Up to 14 dead in fire in Russian submarine

[Kapitan]

Just seen this thoughts with the families

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-48844013?ns_campaign=bbcnews&ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_mchannel=social&ns_source=facebook

[Jimbuna]

Fourteen sailors have been killed after a fire broke out on a Russian submarine.

Russia's Defence Ministry said the blaze erupted on Monday while the vessel was performing tests.

The ministry said in a statement that the fire was extinguished thanks to the crew's "self-sacrifice".

It added that the submersible is now at the Arctic port of Severomorsk, the main base of Russia's Northern Fleet.

The ministry's statement said the submersible is intended for studying the seabed, but did not give its name or type.

The Russian navy uses Priz-class and Bester-class deep water vehicles, which have a hull built of titanium and are capable of operating at a depth of 3,281ft (1,000 meters)

The blaze marks the deadliest Russian naval incident since 2008, when 20 died when a firefighting system was accidentally initiated while the Nerpa nuclear-powered submarine of Russia's Pacific Fleet was undergoing trials.

In the deadliest naval incident in post-Soviet Russia, the Kursk nuclear submarine exploded and sank on 12 August 2000, during naval manoeuvres in the Barents Sea, killing all 118 crewmembers.
https://news.sky.com/story/fourteen-dead-in-russian-submarine-fire-11755295
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-48844013

Tragic :nope:

[Jimbuna]

Threads merged.

[Dmitry Markov]

Fire underwater is one of the worst things that can happen. Since this vessel is top-secret we (the wide public) will know what happened only some 30+ years later. And I cannot blame anyone for that - that's natural flow of things considering uniqueness and character of work of that craft. To say more - as a civil person I don't really need to know that. But what I want to be sure of - is that they had thoroughly investigated the calamity and that cadets at Navy Schools will be studying this case along with others. And of course I feel very sorry for loved ones and relatives of fourteen good guys who are on eternal patrol from now on: sadly their third toast would have a very personal sense (((

[Kapitan]

I’m getting reports the submarine involved Is a mini submarine of the losharik class

[Dmitry Markov]

So do our mass media say

[Catfish]

Yes, seems like it is AS 12 'Losharik' (Project 1083 1), its 'mothership' is a former Delta III with a changed back, maybe the 'Lorenburg'.
https://news.usni.org/2019/07/02/14-sailors-die-on-secretive-russian-nuclear-submarine
Capable to dive to 6000 meters, due to its interior pressure-resistent ball design ('losharik' is a russian cartoon horse consisting of balls)

A terrible accident, feeling sorry for the sailors and their families.

[Mr Quatro]

True it is sad ... Will certainly pray for them, but my hope is for any survivor's :yep:

Look fwd to more information ... She must have surfaced or there wouldn't be anything left to count.

[Platapus]

Can't imagine how terrifying a fire inside a submarine would be.


Thoughts for the families.

[ikalugin]

It could have been fire supression that hit them.

[Bilge_Rat]

article in the Moscow times on what is known so far, apparently only 4-5 survivors:

https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2019/07/03/what-we-know-about-russias-deadly-nuclear-sub-fire-so-far-a66264

[Dmitry Markov]

Great loss of top-officers and one-of-a-kind specialists. Seven Capitains of first Rank, two Heroes of Russia cavaliers. They've managed to throw out civil specialist from the burning compartment saving his life before self-locking in it. Somehow like in "72 meters" movie..

[Jimbuna]

Can't imagine how terrifying a fire inside a submarine would be.


Thoughts for the families.

:yep:

[Onkel Neal]

New Details On Russian Submarine Fire Emerge Along With An Intriguing Schematic (Updated)

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/28814/new-details-on-russian-submarine-fire-emerge-along-with-an-intriguing-schematic

Krasnaya Zvezda, the official newspaper of the Russian Ministry of Defense, has included a heretofore unseen drawing of the Project 09852 Belgorod, a heavily modified Oscar II-class submarine outfitted for various "special projects" missions, in its latest report about a fire that killed 14 sailors onboard a still-unnamed Russian submarine on Monday. Russia officially launched the still-under-construction Belgorod, which is presently the world's longest submarine, in April 2019. At the same time, new details regarding the July 1st accident have begun to trickle out, although they are limited in number and some are unconfirmed in nature.

Though Belgorod is more widely associated with the Poseidon nuclear-powered and nuclear-armed long-range torpedo, this special mission boat will also be capable of serving as a mothership for smaller, highly specialized, and deep-diving submarines, such as the Project 10831 Losharik. Independent Russian media outlets have widely reported that Lorsharik, also known by the hull number AS-12 and more recently AS-31, was the submarine that experienced the deadly blaze on July 1, 2019.

[Mr Quatro]

When they said the fire was in the engine room my first thoughts were, "Oh it must be a conventional submarine", but it in fact just a modified Oscar class nuclear submarine with a 100' section added in for her special underwater operations.

Catfish reported that she could dive to 6,000 meters ... I doubt that perhaps the mini sub she carried could dive that far. :yep:

[Kapitan]

Think the mother ship involved is the KC64 Moscow a modified delta IV carrying the losharik mini submarine

It was losharik that was involved in the incident

I’m getting info from different sources all pointing to the mother ship being KC64

[Mr Quatro]

So it wasn't the mother ship, but the mini sub losharik ...
Which leaves the program still intact due to it was experimental underwater work.

Hush hush top secret :yep:

[Catfish]

When they said the fire was in the engine room my first thoughts were, "Oh it must be a conventional submarine", but it in fact just a modified Oscar class nuclear submarine with a 100' section added in for her special underwater operations.

Catfish reported that she could dive to 6,000 meters ... I doubt that perhaps the mini sub she carried could dive that far. :yep:

No, i think the modified Oscar was not involved here, as far as i read from various sources it is a modified Delta III submarine BS-136 as 'mothership' (in this case the 'Orenburg', former K-129) and the "AS 12", "AS 31", "Losharik", "spy sub", "deepsea station", "research sub" (lol) or whatever the russian military calls it, is slung beneath it to hide it from satellite or aerial reconnaissance.

The Delta does not dive that deep, but the small parasite sub maybe can, if you look at the inner titanium ball construction. The Russians have already built extreme deep-diving tactical subs of much bigger sizes. No doubt this one is a very special and expensive sub. Question is if it ever dives again, when a battery fire has weakened the titanium hull of one or several ball compartments. Then add acid fumes.

This smaller sub can manipulate or cut undersea cables along with planting devices for listening, in this arctic mission it has been used to "prove" Russia's claims on certain resource-rich areas under water in the arctic; in this case to look for geological relations* of certain areas to the russian continental shelf. "Scientific Research", lmao.

(*What geological relations have to do with arbitrarily drawn political borders, or what this "proves" regarding territorial claims? Must be a special russian idea or secret. I call BS.
Like planting a flag underwater. Claiming colonies in the 21st century? Really?)


Regarding the lengthened Oscar class, seems it is designed to place bigger devices on the sea floor, like e.g. nuclear reactors to provide the power for transatlantioc cable listening stations, the russian equivalent of SOSUS, and something like that.

[ikalugin]

The incident was on AS-31 "Losharik" speical purpose deep diving sub. That sub uses nuclear power plant. The fire is reported to have been electric, the crew pushed out the civilian industrial specialist out of the compartment and proceded to fight the power till they managed to take it out. However it appears that they either perished in the fire or shortly afterwards, most likely from smoke/gasses etc.

[Onkel Neal]

'There's An Incident Involving A Russian Submarine Every Five Or Six Years'

RFE/RL's Russian Service spoke with Dmitry Gorenburg, an associate with the Davis Center for Russian and Eurasian Studies at Harvard University and a researcher with the U.S.-based Center for Naval Analyses, and asked him about the Losharik incident and the state of Russia's nuclear submarine fleet.

RFE/RL: What can you tell us about the Losharik submarine and its function?

Dmitry Gorenburg: This submarine has an unusual construction with a double hull. The exterior is made of titanium, while the internal hull comprises several isolated spheres. It is not, strictly speaking, a "real" submarine because it is transported using large atomic submarines, usually the Orenburg, although the Belgorod can also serve. Because of its internal nuclear reactor, it can remain submersed for extended periods and can operate almost noiselessly. According to some sources, it is the quietest submarine in the Russian arsenal.

Full Article (https://www.rferl.org/a/interview-incident-involving-a-russian-submarine-every-five-or-six-years/30034923.html)

.

[Dmitry Markov]

That's no surprise taking into account 20+ years of disregard towards the Navy. With such luggage it's hard to say how much time would be needed to make our submariners's service more safe. Howerver "safe" and "submarine" are two words that don't come together. Nature of that vessels means that anything can happen anytime.

[Mr Quatro]

The picture is getting clearer ... the mother submarine might not even have been involved due to the close proximity of the accident with the mini-sub operating on her own doing her thing in local waters with a civilian scientist on board the sub was still in it's shake down form.

A sub that small with it's own nuclear power plant? Wow!

I wonder if the USN even has anything like this one in mind?

[Rockstar]

(*What geological relations have to do with arbitrarily drawn political borders, or what this "proves" regarding territorial claims? Must be a special russian idea or secret. I call BS.
Like planting a flag underwater. Claiming colonies in the 21st century? Really?)





With arctic sea lanes opening up the race is on for coastal nations to gain access too, exploit and defend this new resource rich enviroment. UNCLOS, I think, has certain provisions which allow coastal states to measure the seabed/continental shelf and if things add up. Then according to those provisions, it would allow Russia to establish claims which extend beyond the usual 200 mile EEZ.


(like I said: "I think") :hmmm:

[palito]

Oscar boat is Belgorod newly released, Spec Ops boat, supposedly equipped with Kanyon torpedoes. Losharik, however, is assigned to BS-136 Orenburg and BS-64 Podmovskoye. Reports claims that mothership involved was BS-136 Orenburg. The truth will never see the light of day.

[Mr Quatro]

Oscar boat is Belgorod newly released, Spec Ops boat, supposedly equipped with Kanyon torpedoes. Losharik, however, is assigned to BS-136 Orenburg and BS-64 Podmovskoye. Reports claims that mothership involved was BS-136 Orenburg. The truth will never see the light of day.

Thank you palito check in more often

https://tech-news.websawa.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/tragedy-on-a-submarine-how-to-construct-bs-136-orenburg-and-as-12-losharik-8.jpg

The scheme of “Losharik” in the context. Displacement: 1,000 tons. Crew: 25 persons. Length: 75 meters

[Catfish]

So a top Russian naval officer said that the dead sailors (fighting the fire or whatever) saved the submarine fire from being a 'planetary catastrophe' ?

https://www.businessinsider.de/dead-sailors-saved-submarine-fire-from-being-a-planetary-catastrophe-2019-7?r=US&IR=T

Makes one think.. what did or does it carry, is the reactor some new design that brings about something being even more harmful than what we already tinker with?
How to handle people and nations that bring the world to the brink of a catastrophe 'just so'?

[ikalugin]

It is a hyperbolae to glorify their damage con efforts.

[Dmitry Markov]

I agree with ikalugin - seems like a figure of speech to honour the fallen comrades.

[Aktungbby]

Oscar boat is Belgorod newly released, Spec Ops... The truth will never see the light of day.
palito!:Kaleun_Salute: AFTER A 6 YEAR SILENT RUN...THE LIGHT OF DAY!?? I'D IMAGINE THERE ARE A FEW 'TOP BRASS' JOB OPENINGS: The following seamen were killed in the 1 July 2019 incident:
Captain 1st Rank


Denis Dolonskiy, The commanding officer of the submarine, Hero of Russia, awarded two Orders of Courage (including one posthumously), Order of Naval Merit (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_Naval_Merit_(Russia))[33] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_submarine_Losharik#cite_note-mil-33)
Konstantin Ivanov, awarded two Orders of Courage (one posthumously), Order of Military Merit
Andrey Voskresenskiy, Hero of Russia (posthumously), three Orders of Courage, Order of Military Merit. He was a son-in-law of the Chief of Sosnovy Bor (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sosnovy_Bor,_Leningrad_Oblast) Naval Training Centre for Nuclear Submarine Crews Counter admiral (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counter_admiral)Vladimir Bederdinov (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Vladimir_Bederdinov&action=edit&redlink=1)[34] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_submarine_Losharik#cite_note-Lenta3Jul-34)
Konstantin Somov, Hero of Russia (posthumously), three Orders of Courage
Denis Oparin, Hero of Russia (posthumously), Order of Courage. He was a son of the chief of the submarine division that included Losharik, Alexander OparinVladimir Abankin, awarded two Orders of Courage (one posthumously)
Nikolay Filin, test pilot of military deep-diving manned submersibles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submersible), Hero of Russia (2018), awarded four Orders of Courage (including one posthumously), Order of Miltary Merit (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_Military_Merit_(Russia))[33] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_submarine_Losharik#cite_note-mil-33)[34] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_submarine_Losharik#cite_note-Lenta3Jul-34)

Captain 2nd Rank


Alexander Avdonin, awarded two Orders of Courage (one posthumously)
Dmitriy Solovyev, Hero of Russia (posthumously)
Sergey Danilchenko, awarded two Orders of Courage (one posthumously)

Captain 3rd Rank


Viktor Kuzmin, awarded Order of Courage (posthumously)
Vladimir Sukhinichev, awarded Order of Courage (posthumously)

Other Crew


Lieutenant Captain Mikhail Dubkov, awarded Order of Courage (posthumously)

Lieutenant Colonel of Medical Service Alexandr Vasilyev, awarded Order of Courage (posthumously)

[Kapitan]

The picture is getting clearer ... the mother submarine might not even have been involved due to the close proximity of the accident with the mini-sub operating on her own doing her thing in local waters with a civilian scientist on board the sub was still in it's shake down form.

A sub that small with it's own nuclear power plant? Wow!

I wonder if the USN even has anything like this one in mind?

Just to answer me Quattro yes there has been a submarine as small powered by a nuclear reactor the NR1