel tanks and their effect on the ship's stability, list and trim. On a capital ship it would be interesting for the player to counterflood to offset the results of a torpedo hit.
* For the real masochists: Since DC allows the player the man an AA gun, why not allow the player to operate a boiler (i.e., control fuel, air and water input to the boiler; produce steam at the correct pressure and superheater outlet temperature) or the main engine throttle (maintain ordered RPM without dragging the boiler off-line)?
Excellent list!
Most of what you mention here is already implemented in my early IUF prototype. Check this out:
http://www.dreadnoughtproject.org/heinrich/Media/Images/ForumPics/screenshot_1.png
http://www.dreadnoughtproject.org/heinrich/Media/Images/ForumPics/screenshot_2.png
http://www.dreadnoughtproject.org/heinrich/Media/Images/ForumPics/screenshot_4.png
It seems we have very common ambitions as your list matches the IUF todo list 1:1 :up:
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