Torpedo's always missing with assisted targeting?

[FeatsOfStrength]

I'm currently undertaking a periscope depth attack at night on a French Medium Cargo, I'm not using manual targeting and am at about 2km distance. Everytime the torpedo's are going on target but about 5m below the keel of the ship. I've tried manually setting just the torpedo depth but it seems to make no difference whatsoever. Is this a bug or is there some other issue?

I am running GWX 3.0 with the following mods:

H.sie patch
M.E.P v6 + visual sensors for GWX
Ahnenerbe WideGUI

Without these mods I don't have any issues, is there something extra I need to do with the above mods or am I missing something?

After about 4 save reloads I am ocassionally able to get 1 torpedo to hit, though there is no difference whatsoever in my actions. Could it be crew skill? I am on my first combat patrol in 1939. The weather is also just rough enough to disallow the deck gun.

[bstanko6]

Do you have magnetic or impact pistol selected? Impact means the torps should be hitting the ship to explode... otherwise the mag torp should blow up under the keel.

What about weather conditions? If you have rough seas, the ship may lurch high above the torp and not explode!

World War 2 problems!!!

[UKönig]

I was thinking of writing up an essay on torpedo malfunctions and possible remedies, to help new players or those interested in war history and wanted some facts without having to go digging for them... maybe now?

[FeatsOfStrength]

Do you have magnetic or impact pistol selected? Impact means the torps should be hitting the ship to explode... otherwise the mag torp should blow up under the keel.

What about weather conditions? If you have rough seas, the ship may lurch high above the torp and not explode!

World War 2 problems!!!

Torpedo's set to magnetic, I'll try switching them to Impact. I've had a look over h.sie's patch documentation and it implements some unreliability into the equation when setting torpedo's. I don't mind not getting a hit everytime I fire a torpedo, the sea could be affecting it too.

thanks!

[Mad Mardigan]

:hmmm:

From what I know of, with h.sie's patch... this modifies the torpedo failure rates to approximate issues that uboats had early on in the war & after some time has passed, to a more less failure rate, or less failures than before at the start of it.

This of course, does NOT take into account what the GWX team may or may not have done to alter the torp stats or data, either... which can only be added in with h.sie's changes... and may or may not bollix up the works, as it were, so to speak.

Another thing to point out, is that @Bstanko6 brings up a valid point as well, is with what settings are on the torps before you send them off on their little homicidal rampage road trip... if they are on impact only & sail off underneath the ship in question... then you are going to be frustrated by the less than stellar performance of the torp in its assigned task, which is to see of sinking the target & failing to go off.

If, they are indeed set for MagDet this could also be indicative of the added in aspects of torp failure as well, hereby affected by the settings again, by the main mod, the h.sie patch & whatever settings you have, as it goes for realism factor in the games settings options menu.

To be frank, if you are in the early on stages of the war, then torp failures are to be expected & be just as frustrating as they were to the kaleuns of the boats that dealt with such occurring.

Also, to be frank here... just only knowing what mods you have baked into SH3, only tells half the tale, as it were... this does NOT take into account, what you have as it pertains to the realism settings, which you didn't make mention of in the initial post.

Am going out on a limb here, and making a guess, based off the way you tagged the initial post & say that you kept the ability to utilize your weap's aka weapons officer (can't remember if he would be the 1WO or 2WO, but.. I digress...) rather than go full bore out with having to do all calculations yourself.... at minimum, but again... that is only a guess.

Any way, hope what I have posted in reply helps to understand & track down if you are indeed facing a bug issue in game, or just simply misunderstanding the settings & what effects they have on sim mechanics... as it pertains to SH3 modded.

:Kaleun_Cheers:

:Kaleun_Salute:

[John Pancoast]

With H.sie's patch you have to take weather into account and set the torpedoes accordingly.

Take (windspeed x .4 = minimum torpedo depth setting). I.e, if the windspeed is 10 m/s, your depth setting would be a minimum of 4 meters. I always add a bit myself, i.e, just over 4 meters depth.

Also GWX boats can be rubber ducky/bounce all over the place in the waves especially with any sort of weather.
As said, your torpedo be set perfectly but still go under their keel due to the ships heavy rocking.

A mod called "Thompsen's Parameters" can fix this and should be applied to any non-NYGM (already done to NYGM ships) install imo.

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=204399

[Fifi]

You could also deactivate Hsie torpedo fix, and see what happens with stock GWX settings...just my 2 cents :salute:

[bstanko6]

If you set the torpedo to impact, you will have to make sure that the torpedo is shallow enough in the water to hit the boat. If the seas are rough, you’ll have more premature destinations. Be careful.

[Kpt. Lehmann]

:hmmm:
This of course, does NOT take into account what the GWX team may or may not have done to alter the torp stats or data, either... which can only be added in with h.sie's changes... and may or may not bollix up the works, as it were, so to speak.

To be frank, if you are in the early on stages of the war, then torp failures are to be expected & be just as frustrating as they were to the kaleuns of the boats that dealt with such occurring.

