Warrant Officers on US Submarines WW II

[Bubblehead1980]

As is my habit, when assigned a boat for new career, I look into that boats history, read the patrol reports, etc.

Testing out changes to new construction (and hope to try and survive the war) in the Balao USS Cisco SS 290. Cisco was lost on her first patrol in September 1943 in the Sulu Sea to combined aircraft and surface attack by ASW vessels( One a Gunboat, former USS Luzon, captured in 1942). CISCO was likely victim of rushed construction and suffered pers oil leaks during her . Cisco's Captain was Commander James W. Coe, one of the few successful early war skippers, having commanded S-39 at start of the war and then Skipjack (from which he dispatched the famous Toiler Paper memo) Coe's daughter, who was born until after his death, wrote a book called "Full Fathom Five", about Coe Cisco, its construction, short career, and loss, as well as her childhood as a war orphan and how things changed her mothers life. Great book, worth a read.


While looking over the crew roster, I noticed not that many chiefs on board compared to other boats. The XO was also a full commander, as was the CO, and a LTCDR, two LT's, one LT JG, and one Ensign comprised the offiers.

There was also one listed as a Warrant Officer (Torpedoman) . I was not aware of Warrant Officers serving on US submarines during the war. Of all the patrol reports, crew rosters, I do not recall seeing a Warrant Officer aboard.


I've always found the Warrant Officer somewhat confusing. I understand its a former enlisted man who specializes in one field such as this case, torpedoes, but how the fit into chain of command. Are they on the level of a Ensign or? Are they part of the wardroom or consider enlisted? Where would they fit into things on a WW II era sub?

[KaleunMarco]

I've always found the Warrant Officer somewhat confusing. I understand its a former enlisted man who specializes in one field such as this case, torpedoes, but how the fit into chain of command. Are they on the level of a Ensign or? Are they part of the wardroom or consider enlisted? Where would they fit into things on a WW II era sub?

during WWII, there were very few warrant officers in the USN and even fewer in submarine service.
historically, it has been used for specialists, specialists with high and unique skills in one specific area, whatever that area was.
so, in the case of Cisco, they had a torpedo warrant who could probably make a MK14 whistle Dixie in A-flat-minor.
there were boats here and there that probably had a sonar warrant or a gun warrant or maybe a radar warrant, but there were never very many WO.
warrants were never really part of the command structure and although they nominally out-rank chiefs, they would never be in a position to issue orders to a CPO.

since WO were rare, it is probably not appropriate to include them in a simulator such as SH4. now, having said that, this is no way a condemnation of those modders who have included WO in their mega mod.:D
Stock SH4 included E-8 and E-9 and there were no such ranks in the USN during WWII, so there you go. :03:

[Bubblehead1980]

during WWII, there were very few warrant officers in the USN and even fewer in submarine service.
historically, it has been used for specialists, specialists with high and unique skills in one specific area, whatever that area was.
so, in the case of Cisco, they had a torpedo warrant who could probably make a MK14 whistle Dixie in A-flat-minor.
there were boats here and there that probably had a sonar warrant or a gun warrant or maybe a radar warrant, but there were never very many WO.
warrants were never really part of the command structure and although they nominally out-rank chiefs, they would never be in a position to issue orders to a CPO.

since WO were rare, it is probably not appropriate to include them in a simulator such as SH4. now, having said that, this is no way a condemnation of those modders who have included WO in their mega mod.:D
Stock SH4 included E-8 and E-9 and there were no such ranks in the USN during WWII, so there you go. :03:




Thanks for the answer. I agree, don't think they should be a common rank, can't have a boat full of WO's when they were very rare. I could substitute the Master Chief for WO probably, with a in base only promotion, player would have to promote them. I've eliminated crew from gaining the "special abilities". Experimenting with things I edited my crew names/ratings/ranks to reflect that of the real life CISCO crew rosters. Can change the names of crew and their ranks by simple editings name displayable in sections for the crew member.

I did not think about that, as a Warrant Officer(Torpedoman) he was probably assigned as a specialist given all the torpedo issues that were still going on at time of her commissioning in May 1943 and first deployment in September 1943. (CISCO was constructed in record time, which sadly probably contributed to her loss) Always annoyed me they had Senior and Master Chiefs when rank did not exist. Work around is one I mentioned above, in the ranks I changed the name displayable to Chief Petty Officer for both Senior and Master Chief, so they get promoted a step and gain skills(not special though, I eliminated that) experience, but it still displays as CPO, can promote them to Ensign eventually, which became somewhat commonplace during the war, giving senior/experienced, CPO's or those who really distinguished themselves on subs "battlefield commissions", read about quite a few instances. I know it occurred on Jack, Seahorse, among others.


I've eliminated crew from gaining special abilities through promotion but havent yet eliminated the default crew offered in port. Decided may retain them so they will be rare and costly. Could perhaps create a new rank of warrant officer and have Warrant Officer Torpedoman who can make torpedoes whistle dixie in A-Flat-minor" lol and others. So they would be rare and costly, thus not commonly part of crew.

[KaleunMarco]

Thanks for the answer. I agree, don't think they should be a common rank, can't have a boat full of WO's when they were very rare. I could substitute the Master Chief for WO probably, with a in base only promotion, player would have to promote them. I've eliminated crew from gaining the "special abilities". Experimenting with things I edited my crew names/ratings/ranks to reflect that of the real life CISCO crew rosters. Can change the names of crew and their ranks by simple editings name displayable in sections for the crew member.

I did not think about that, as a Warrant Officer(Torpedoman) he was probably assigned as a specialist given all the torpedo issues that were still going on at time of her commissioning in May 1943 and first deployment in September 1943. (CISCO was constructed in record time, which sadly probably contributed to her loss) Always annoyed me they had Senior and Master Chiefs when rank did not exist. Work around is one I mentioned above, in the ranks I changed the name displayable to Chief Petty Officer for both Senior and Master Chief, so they get promoted a step and gain skills(not special though, I eliminated that) experience, but it still displays as CPO, can promote them to Ensign eventually, which became somewhat commonplace during the war, giving senior/experienced, CPO's or those who really distinguished themselves on subs "battlefield commissions", read about quite a few instances. I know it occurred on Jack, Seahorse, among others.


I've eliminated crew from gaining special abilities through promotion but havent yet eliminated the default crew offered in port. Decided may retain them so they will be rare and costly. Could perhaps create a new rank of warrant officer and have Warrant Officer Torpedoman who can make torpedoes whistle dixie in A-Flat-minor" lol and others. So they would be rare and costly, thus not commonly part of crew.

some modder re-worked the enlisted ranks such that there were no E8 & E9 ranks.
ranks were E1-E7 then O1-O4 (for the crew).
if you are really interested in something like that, i can look in my archives to see how he did it.

[Bubblehead1980]

some modder re-worked the enlisted ranks such that there were no E8 & E9 ranks.
ranks were E1-E7 then O1-O4 (for the crew).
if you are really interested in something like that, i can look in my archives to see how he did it.


I am interested.:Kaleun_Salute: