Late War Weapon

[Kapitän Cremer]

Traditionally there were 2 effective weapons against the u-boat while it was submerged...The DC and the hedgehogs....

However many people are not aware of the weapon the British developed in the beginning of 1945.

You all know of the basic principle of the hedgehogs....Mass ordinance that was shot out and only detonated upon impact with the u-boat

One of the most succesful u-boat commanders of WW2, named Peter Cremer, called the hedgehog fingers that was trying to touch the boat....

Peter Cremers old boat, U333, were dispatched to Irish sea as he himself got one of the new type XXI boats back in Germany.
The U333 met their ends at the hands of this new weapon.
Same basic principle as the hedgehog, only the difference that it did not incorporate hedgehog ammo, but DC's instead, in a smaller, but extremely powerful version.....

This powerful new weapon was dubbed "The Squid" by the British navy.

Peter Cremer compared this new weapon with his old statement , regarding the hedgehogs, as "A thight Fist hammering through the water and smashing into the u-boat. :down:

As for the effectivness of this weapon, there is hardly no documentation, but the U333 met a violent end.... :doh:

This concludes this little history lesson....
If you wan't to read a good book about the war in the Atlantic, Read "U333" by Peter Cremer.

PS. sorry if I made to many spelling errors :-j

[andy_311]

never encountered it in my last career and I went all the way to war end I doubt it if its in the game (appoligies if am wrong )
Elite dd's=Yes
Sucidal B24 Bomber pilots=Yes
Hedgehogs & DC's=yes
Uber Hedgehogs =No

[caspofungin]

there was some discussion at some point re placing a k-gun in place of a hedgehog and making it an ad hoc squid

[gws226]

There were some pretty amazing technologies on the allied side.

Im not WW2 expert, but there story of the Japenese sub I-52 always amazed me.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_submarine_I-52

They talk of the later war Allied ASW technology that is missing from all the WW2 subsims I've played. Todays sonar boeys, Ascoustic guided torpodos.

There is a recording of the sinking of the I-52 as recorded by the sonar bouys used to track the I52 floating around the internet somewhere. I listened to it a few years back, dunno..... it was really strange to listen to people... well... like that. The only recording I've heard like that,. I'll see if I can find the link.

[bobo]

http://www.mariner.org/atlantic/gg03.htm

recording at bottom of page

[OakGroove]

There is some statistical data in Eberhard Rössler's "Geschichte des deutschen U-Bootbaus" on the lethality of british ASW weapons for 1943, 1944 and 1945, Squid included.

1st half 1943
=============
DC attacks - 554
DC successfull attacks - 27,5
Percentage - 5%

Hedgehog attacks - 53
Hedgehog successfull attacks - 4,5
Percentage - 8,5%


2nd half 1943
============
DC attacks - 401
DC successfull attacks - 15
Percentage - 3,7%

Hedgehog attacks - 49
Hedgehog successfull attacks - 4
Percentage - 8,2%


1st half 1944
============
DC attacks - 404
DC successfull attacks - 30
Percentage - 6,5%

Hedgehog attacks - 70
Hedgehog successfull attacks - 10
Percentage - 14,3%

Squid attacks - 3
Squid successfull attacks - 0
Percentage - 0%


2nd half 1944
============
DC attacks - 98
DC successfull atacks - 5,5
Percentage - 5,6%

Hedgehog attacks - 37
Hedgehog successfull attacks - 13
Percentage - 35,1%

Squid attacks - 23
Squid successfull attacks - 6,5
Percentage - 28,3

1.-5. 1945
============
DC attacks - 107
DC successfull attacks - 7,5
Percentage - 7%

Hedgehog attacks - 59
Hedgehog successfull attacks - 15,5
Percentage - 26,3%

Squid attacks - 24
Squid successfull attacks - 10,5
Percentage - 43,8%

The british Squid mortar consisted of 3 forward launching tubes capable of a throwing range of 550m for the MK VI DC. The MK VI had a 91kg Amatol II filler with a lethal radius of 6,4m against U-Boats. Max. depth setting was 350m, sinking rate 13,4 m/sec, fuze either timer or water pressure.

Principle of function: In the selected depth, the 3 DC's formed a triangle with a side length of circa 36m. A U-Boat positioned within the triangle was usually lost.

Squids were mounted on Frigattes of the Loch- and on Corvettes of the Castle class. The first Squid success against a U-Boat was attributed to the Frigatte "Loch Killin" against U-333 on 31.07.44. The same Frigatte sank U-736 with a Squid attack on 06.08.44.

[Kapitän Cremer]

Yea....Nothing like a quick little messy war to get science going :know:

Lol...tried last night to be DC and hedgehoged by 3 destroyers in 1944......Apparently 2 of the 3 destroyers couldn't agree who was about to make an attack run, and therefore one destroyer fired it's hedgehogs against me...The shame in all this comes to the outer destroyer being right on top of me :-j ....

Was a very nice explosion on the bridge of the destroyer....After that it just went dead in the water and I managed to sneak away and fight another day :arrgh!:

[Mike 'Red Ocktober' Hense]

@ gws - yeah... sonobouys way back then... i thought that was absolutely fascinating...

i read about that a while back while searching for info on Japanese subs...

imagine them operating with these for the longest after the war was over... only when it became apparent that they had the technology, it disclosed... they kept this a better secret than the roswell crash :-j

--Mike

[Ginger Beer]

Would you believe the Squid was still in use with the Royal Navy in the 1970s ?! :yep:

[Godalmighty83]

there were still a lot of old design diesel subs in the water back then in the 70's so the weapon was still theoreticaly effective.

[Ginger Beer]

there were still a lot of old design diesel subs in the water back then in the 70's so the weapon was still theoreticaly effective.

True, very true!

[HMCS]

My father was on several RCNVR ships during the war and he said that the squid was the weapon most fun to watch because of the automated reloading system.

[The WosMan]

there were still a lot of old design diesel subs in the water back then in the 70's so the weapon was still theoreticaly effective.

Well I don't know if the USN had Squids but I do know that US destroyers armed with Hedgehogs kept Soviet type XXI (Foxtrot class I think) at bay during the whole Cuban Missle Crisis in the 60s. I guess one of the subs batteries wouldnt hold a charge and the captain was forced to run home on the surface with his tail tucked between his legs.

[Takeda Shingen]

The Pr. 641/Foxtrot was not a Type XXI, though it, like all early Cold War submarines, incorporated some of it's elements into the design. The boats became operational in 1958, and were the third largest submarine class in history, behind the Project 613/Whiskey, and the German Type VII.