Also, to be frank here... just only knowing what mods you have baked into SH3, only tells half the tale, as it were... this does NOT take into account, what you have as it pertains to the realism settings, which you didn't make mention of in the initial post.

Any way, hope what I have posted in reply helps to understand & track down if you are indeed facing a bug issue in game, or just simply misunderstanding the settings & what effects they have on sim mechanics... as it pertains to SH3 modded.



Hi Mad Mardigan, Hi All.

MM, I'm glad you brought this all up. I am the guy who set all torpedo changes in the GWX files.

In terms of torpedo steerage, I changed only one value, and that was in the vertical plane only. In stock SH3, torpedoes leaving the tube could, close to instantly, change their vertical height, by 20 degrees. (This is the Max Dive Angle in the Torpedo.sim file, and the same when viewed by the observer, really wrecks the sense of mass v inertia.) Knowing that torpedoes in SH3 require 300 meters to arm and will find their set running depth, we set the max dive angle at 3 degrees. For clarity, we did not, change the max turn angle.... and we did not change any settings that relate to depth-keeping or direct detonation reliability. Furthermore, we did not change anything that relates to how manual attacks are carried out.

I hope this is helpful and clears some things up.:salute:

[FeatsOfStrength]

:hmmm:

From what I know of, with h.sie's patch... this modifies the torpedo failure rates to approximate issues that uboats had early on in the war & after some time has passed, to a more less failure rate, or less failures than before at the start of it.

This of course, does NOT take into account what the GWX team may or may not have done to alter the torp stats or data, either... which can only be added in with h.sie's changes... and may or may not bollix up the works, as it were, so to speak.

Another thing to point out, is that @Bstanko6 brings up a valid point as well, is with what settings are on the torps before you send them off on their little homicidal rampage road trip... if they are on impact only & sail off underneath the ship in question... then you are going to be frustrated by the less than stellar performance of the torp in its assigned task, which is to see of sinking the target & failing to go off.

If, they are indeed set for MagDet this could also be indicative of the added in aspects of torp failure as well, hereby affected by the settings again, by the main mod, the h.sie patch & whatever settings you have, as it goes for realism factor in the games settings options menu.

To be frank, if you are in the early on stages of the war, then torp failures are to be expected & be just as frustrating as they were to the kaleuns of the boats that dealt with such occurring.

Also, to be frank here... just only knowing what mods you have baked into SH3, only tells half the tale, as it were... this does NOT take into account, what you have as it pertains to the realism settings, which you didn't make mention of in the initial post.

Am going out on a limb here, and making a guess, based off the way you tagged the initial post & say that you kept the ability to utilize your weap's aka weapons officer (can't remember if he would be the 1WO or 2WO, but.. I digress...) rather than go full bore out with having to do all calculations yourself.... at minimum, but again... that is only a guess.

Any way, hope what I have posted in reply helps to understand & track down if you are indeed facing a bug issue in game, or just simply misunderstanding the settings & what effects they have on sim mechanics... as it pertains to SH3 modded.

:Kaleun_Cheers:

:Kaleun_Salute:

I prefer a more realistic experience and have everything enabled difficulty wise except manual torpedo's and external views (I like to look at the submarine from the outside). I think you may be right, I do twiddle with the settings a bit though I find it a chore to look up and calculate the type/distance/speed/angle of the enemy ship in question and prefer to play it by ear as it were/leave it to my weapons officer.

Switching to Impact didn't make any difference, even manually setting the variables the torpedo's still did the same and flew under the ship by about 5 metres. I'm just going to roll with it though I think and wait till the weather improves, I did manage to get a passenger/cargo so the patrol isn't a complete loss if I don't hit another thing.

[FeatsOfStrength]

You could also deactivate Hsie torpedo fix, and see what happens with stock GWX settings...just my 2 cents :salute:

That would probably fix it however other than the torpedo reliability changes the Hsie adds so many improvements I'd rather keep it even if I can't hit ****. Still on my first patrol so I'm going to wait it out and see if it improves.

It will give me a motive to not be lazy and get used to TDC at least.

When playing on easier settings it's hard sometimes to remember that in real life most Kaleun's didn't return from each patrol with over 60k worth of tonnage under their belt! I'll just focus on survival.

[Maddin25]

Switching to Impact didn't make any difference, even manually setting the variables the torpedo's still did the same and flew under the ship by about 5 metres. I'm just going to roll with it though I think and wait till the weather improves, I did manage to get a passenger/cargo so the patrol isn't a complete loss if I don't hit another thing.

Keep in mind that the hsie torpedo fix works like this

The fix models a failure by simply
setting the torpedo depth to 25m.

So when you see your torpedo running under the ship, it's for realism ;-)

[Fifi]

That would probably fix it however other than the torpedo reliability changes the Hsie adds so many improvements I'd rather keep it even if I can't hit ****. Still on my first patrol so I'm going to wait it out and see if it improves.

It will give me a motive to not be lazy and get used to TDC at least.

When playing on easier settings it's hard sometimes to remember that in real life most Kaleun's didn't return from each patrol with over 60k worth of tonnage under their belt! I'll just focus on survival.

No, just uncheck the box for torpedo fix! And keep the other Hsie fixes :yep:

[Mad Mardigan]

Hi Mad Mardigan, Hi All.

MM, I'm glad you brought this all up. I am the guy who set all torpedo changes in the GWX files.

In terms of torpedo steerage, I changed only one value, and that was in the vertical plane only. In stock SH3, torpedoes leaving the tube could, close to instantly, change their vertical height, by 20 degrees. (This is the Max Dive Angle in the Torpedo.sim file, and the same when viewed by the observer, really wrecks the sense of mass v inertia.) Knowing that torpedoes in SH3 require 300 meters to arm and will find their set running depth, we set the max dive angle at 3 degrees. For clarity, we did not, change the max turn angle.... and we did not change any settings that relate to depth-keeping or direct detonation reliability. Furthermore, we did not change anything that relates to how manual attacks are carried out.

I hope this is helpful and clears some things up.:salute:

With regards my comment of '' From what I know of, with h.sie's patch... this modifies the torpedo failure rates to approximate issues that uboats had early on in the war & after some time has passed, to a more less failure rate, or less failures than before at the start of it.

This of course, does NOT take into account what the GWX team may or may not have done to alter the torp stats or data, either... which can only be added in with h.sie's changes... and may or may not bollix up the works, as it were, so to speak. ''

What I was getting at here, and if I bollixed that up and had it sounding as if I was blaming you, then my apologies. My point was, more in the vein of mods, adding them in game to correct various errors the dev's made that leave a lot to be desired in game, and the impact that doing so may or may not have things going off in wild tangents that was not originally intended to occur. That sometimes adding in mods can have undesirable after effects.

Not knowing what was done with regards to the torp settings, which I know that I appreciate you taking the time to explain, by the way... added with what setting up h.sie's patch in addition, could possibly have unintended issues... again, not in any means an indictment of blame, an if it was thought that, that was what I did.. then my sincerest apologies, as that was never my intent.

As it is, I have very much respect for mods & those who invest time, effort & a lot of hair pulling at times, frustration when things don't go off as planned. I may not be up to what all goes into modding , but I did early on do a bit of learning about coding & programming simpler dos games back in the day... and know how frustrating it can be even then if a single thing was left out, mis-coded at any stage of coding & the end result of the whole thing crashing or having wild things occur that were not intended.

I know not exactly the same thing, but... still, major respect to modders nonetheless...

A tip of the cap to all the modders, no matter what game or sim they work to come up with fixes, solutions for or improvements to the community...

:Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:

:Kaleun_Applaud:

:Kaleun_Cheers:

:Kaleun_Salute:

[John Pancoast]

With regards my comment of '' From what I know of, with h.sie's patch... this modifies the torpedo failure rates to approximate issues that uboats had early on in the war & after some time has passed, to a more less failure rate, or less failures than before at the start of it.

This of course, does NOT take into account what the GWX team may or may not have done to alter the torp stats or data, either... which can only be added in with h.sie's changes... and may or may not bollix up the works, as it were, so to speak. ''

What I was getting at here, and if I bollixed that up and had it sounding as if I was blaming you, then my apologies. My point was, more in the vein of mods, adding them in game to correct various errors the dev's made that leave a lot to be desired in game, and the impact that doing so may or may not have things going off in wild tangents that was not originally intended to occur. That sometimes adding in mods can have undesirable after effects.

Not knowing what was done with regards to the torp settings, which I know that I appreciate you taking the time to explain, by the way... added with what setting up h.sie's patch in addition, could possibly have unintended issues... again, not in any means an indictment of blame, an if it was thought that, that was what I did.. then my sincerest apologies, as that was never my intent.

As it is, I have very much respect for mods & those who invest time, effort & a lot of hair pulling at times, frustration when things don't go off as planned. I may not be up to what all goes into modding , but I did early on do a bit of learning about coding & programming simpler dos games back in the day... and know how frustrating it can be even then if a single thing was left out, mis-coded at any stage of coding & the end result of the whole thing crashing or having wild things occur that were not intended.

I know not exactly the same thing, but... still, major respect to modders nonetheless...

A tip of the cap to all the modders, no matter what game or sim they work to come up with fixes, solutions for or improvements to the community...

:Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:

:Kaleun_Applaud:

:Kaleun_Cheers:

:Kaleun_Salute:


I've run a lot of patrols and campaigns with GWX and H.sie's patch torpedo option as have many others.
The two work together just fine.


Hope this helps.

[Kpt. Lehmann]

I've run a lot of patrols and campaigns with GWX and H.sie's patch torpedo option as have many others.
The two work together just fine.
Hope this helps.

You got here just in time, John. I was gonna have to get the dish rack out again for MM. :yep:

In all seriousness, no worries Mad Mardigan, from the player standpoint, I'm sure it can all be hard to trust at times.:up:

Now don't quote me on this bit.... but if I recall correctly (and I am not certain for sure) the Hsie hardcode fixes may cause the torps to frequently run too deep to simulate duds. Frequent at beginning of the war and lessening with time. Not sure.

[mwigg3]

If you want more precision on your torpedoes, open the torpedotubes before the attack. It became like a new game for me after I found out:o