Paris on fire

[Rockstar]

Heard its been going on for eight days now.


PARIS (AP) — French police fired tear gas and water cannons to disperse violent demonstrators in Paris on Saturday, as thousands gathered in the capital and beyond and staged road blockades to vent anger against rising fuel taxes.
Thousands of police were deployed nationwide to contain the eighth day of deadly demonstrations that started as protests against tax but morphed into a rebuke of President Emmanuel Macron and the perceived elitism of France’s ruling class. Two people have been killed since Nov. 17 in protest-related tragedies.

https://www.apnews.com/d3033b920af449b594e66b51890b517b

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEDSiWVRVdc

[Jimbuna]

The French are not in as high a number as the UK regarding union membership but they are far superior in the manner in which they demonstrate their perceived grievances.

Macron is most likely currently the most unpopular President for decades.

[Rockstar]

French President Moron the least popular president? Say its not so. I just cant see how this happened he appeared to be just oozing with decorum! It seems France has buried themselves in deep with ridiculous labor laws that protect 'slackers'. Now when they try to get out from under it all hell breaks loose.


In other news: French police were already feeling under siege after a terrorist murdered police commander Jean-Baptiste Salvaing and his partner at their home Monday night. The terrorist then took the couple’s 3-year-old son hostage.


No wonder Trump didn't want to stand out in the open next to Moron.


Looks like any plans to visit France are being cancelled today.

[Skybird]

Macronman surely has lost his cape recently. Still, the German coalition has recently agreed to his desire for forming a European union of joined liabilities, to distract from the financial worries of France . A European unemployment insurrance and European social wellfare is next. The Germans long wanted to prevent that, sicne it is them financing the biggets part of that. The zombie coalition now just tries to save itself over time by now falling back from all its defence positions and surrender to these things - that Germany will pay for, pay, pay, pay. And German citizens even demnd more of that! There is no therapy for Germaness.

My despise for this parasitical opportunistic selfish scum is as unlimited as my fury against them. If I would see any of them lying on the street needing help, I would turn away, would not mind and would not care, letting dogs have their fun with them. Utmost despicable they are.


And deeper and deeper the EU dives. Will not stop until it has hit rock bottom. Since the situation in the Us is messed up by now as well, for other reasons, and Russia and China seem to steer into more and more turbulent water, plus all the many planet-wide, gobal crisis, I started to wonder if maybe we witness the agony of our our whole era, our whole civilization. When you have crossed the peak, on the other side it necessarily goes way down.


Makes the perfect timing of this moment I call my life and present so much more precious.

[STEED]

Mr Popular no more, its true what they say you voted for it you are stuck with it until you can vote them out.

[em2nought]

Le Pen would probably win now, unless they preemptively placed her in jail for speaking truth. :har:

[Jimbuna]

Le Pen would probably win now, unless they preemptively placed her in jail for speaking truth. :har:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/sep/20/france-marine-le-pen-scorns-court-ordered-psych-tests-after-sharing-images-of-is-killings

https://www.independent.co.uk/topic/marine-le-pen

[STEED]

Le Pen would probably win now, unless they preemptively placed her in jail for speaking truth. :har:
I am not too sure she would but clearly her vote would go up.

[Jimbuna]

Currently at 30%

[Onkel Neal]

This is getting almost no coverage here, but I have been following in the UK/Euro news.

'Gilets jaunes' protest against Macron policies in Paris and across France – in pictures (https://www.theguardian.com/world/gallery/2018/nov/24/gilets-jaunes-protest-against-macron-policies-in-paris-and-across-france-in-pictures)

https://www.connexionfrance.com/French-news/Gilets-Jaunes-Protests-against-fuel-rises-continue-into-fourth-day-across-France

https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/d9dc3c532db7e7599fb64db179854a8229fe11df/0_0_5568_3712/master/5568.jpg?width=1010&quality=85&auto=format&fit=max&

So, the French govt is trying to tax fuel to keep climate change under control...when it hurts the pocketbook, suddenly a lot of greenies get upset. :haha:

[Catfish]

:hmmm: (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2578728&postcount=1)

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=239237

[Rockstar]

Oh I dont know if it has much to with President Moron's pledge to ban gasoline cars by 2040. He's stupid but not that stupid I think he would have touted at least one viable solution before raising taxes for that reason.

Another tax increase is slated for January, can't wait. :yeah:

From Le Monde: google translate https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.lemonde.fr%2Fpolitique%2Fartic le%2F2018%2F11%2F19%2Fgilets-jaunes-la-mobilisation-continue-le-19-novembre-avec-des-blocages_5385520_823448.html&edit-text=&act=url

There is, in the revolt of "yellow vests", a sense of abandonment of the small middle class who feels like the big loser of the reforms, winning too much to be helped, or being exempted from certain taxes, but not enough to live easily. All in territories where public services have become scarce, and where people no longer see the counterpart of the payment of tax.

[Jimbuna]

Embattled French President Emmanuel Macron has said he will not abandon a controversial fuel tax, as he set out France's future energy strategy.

The so-called yellow vests protests have seen thousands take to the streets across France over fuel prices.

But Mr Macron struck a conciliatory tone, saying he was open to ideas and revising how the fuel tax was applied.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-46356649

He's certainly not 'Mr Popular' atm.

[Skybird]

The French unrest seems to be about the growing burdening by taxation and service fees and the climbing living costs in general, of which the symptomatic raise in gasoline taxes is just the tip of an iceberg. ;)

[Rockstar]

"You cannot chant in the same slogan: 'cut taxes and build more crèches, schools'," Macron said.

"I will not confuse citizens and their demands with thugs," Macron said. "I will not cede any ground to those who want to destroy and create disorder," Macron said.

But he conceded the increase in diesel tax, which kicked in just as pump prices were rising, had inflicted more pain than anticipated.

http://news.trust.org/item/20181127141830-39x1i


Macron should do what those shifty thieves here in Maryland did. Wait until the cost a fuel goes down THEN raise taxes bringing it back up to where it was.

[mapuc]

My little experience with people demonstrating is that there is more to it than most of us think.

I guess this annoncement about extra tax on gasoline, was the thing that made the boble explode.

Markus

[Onkel Neal]

:hmmm: (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2578728&postcount=1)

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=239237

Oh man :oops:

[Dirk Gently]

Great thread. I admire how it hasn't evolved into a flame war given the current political situation in the media and on the internet in general.

[Onkel Neal]

Just wait :)

[Rockstar]

Oh I dont know, France could be burning to the ground, massive protests, their leaders the target of assassins and terrorists. But wouldn't ya know it the focus is on, Trump, his lack of decorum and the size of his hands. You know, things that REALLY matter. I don't expect to hear much from the peanut gallery.

[Dowly]

Says the only guy who has brought up Trump in this thread.

[Jeff-Groves]

Says the only guy who has brought up Trump in this thread.
I was playing trumps the other day. Does that count?

[Rockstar]

I don't expect to hear much from the peanut gallery.


Originally Posted by Dowly http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/smartdark/viewpost.gif (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=2579284#post2579284)
Says the only guy who has brought up Trump in this thread.


Whoops, my mistake we got a winner!

[Catfish]

I'm sure Perrriss had less problems with fires if they just raked their floors better, like they do in Finnland ;)
Rake France great again. Maybe Dowly can elaborate..

[Rockstar]

http://ifanboy.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/FlameOnJohnnyStorm.jpg

[Dowly]

I'm sure Perrriss had less problems with fires if they just raked their floors better, like they do in Finnland ;)
Rake France great again. Maybe Dowly can elaborate..
I've no idea what you're talking about.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WirztkuHh_M

[Rockstar]

Macron announced a string of measures intended to assuage protesters’ anger over the rising fuel prices, including a system to adjust taxes depending on the cost of crude oil, and a “national consultation on ecological and social transition”.

Where does that leave ‘Yellow Vest’ protesters?
Angry, that’s where. Macron’s concessions failed to impress the movement’s leaders, who swiftly called for fresh protests on the famous Champs-Élysées Avenue in Paris on Saturday.


“People feel like their opinion doesn’t count, that’s the message that’s being sent,” said Priscilla Ludosky, one of two Yellow Vest representatives who met with Ecology Minister François de Rugy on Tuesday


Is there public support for the protests?
Overwhelming support. According to a poll published by OpinionWay on Wednesday, 66 percent of respondents said they backed the Yellow Vest protests, while 78 percent said Macron’s proposals to help defray the rising cost of fuel were “insufficient”. A survey published last week by opinion research firm Ifop reached similar results, with 66 percent of those questioned stating they had a “favourable view” of the movement. The movement has also taken hold in France’s overseas territories. Life on the tiny Indian Ocean island of Réunion has been nearly paralysed by the protests, which have forced some schools and businesses to close. Overseas Territories Minister Annick Girardin arrived in Réunion on Wednesday, where she met for over an hour with Yellow Vest protesters angry over the high cost of living and widespread unemployment, which has reached 24 percent on the island.

:/\\chop



What the hell is “national consultation on ecological and social transition” ?????

https://www.france24.com/en/20181128-france-government-diesel-tax-yellow-vest-protest-macron-climate-change-philippe

[Onkel Neal]

Yeah, but if we are going to counter global warming/climate change, we have to burn less fossil fuels, and the only way to really slow down consumption is to make it more expensive, with taxes. I don't get it, why are the French opposing saving the planet?

[Rockstar]

Starting in 2014, under Macron's predecessor and erstwhile boss François Hollande, the French government has been ratcheting up fuel duty, saying that this will encourage motorists to adopt greener forms of transport.

Adopt what greener forms of transport? Maybe I was wrong, maybe French President Moron is an idiot.

There are plenty of Parisians who complain incessantly about pollution (I’m one of them). However, in the rural and exurban areas from which the ‘yellow vest’ revolt emerged, vehicle pollution is not exactly at the top of the agenda. Amid this divide between an uncomprehending Parisian elite and left-behind rural workers, it is unsurprising that these protests sprang up without the support or affiliation of any political party.https://capx.co/frances-fuel-protests-expose-macrons-failings/

And just what the hell does “national consultation on ecological and social transition” mean ????? Was there something lost in translation?

[August]

And what about this?


Meanwhile a rise in global oil prices has pushed up the wholesale cost of fuel, causing diesel prices to increase by 25% and petrol prices by 15% over the past year. Seemingly unmoved, the Macron government has...


What rise in global oil prices? I thought it is somewhere down in the $50 per barrel range?

[Buddahaid]

And what about this?



What rise in global oil prices? I thought it is somewhere down in the $50 per barrel range?

Multiple sources.

[Catfish]

I've no idea what you're talking about.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WirztkuHh_M


:rotfl2::rotfl2::rotfl2:

[Catfish]

Yeah, but if we are going to counter global warming/climate change, we have to burn less fossil fuels, and the only way to really slow down consumption is to make it more expensive, with taxes. I don't get it, why are the French opposing saving the planet?


Because they are short-sighted, and put personal gain before anything else? Because they have other immediate problems, of course. If the french people lived in the US there already would have been a revolution.

I know it's meant funny and rhethorical, but..
and i know no one here changes his mind..
still..



If we did not have a kind of society or social form we would still live in tribes and kill each other.
It took a long time to get the insight that working together as a team increases your chances of survival, health, and later comfort and wellbeing for a bigger group of people.
This takes longer than "make stick, kill neighbour, eat his cattle".

What do you think was the reason they invented catalyst converters. Catalyst converters cost money. Also, cars without them were taxed higher if i remember correctly.
Do you think those devices are useless? A fraud?
Who told the people they should, or have to, use it? Do you think the immediate reaction was "Great, i do something against pollution"? No. But why don't you ask them now? I guess their minds might have changed, with better education, and seeing that smoke and dust has been reduced.

Or let me put another question. Do you think that there would be as much progress and invention if mankind was not organised in, at least, nations, if not international communities? If anyone would still fight for himself, or his tribe?
No schools, no society-funded universities?

England has built its whole ecomomy aound and within the EU in the last fourty years. So you suddenly take the whole base away, because – nationalism.

Now you can stop using computers, they were not necessary in the 1960ies, so why do we need them now? What do you think happens?

Has any selfish individual, living alone, hating his neighbour, ever done something to improve the overall situation for a people, or society?

Sometimes it needs some influence from 'above', from people who have a glimpse of what really happens, and are not short-sighted only looking at the next day. Climate change denial will make you live better for a year or maybe to the next election, but not for ten years.

[Skybird]

Paying for your living, flat rent, insurrance and such, comes before saving the planet, Catfish. If you cannot make it over the last week in a month, cannot save for your old days, and state raises fees and taxation and talks about people not making it over the month needing to save the planet or paying for forign people in other countries, than resistance is only the natural thing to expect.


Savingtheplanetarism has turned into a gospel nowadays. Its claims must not so much undergo critical review, but must just be believed for the collective mass happening becoming real. Thats where it has turned now into a surrogate religion. People do not want to believe in mere deities anymore, but it seems to bear life and its uncertainties (or to fight boredom) they nevertheless must believe in something, even if it is just anything. Its like that with food as well. Sugar. Self-optimization regarding health. The latest Apple smartphone and watch. Avoid meat, and save the planet (nonsense). Avid sugar, and dont get diabetes (nonsense). Plaster houses to catch even the tiniest bit of warmth inside, and you save the planet (nonsense). E-mobility is ecologically better than gas-saving cars (so far mega-nonsense). Mediterranean diet is healthier than others and extends life (nonsense). Acrylamide kills you if you eat it, by cancer (nonsense). Saving plastic bags in germany will make a difference for plastic in the oceans (nonsense). Jogging in frequent intervals reduces weight (nonsense). The limits of Diesel dust emissions mean that if you overstep them even a bit, they pose a risk to your health (nonsense). There is so much rubbish out there that people blindly believe because somebody said "Scientists have proven". "A new study shows." "Science has revealed that." Nonsense. Most, very very most of these claims come from dilletantees (including professionals!) that abuse methodology or have not learned or forgotten to master it correctly, and who cannot discriminate competent use of statistics from incompetent or corrupt abuse. All the examples I mentioned, have never been proven so far by anyone, and showed to be unprovable so far. But people stare at magical correlations only, and layman prioritize subjective own feelings and beliefs anyway, and so the nonsense turns into dogma that claims it has been causaly proven that this A does B. Nonsense. Correlation coefficients are the most overrated statistical value beside mean values given without variation, excess and other values putting means into relation, that one can think of.


But when you, yourself, cannot pay your bills anymore and do not know what to do for the money is just not enough, and you cant buy your schoolkids the books they need at school, then maybe your forget about all this superstition yourself, too, and start gettign angry about a government that always talks about investing your money into glorious visions, monumental ideas, and foreign places, and that slowly but surely taxes you into your economic ruin and the ruin of your family.


Yes, global warming happens, its quite obvious. But our ways wanting to command it how far it may go, and us wanting to define its conditions of unfolding, have little to do with adapting to it. Mostly it gets abused for the one people executing power over other people, and trying to massively redistrubute welath collected by the economy of the industrialised world to the places that have not developed. This redistribtuion is what dominates climate confernes of the UN by far. And to justify that, nothign works better than talkignWetserners into a massive gult complex. As a German and thus by nature a Nazi suspect, you should know this mechanism all too well.


You cannot have ecology without a materially well-seated economy, and deindustrializing like the greens want it, hardly is the way to go to supply 8 billion people, growing. The always demonised mass production is what keeps these many people afloat. Give up big industry and mass production and intense farming, and see it all going down the drain. Be ready to burn huge heaps of bodies everywhere.

Noise.


Climate change denial will make you live better for a year or maybe to the next election, but not for ten years.
Hehe, I once were like you, and talked in this way myself, too. More than ten years ago. And that was bck then already ten years and more after the apocalypse described to be coming from the soar rain.


Careful with your timing! Do you still count how often the IPCC have claimed already that it is 5 minutes to 12? Thex repeat this claime very years, since - I forgot since how many years. Many years, for certain. It seems the clock is broken, it does not move on.


Or is it that the jester who found it funny to call "Fire!" to scare people, maybe rang the false alarm one time too often and so nobody cares for him anymore when he once again does it while now it is really burning?:hmmm:

[Catfish]

^ You have to admit there's money in it.

I think the 'greens' have turned their "green philosophy" into a veritable business model :D

If the people buy it... it's economy. Or capitalism, if you so want.
As long as people pay for your product, the price can and will be raised. Self-evident for every company. But when an elected government does it to finance schools and infrastructure, it is "overregulation" or "dictatorship".

A lot of 'greens" have become modern ecofascists, right.
That does not alter facts of a changing climate though.

Did people protest when seat belts became mandatory? Or a second rear view mirror? So expensive. "I can't pay my electricity bill because of that"? Did that stop companies from building and selling it? Or did they make it cheaper? Catalyst converters?
Do we even need so much cars? A 400 hp SUV for every Mom to drive her spoilt brat to the Kindergarten? Why are goods transported via 40-ton-trucks on streets and motorways instead of using the rail system for the heavy stuff? Automobile lobbies anyone?
So much questions.

Apart from that i tend to think that fuel is still much too cheap, if people use it for leaf blowers :O:

[Reece]

catalyst convertersNot that I'm picky but you mean catalytic converter. :yep:

[Catfish]

Not that I'm picky but you mean catalytic converter. :yep:


But you are picky. :stare:





:haha: ok thanks :oops:

[Jimbuna]

What rise in global oil prices? I thought it is somewhere down in the $50 per barrel range?

https://oilprice.com/

[Catfish]

Hehe, I once were like you, and talked in this way myself, too. More than ten years ago. And that was bck then already ten years and more [B]after the apocalypse described to be coming from the soar rain.

Heh where's Reece when you need him. I guess you mean sour, and then again acid? :hmmm:




You know why we do not have acid rain ?
Because of filters and changed conditions of production, forced by government regulation:

"[...] it is that acid rain went away because we curbed our sulfur dioxide emissions. Under the United States Environmental Protection Agency's (USEPA) Acid Rain Program, Title IV of the Clean Air Act, the government established a cap regulating the amount of sulfur we could emit, in an effort to reduce emissions to 10M tons below 1980 levels.

Companies themselves could decide how to manage under those restrictions, either by switching fuels or developing new processes that emitted less sulfur. They also had the option to buy pollution allowances from other companies whose emissions were below the regulated cap. The cap placed on each company was lowered over time.

As the caps were lowered, the allowances became more and more expensive. This created a strong new market and further enticed companies to switch to less polluting processes and energy sources.

This cap and trade program achieved 100% compliance in reducing sulfur dioxide emissions and was enforced in two phases. Phase I began in 1995 and 445 electricity plants reduced emissions by almost 40% below the required cap. Phase II, which began in 2000, had even more stringent policies.

Overall, the companies that have participated in the program have reduced sulfur dioxide emissions 22% below the mandated levels. [...]"

http://mentalfloss.com/article/18940/what-happened-acid-rain

https://www.britannica.com/science/acid-rain/History


So the "prophecies" regarding acid rain did not become reality because we did something against it. This obviously has an effect.

Europe and the EU has had its own regulations to cut emissions.
Of course you can again say if we do it and the Chinese don't, the global effect is not good enough and so on. Ok so let's do nothing and have smog and forests like in Beijing?

[August]

https://oilprice.com/




So in other words I was right.

[Rockstar]

The “yellow vests” have also inspired protests next door in Belgium, where on Friday demonstrators hurled rocks at the prime minister’s office.



https://www.reuters.com/article/us-france-protests/champs-elysees-braces-for-return-of-frances-yellow-vest-protesters-idUSKCN1NZ1WN

[Catfish]

It begins...

[Jimbuna]

So in other words I was right.

The price fluctuates daily similar to the stock market but fundamentally yes, I thought you were right.

[Jimbuna]

Will Macron face down or back down to the protestors?

Mr Macron has presented himself as a president brought to power on the back of a grassroots movement, who could heal the rift between voters and leaders, and rebuild trust in democracy among those who felt disillusioned and detached from politics.

Since then, his campaign - like his leadership - has been criticised for being too rigid, too hierarchical, too arrogant and aloof. Now, with has approval ratings falling steeply, he's faced with a real grassroots movement, what will his response be?

[Dowly]

Will Macron face down or back down to the protestors?

Mr Macron has presented himself as a president brought to power on the back of a grassroots movement, who could heal the rift between voters and leaders, and rebuild trust in democracy among those who felt disillusioned and detached from politics.

Since then, his campaign - like his leadership - has been criticised for being too rigid, too hierarchical, too arrogant and aloof. Now, with has approval ratings falling steeply, he's faced with a real grassroots movement, what will his response be?
Why'd you copy & paste couple of lines from an BBC article (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-46265136) posted over a week ago? :doh:

[Jimbuna]

Never realised I hadn't included the link but you have so ta for that.

[Catfish]

"Since then, his campaign - like his leadership - has been criticised for being too rigid, too hierarchical, too arrogant and aloof. Now, with has approval ratings falling steeply, he's faced with a real grassroots movement, what will his response be?"

Without a name, there would be other "world leaders" that come to mind :D

[u crank]

Without a name, there would be other "world leaders" that come to mind :D

:har:

I'm having a hard time thinking of one who doesn't come to mind.

Gimme a minute......

Nope.:O:

[Onkel Neal]

:har:

[Rockstar]

* Yellow vests converge in Paris to protest high living costs
* Militants hurl projectiles at riot police near Champs-Elysees
* Police fire tear gas, stun grenades, water cannon
* Protesters skirmish with police in other French cities
* Officials feared infiltration by far-left, far-right groups

"We are in a state of insurrection, I've never seen anything like it," said Jeanne d'Hauteserre, the mayor of Paris' 8th district, near the Arc de Triomphe.
http://news.trust.org/item/20181201213945-0zp86

[Skybird]

The violence of latest days seem to be originating not from the yellow jackets, but the so-called "casseurs" (destroyers), a block of anti-social dirtbags and militant chaots that have not much on mind with the movement of yellow jackets, but hides in its middle and from here starts to cause havoc where ever they can. Officials say there are ten thousand of them. That the yellow jackets have not organised themselves, have not formed any leadership", no structures, now takes revenge, it reminds me of the hijacking of Lucke's original AfD by rightwingers that turned the AfD into what it is now.


The naivety behind letting this hjcking happen time and again, is remarkable. The yellow jackets find proper discreditation now, since they get held responsible for the crimes committed by the destroyers.


And who knows, maybe the appearance of the casseurs is not by random chance at all. Discreditting the yellow jackets is in Macronman'sS interest now, he wants to play this tough it seems, and the political - and highly centralised - elitary class of France is far more disconnected from the ordinary people than in most other Western countries. The French secret service is not known for its shyness.



Anyway, the less of Macronman'S visions for the even more socialist redistributional EU get realised, the better for German savers, pensioneers and tax payers alike. So let Paris burn - I take note of it, but thats all.

[Onkel Neal]

Very true, Skybird.

It still astounds me that the police cannot contain the bad elements of these protests.

police spokeswoman Johanna Primevert said, amid concerns violent far-right and far-left groups were infiltrating the "yellow vests" movement.

Yeah, same happens here. People with legitimate concerns want to assemble and suddenly out of the woodwork appears all these thugs in hoodies and masks.

My solution: the police can tackle any and all people they see who are being violent. Then it's up to the courts to serve out some justice. I bet this stuff would stop if thugs were given 5 years in federal prison.

[Jimbuna]

French President Emmanuel Macron is chairing an urgent security meeting, following a day of riots by hundreds of anti-government protesters.

A government spokesperson said a state of emergency could be imposed to tackle the unrest.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-46417991

Or the return of madame guillotine :03:

[Skybird]

My solution: the police can tackle any and all people they see who are being violent. Then it's up to the courts to serve out some justice. I bet this stuff would stop if thugs were given 5 years in federal prison.
I dont know how it is in Franc,e but in Germany the courts are beoynd lockdown point. The mass of request-for-related cases have drowned the German system and many courts areunable to work without many months, sometimes years of delays. Many usual street crimes and lower crimes do not get persecuted even if there is an arrest, the suspects being released, because there is no chance to process them within the various legal time limits the laws demand to be kept. Worse: this is growing, it is growing by trend and intensity, in all 16 federal states. Even in Bavaria, which has the most intact police and the most rigid court system of all in Germany. With the German parliament now havign agreed on the UN migration pact that is just an appetioizer for even more foriengers starting to move here, and that will be not leaving again without resisting to that by all legal - and often also illegal - means, an easing of the pressure the German courts are under is not in sight.

Most arrested people from the streetwar in Hamburg over one year ago - were released meanwhile and/or charges were dropped, since the courts have no chance to deal with them just in time.

In England, I remember I read, they had started to release even serious criminals early from prison, just because to make room in overcrowded prisons. This I read some years ago already.

Should we expect France to be that much different? The system overload is not limited to just one or two nations.

[STEED]

Or the return of madame guillotine :03:

I do not want a load of French Toffs crossing the Channel stinking up the place wih their smelly cheese thank you! :stare:

[Rockstar]

The “yellow vest” rebellion erupted out of nowhere on Nov. 17, with protesters blocking roads across France and impeding access to some shopping malls, fuel depots and airports. Violent groups from the far right and far left as well as youths from the suburbs infiltrated Saturday’s protests, the authorities said.

“We won’t change course. We are certain of that,” he [Macron] told Europe 1 radio.

Some bystanders cheered, others jeered and called on him to resign. So too did Jean-Luc Melenchon, head of hard-left party La France Insoumise (France Unbowed) and far-right leader Marine Le Pen, who both demanded the government unwind its fuel tax hikes. They called for parliament to be dissolved and snap elections held.

“The violence is increasing at an exponential rate,” said Claude, a resident in the affluent 16th district. “The state is losing control, it is scary. They cannot let this happen. Maybe the army should intervene.”

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-france-protests/macron-visits-riot-damaged-arc-de-triomphe-state-of-emergency-mulled-idUSKBN1O1072

[em2nought]

Vive la révolution! :Kaleun_Cheers:

[Catfish]

Because of fuel prices?
Seems that is when people really get mad. Not war, or starving.. fuel! That is where it hurts! The french have it so bad!

Of course i know there are a lot of other reasons and that this was only the spark, but still ..
So Macron wants to raise the age of retirement from 60 to 62 years!?

Outrageous! Chaos!! Leader Marine LePen to the rescue! :doh:



Steed: I do not want a load of French Toffs crossing the Channel stinking up the place wih their smelly cheese thank you! :stare: "Spoken like a true Brit" :haha: :O:

[HunterICX]

Because of fuel prices?
Seems that is when people really get mad. Not war, or starving.. fuel! That is where it hurts! The french have it so bad!

Of course i know there are a lot of other reasons and that this was only the spark, but still ..


Have you ever experienced the dread of barely being able to pay the bills, morgage and other costs of life at the end of each month? When salaries stagnate and barely raise but prices goes up a lot kind of makes one feel being pushed towards the edge especially if all you do is work work work to just survive the end of the month.

As for Fuel being the spark, isn't it obvious? What you need Fuel for? That's right it's to fuel your Cars, Vans and Trucks and what you need those for? Work! So ofcourse it happens to be the last straw since ones transportation is essential to pay the bills.

[Catfish]

Regarding being able to pay bills, i have been there not so long ago. However my first idea in such circumstances is to sell the car, because it is luxury. You can always use the public transportation system.

Which certainly does not apply when you really need a car to earn your money. Especially when you are self-employed, or own a company. However the latter mostly pass the costs on to the customers..

What do you do against unnecessary greed, from products you need for living, to oil prices? Wouldn't it be better to have another (than oil) resource for commuting, and transport :hmmm:
But yes, forcing taxes obviously does not take account of the present social situation. The road to hell is plastered with good intentions..

So yes, you are right.


edit: still, i cannot see another government (left or right) being able to rise the worker's salary at a 35 percent to soothe the masses, as they did in the 1950ies. Both cannot, and the latter will not even want to.

[HunterICX]

Regarding being able to pay bills, i have been there not so long ago. However my first idea in such circumstances is to sell the car, because it is luxury. You can always use the public transportation system.

Which certainly does not apply when you really need a car to earn your money. Especially when you are self-employed, or own a company. However the latter mostly pass the costs on to the customers..

What do you do against unnecessary greed, from products you need for living, to oil prices? Wouldn't it be better to have another (than oil) resource for commuting, and transport :hmmm:
But yes, forcing taxes obviously does not take account of the present social situation. The road to hell is plastered with good intentions..

So yes, you are right.

But what is the better alternative source for commuting and transport on the road? I don't believe battery powered cars are the 'clean' answer, sure they don't spoil the air but what about the impact producing and disposing these batteries are having on the enviroment? If more and more move to battery powered cars it'll have a big impact on nature mining the resources needed, we'll polute the enviroment producing the batteries and some god forsaken third world country will have to deal with our waste on their soil poluting the groundwater that they need to wash and drink.

edit: still, i cannot see another government (left or right) being able to rise the worker's salary at a 35 percent to soothe the masses, as they did in the 1950ies. Both cannot, and the latter will not even want to.

Nope but salaries should go up to compensate for the inflation and increase in taxes or just inflation if they reduced the tax burden.

[em2nought]

Because of fuel prices?



I don't think the Poilu are big tea drinkers so why not? :03:

[Catfish]

^ :D

[...]salaries should go up to compensate for the inflation and increase in taxes or just inflation if they reduced the tax burden.

Right, however raising loans will directly put pressure on business and companies, and you know how well such "socialist" ideas are received :)
B.t.w. the increasing of prices/adjusting of loans which lead to inflation is the real driver why any currency must fail at some point.


OT regarding Paris:
Regarding electric cars.. i am not a fan of that either, at least not now.

(I had a car with an engine using 'canola' (rape seed oil) instead of Diesel. The car was from 1986, weighed around 1,2 tons, did a hundred mph and was able to go 78,4 miles per gallon. Nowadays you have cars with a similar usability transport-wise, but needing a lot more fuel. They are more heavy, have ABS, airbag and all that of course. The engine and mpg seem not to matter anymore, they all have at least a hundred hp. Is that really needed to get one person to work. We see those 400 hp SUV monsters with a woman driving her kid to the Kindergarten. I think this is ridiculous.)

It is not only the batteries, which pollute the environment during production, and 'recycling'. It is the whole process of its life cycle, along with heavy line loss from plant to charging, and the charging itself also uses loses a lot of energy. Not to forget the energy has to be produced somewhere.. nuclear? Coal?

Looking at overall energy bilancing the electric car cannot compete with small individual combustion engines yet. Not at the technological level we are now. As you said, the foreign pollution regarding rare earths and waste sent back also have to be taken into account.

[Rockstar]

Macron says the fuel tax increases are part of his effort to combat climate change, wanting to persuade French drivers to exchange diesel-fuelled cars for less polluting models.

He said on Saturday he would not deviate from his policy goals.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-france-protests/frances-macron-hunts-for-way-out-of-yellow-vest-crisis-idUSKBN1O20UZ

So I'm wondering what less polluting models does President Moron have in mind? I'm sure the rich guy who wants the army to quell the riot can buy one. But Im wondering where can those most affected by these tax hikes i.e the vast majority of citizens buy them? Where's the dealership that stocks them? Whats the make and model of these 'less polluting' models people are supposed to go out and buy? Oh wait Im sorry not buy, but 'exchange' for their more polluting cars?

[Jimbuna]

I was a little shocked when I read of the possiblr rise in retirement age from 60 to 62.

Here in the UK it has risen from 60 for females and 65 for males to a joint 66 and future rises are being planned.

[August]

You can always use the public transportation system.


Spoken like a true city dweller as if that's an option for everyone.

[Reece]

66.5 for my wife here in Australia and higher for the younger generation.:doh:

[August]

Over here it's age 62 for a reduced amount (in my case about 1500 per month). I get another 5-600 per month or so on top of that if I wait until 66 and 5/6ths (10mo) and another 5-600 per month if I wait until 70.

Of course if I wait until 66 then it'll take me until i'm about 85 before I break even with the amount I lost between 62 and 66.

[mapuc]

(some off topic info about retirement in Denmark)
Same here in Denmark.

The younger a Danish person is thou longer he or she to wait before they can retire from they job.

If a Danish person is born before 1st Jan. -54, they can retire when they are 65 years old.

If a Danish person is born after 1 Jan. -67, they can retire when they are 69 years old.

I can retire when I'm 68 years old.

Markus
(End of some off topic.)

[Jimbuna]

Over here it's age 62 for a reduced amount (in my case about 1500 per month). I get another 5-600 per month or so on top of that if I wait until 66 and 5/6ths (10mo) and another 5-600 per month if I wait until 70.

Of course if I wait until 66 then it'll take me until i'm about 85 before I break even with the amount I lost between 62 and 66.

That's the thing isn't it?

There's always a catch or gamble involved.

[Catfish]

^ So, compared to other countries the french are not so much worse off when it comes to the age of retirement?
Still, there are a lot living below poverty level :hmmm:

[Jimbuna]

There can't be many EU members or those in the developed world for that matter whose citizens are paid less than UK pensioners.

[em2nought]

Macron should place a green tax on wine. :har: Vive la révolution!
http://thefederalist.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Boston-Tea-Party-16.jpg

[Buddahaid]

I could retire now at 62 but I don't want to retire. I like my work and am at the top of my earning curve so I'll keep working as long as I can and they let me. I think I'm afraid of turning old if I have no compelling reason to get up.

[Rockstar]

The Latest on mass protests in France

French President Emmanuel Macron has scrapped a fuel tax rise amid fears of new violence, after weeks of nationwide protests and the worst rioting in Paris in decades.
An official with the Elysee palace told The Associated Press on Wednesday that the president decided to get rid of the tax.
Philippe told lawmakers that "the tax is now abandoned" in the 2019 budget, and the government is "ready for dialogue." The budget can be adjusted or renegotiated through the course of the year.
Three weeks of protests have left four people dead and were a massive challenge to Macron.

One of the activists leading France's protest movement says that he fears more deaths if Saturday's demonstration goes ahead, and called for President Emmanuel Macron to speak out and bring calm.
Christophe Chalencon said that "if not there will be chaos," with risks of more deaths.
Chalencon said in an interview Wednesday with The Associated Press that the grassroots movement, triggered by fuel tax hikes, has grown amid Macron's silence.
Four people have died since protests began in November. Violent rampaging last Saturday devastated the French capital.
Chalencon, a 52-year-old blacksmith, said the public needed Macron to "admit he made a mistake, with simple words ... that touch the guts and heart of the French."
He said the prime minister's announcement Tuesday of a freeze on tax hikes "had no resonance."


The concessions made by France's prime minister in a bid to stop the huge and violent anti-government demonstrations that have been rocking France over the past three weeks, seem to have so far failed to convince protesters, with trade unions and farmers now threatening to join the fray.
A day after Edouard Philippe announced a suspension of planned fuel tax hikes that kicked off protests, the "yellow vest" protest movement showed no sign of slowing down on Wednesday. Students opposed to a university application system remained mobilized, trucking unions called for a rolling strike and France's largest farm union threatened to launch protests next week.
A joint statement from the CGT and FO trucking unions protesting a cut to overtime rates called for action from Sunday night.


https://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/latest-leading-protest-activist-macron-speak-59624047


I can smell the decorum just oozing from President Moron

[Rockstar]

https://www.france24.com/en/20181206-french-student-protests-intensify-alongside-yellow-vest-revolt

French student protests intensify alongside 'yellow vest' revolt.

Around 200 French high schools were blocked or disrupted Thursday by students protesting a raft of education overhauls, on a fourth day of action called to coincide with anti-government demonstrations which have rocked the country in recent weeks.
Dozens of people wearing face masks threw Molotov cocktails, torched trash bins and clashed with police in several cities during violent protests ahead of a call for nationwide demonstrations on Friday.
"The situations are quite varied, with total or partial blockages, barricades to control access, burning pallets," an education ministry official told AFP.

Although the students are demanding an end to testing overhauls and stricter university entrance requirements[:rotfl2:] , they have seized on the momentum of the ongoing "yellow vest" protests against President Emmanuel Macron. "We're the ones who are going to eventually have to pay higher fuel prices," said Ines, one of around 150 high school students demonstrating in the southern Paris suburb of Cachan.

[Jimbuna]

Looks like others are starting to jump on the bandwagon.

[Rockstar]

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-france-protests-security/france-to-deploy-89000-security-personnel-ahead-of-saturday-protests-idUSKBN1O52BS

French president Moron to deploy 89,000 troops and armored vehicles to quell riots.

GO GREEN!

[Onkel Neal]

Looks like the government backed down. Too bad for the planet.

[mapuc]

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-france-protests-security/france-to-deploy-89000-security-personnel-ahead-of-saturday-protests-idUSKBN1O52BS

French president Moron to deploy 89,000 troops and armored vehicles to quell riots.

GO GREEN!

I have no problems letting my imagination running wild.

I was thinking on the civil war in Syria and how it started.

If I remember it correctly some part of the Syrian army changed side.

Of course this is not going to happen.

Back to real life politic discussion.

Markus

[em2nought]

If I remember it correctly some part of the Syrian army changed side.

Markus


These aren't antifa punks, these are citizens singing "La Marseillaise" so you never know.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEJHJ_WfNgU


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SnPCm8KO_rg

[Rockstar]

https://apnews.com/3b7d4a322df34823b448dabd46e2e03a


As anti-government protests rage through France and Paris locks down, fearing new riots, the man whose presidency has unleashed the anger is nowhere to be seen. French President Emmanuel Macron has stayed out of the public eye all week, leaving his unpopular government to try to calm the nation. In response, “Macron, resign!” has become the main slogan of the “yellow vest” demonstrators.
The protesters’ anger has been directed at the French leader, who they feel has been the “president of the rich” and is out-of-touch with ordinary people.

[ikalugin]

I wonder if we can make paralels with the Maidan.

[Jimbuna]

Donald Trump blames the Paris climate agreement for the violence in the French capital.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-paris-protests-riots-twitter-environment-france-macron-gilets-jaunes-a8673771.html

[Skybird]

I wonder if we can make paralels with the Maidan.
No, we cannot.


Political situations in Ukraine back then (and today) and France are very different. Lets not start another relativisation round.


If the Maidan compare to anything, then the protests in Gezhi park, Turkey, in both cases against mafia-like, criminal oligarchic gangster clans running the state. That has another quality than the corruption and centralist elitism in France.

[Rockstar]

A banker only looks at the numbers and never sees the people.




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J78SdCzzumA

[Mr Quatro]

https://apnews.com/3b7d4a322df34823b448dabd46e2e03a

The protesters’ anger has been directed at the French leader, who they feel has been the “president of the rich” and is out-of-touch with ordinary people.

I believe you, but you will not see this reasoning on CNN or the other news channels :o

[em2nought]

Apparently Macron used those 89,000 to surround the presidential palace and protect him from the French citizenry. :03:


https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/ct-france-paris-riots-macron-20181208-story.html

[Rockstar]

Apparently Macron used those 89,000 to surround the presidential palace and protect him from the French citizenry. :03:


https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/ct-france-paris-riots-macron-20181208-story.html




That's not presidential decorum you're smelling. :har: :/\\chop

[em2nought]

Apparently it's just fine for a left leaning government to use any number of weapons against their own citizenry, but a right leaning government launches a little tear gas against foreign invaders and the fake mainstream media goes berserk. :hmmm:


The French police are firing rubber bullets at taxpayers. Nothing to see here. :03:

[Jimbuna]

French Prime Minister Édouard Philippe has vowed to "restore national unity" after violence broke out during a fourth consecutive weekend of protests.

Police used tear gas and rubber bullets on Saturday - the latest day of "yellow vest" demonstrations against fuel tax rises and high living costs.

More than 1,700 people were arrested, but the violence was not on the same level as a week earlier.

Discussions with peaceful protesters "must continue", Mr Philippe said.

He added: "No tax should jeopardise our national unity. We must now rebuild that national unity through dialogue, through work, and by coming together."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-46496854

This will undoubtedly need a lot of thought and planning.

[Skybird]

Manfred Haferburg is a German writer living in France, in Paris. This his text is some of the best evaluation and assessment of the events and their reasons I have read about the Paris riots so far. My and Google'S translation (why is it that Google translator's quality is varying so tremendously on a daily basis? Sometimes it works phantastic, sometimes every second sentence is utter drivel):

:

What is driving the French in their yellow safety vests on the road? The policy of the Macron government has deeply disappointed the French. Reforms, yes, but they must make sense. The life concept of many middle-class families is in danger of tipping over. Families with several children are the norm in France. They can not afford the b y German standards horrendous rents in the center and have evaded into the still expensive suburbs. They are just making ends meet. For a house on credit, it is accepted to take twice daily a one-hour drive to work. A Diesel ma yhave been bought with a clear conscience, which was cheaper in consumption and should pollute the environment less with CO2 - that'S how the elites sounded a few years ago. Thus, 70 percent of cars today are Diesel and older than eight years.

Then came the zero interest rate policy and with it the creeping inflation that nibbles ever-increasing holes into the wallets of families. The Diesel is suddenly out and the fuel gets more and more expensive. Even today, a liter on the toll highway costs two euros. And the highly acclaimed Diesel was declared an environmental pest by the same people who had recommended it five years ago without any sense of guilt.

Then Macron got elected to prevent Le Pen. Strategic voting never pays off for voters. Because with Macron came many green and even more left-wing ideas. Macron and his colleagues want to solve problems that nobody has. Macron wants to solve them with the money that the little people do not have. Therefore the road called to the elite: "You speak of the end of the world, but we speak of the end of the month".

Macron "announced" to introduce more eco-taxes. He wants to make electricity and fuel more expensive. He wants to shut down well-functioning power plants and set up wind turbines everywhere. For the French wind turbines are ugly monsters, which they can not stand in their beautiful landscapes. And anyway - why? France is in eighth place in Europe in terms of achieving CO2 targets, while Germany, far behind, ranks number 24. This is due to nuclear energy, which Macron reduces without meaning and without understanding, but does not want to abolish. It is difficult for a Frenchman to interpret a meaning in this.

The lower middle class in France no longer knows how to claim their modest standard of living or where the school fees should come from. The year of preparation for one of the most important elite universities costs significantly more than 10,000 euros for a high school graduate. And of course the children should be allowed to study - all three. Macron has not understood that he has attacked the French families of his performers directly with his policy. He does not understand because he has no money worries - his wife comes from the French money aristocracy with a thick Swiss account. Macron has no children and thus no idea of ​​the living reality of its taxpayers.

In the past three weeks, Macron has made another gigantic mistake. For two weeks he kept quiet about the demands of the citizens, then arrogantly ignored them and even made fun of them in the end. He mockingly said, "We solve the problems of the end of the month and the end of the world."

While Macron flourished with his green ambitions at the Buenos Aires summit last weekend in front of his G20 politician colleagues, the hut burned in Paris. The casseurs had mixed with the demonstrators and caused great damage, even disgraced national symbols. And now, after the orgy of violence, the government began to turn it down. However, cacophon: On Tuesday: tax increases suspended for three months, one day later for six months and then postponed for another year. Thus, the last Frenchman recognized that the government has set a signal with their response AFTER the violence: In order to make oneself heard, the citizens' protest needs violence. Ultimately, the Macron government finally legitimized the Casseurs. This is not just my view, as has been said several times on French television.

A disturbing experience I had today in the rue Courcelles, about two kilometers away from the demo focus Etoile. A group of marauding North Africans from the banlieues roamed the streets and demolished bus stops and cars, leaving mirrors and slicing disks. When they tried to knock down a smart, the car owner cursed them from a safe distance from his balcony. A few Gilets Jaunes wanted to stand in their way and shouted, "Gilet's jaunts do not do that." They were instantly attacked by the rioters with kicks and punches and were able to flee like that. I realized that without police protection ordinary citizens have little power to counter violent criminals. The ceiling of our civilization is too thin, and violence has been trained out of us.

The law enforcement officers this weekend were completely different than last Saturday. There were officially 8,000 demonstrators and 9,500 police and gendarmerie in Paris today. One must know that the gendarmerie is an army unit. The gendarmes were equipped with armored vehicles. There were also mounted squadrons in use; Riders are very effective, the rioters fled in bright panic in front of the horses. The action of the CRS forces was much more offensive today than it has been in recent weeks. Spacious, sensitive areas were closed off. Flickering skirmishes were stifled by rapid advance in the bud, the fire brigade was able to quickly extinguish things set under fire under police protection. There were over 1,000 arrests and several hundred arrests. Thirty people were injured. All in all, it was a lot more peaceful this Saturday than last week.

On the Champs-Elysées, protesters and police were standing opposite each other again, peacefully and conversing at the shortest distance. There was even flirting violently. Both sides have great sympathy for each other. The Gilets Jaunes, because the police protects them from the rioters and the police, because the protesters also represent their concerns. A police union has already joined the movement. Likewise pupils and students as well as the farmers. The government is in a dilemma. The demonstrators want "Macron should resign". The police want to categorically suppress any further riot.

Should it succeed that the demonstrations peacefully continue to grow, it becomes very uncomfortable for the remote French established and their unworldly projects. The credibility of Macron's government is gone, he has been recognized for what he is - a handsome Blender. Then maybe it really will soon be called "Macron Demission".

.

Macronman lost his cape, cant fly anymore. I saw him as a reality-disconnected, clueless blender from all beginning on, nothing but high flying megalomania on his mind. Thats why I always mocked on him.


You do not stumble over mountains, but over tiny stones only.

[Rockstar]

He's a banker, and he appears to be very good at being one too. However as a banker he is more interested in numbers than people. I sure in his eyes the spreadsheet was perfect.

[Skybird]

He's a banker, and he appears to be very good at being one too. However as a banker he is more interested in numbers than people. I sure in his eyes the spreadsheet was perfect.
A banker? Nonsens. He is a nuclear physicist, worked in Greifswald nuclear powerplant, was GDR citizen and was moved onto the black list of the SED regime when refusing to join the SED or to work for the Stasi. He later was violently kicked out of the GDR and was deprived of his GDR citizenship. He wrote several books, amongst them "Staatsversagen".

[Skybird]

Oh. It appears I assumed you meant Haferburg. :D

Macronman'S fault is not that he may have been a good banker who knew his numbers. Knowing the numbers, knowing that stuff costs and that nothing is for free, is essential. His mistake was that he assumed his living conditions were representative, and so he took them as granted for everbody, assumed that everybody can afford the drastic changes he wants since himself he would not feel them much. And so he became quite disconnected from material realities of life on the everyday ground. See his European ambitions as well: mostly, they go not so much to the costs of France, who indeed would benefit, but at the costs of Germany: again he talks loud and glorious about spending other people's money.

He has that in common with Marx, who also talked a lot about money - while he wa smostly free from needing to care for his living, but was held out by others. So are amyn socialist and career potlicians, who know they have made the system such that their payments and privilieges are and get protected and that they can eyxlcude themselves form the consequences their super-smart masterminding for society create.

The French political elite is very elitist indeed and very disconnected from reality, much more than in most other Western countries. This is owed to the strong centralisation of power and administration in France throughout history. Monopolization leads to centralization, centralization leads to elitism.


Compared to the obedient and submissive Germans, the French are also quite militant and eager toi strike. I diod not expct this whole thing to last this long and grow this strong. Maybe I should, at least could have expected it, but I was surprised while standing on the wrong foot, like many others.

[Rockstar]

Oh. It appears I assumed you meant Haferburg. :D




it appears so. :yep::D

[Rockstar]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-12-08/police-arrest-317-in-paris-ahead-of-new-yellow-vests-protests



“You can’t make speeches about defending the international order when your popularity is at 20 percent and there are protesters in the street,” said Nicholas Dungan, a Paris-based senior fellow at the Atlantic Council. “It’s very difficult to get your credibility back.”
It’s a stark contrast to the weekend of Nov. 11 as leaders marked a century since the end of World War I. Macron championed the need for global cooperation while Trump cut an isolated figure. Europe’s divisions were laid bare that day as Polish government officials marched through Warsaw with far-right groups to mark the country’s Independence Day. Macron, though, stood firm as Europe’s statesman.
The images televised around the world last weekend were of burning cars in the French capital. The retreat by the 40-year-old French leader was mocked by Trump. Macron admitted, via his prime minister, that he’s not been able to connect with the French people. “No tax merits putting our nation’s unity in danger,” Edouard Philippe said in a televised address. Ya think?

Especially when that tax is imposed to persuade someone to 'exchange' a tangible item for something which doesn't exist.

[Rockstar]

https://www.france24.com/en/20181211-france-dead-injured-strasbourg-police-christmas-market-shooting

Live: Strasbourg shooting suspect 'has been convicted 27 times', says Paris Prosecutor

At least two people were killed and 14 injured in a shooting at a Christmas market in central Strasbourg, France, on Tuesday, police and officials said, adding that the suspected gunman has a criminal record and is on the run.


Two were killed and 14 injured in the shooting in central Strasbourg, according to the French interior ministry.
The gunman, who has been named at the moment as 'Cherif C', was intercepted by security forces twice with exchanges of fire, but remains at large. The Paris Prosecutor has said that the suspect has been convicted 27 times in France, Germany and Switzerland.
France has increased its terror alert level and will send extra security forces to Strasbourg as well as increase security at borders and Christmas markets.
The shooting started near Place Kléber and advanced toward the Grand'Rue, one of the city's main shopping streets, said FRANCE 24's Catherine Bennett reporting from Strasbourg.
Several areas went into lockdown with members of the public taking shelter inside bars and restaurants.
The European parliament, which was holding its plenary session before the winter holidays, also went on lockdown, with MEPs told to stay inside.

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2017/04/23/22/3F8A406300000578-4437156-image-a-61_1492981446794.jpg

[Rockstar]

https://www.france24.com/en/20181211-yellow-vest-protesters-react-macron-concessions-address-france-crumbs



‘All smoke and mirrors’: Yellow Vest protesters reject 'crumbs' offered by Macron

I got a kick out of this comment. So typical of governments where their answer lies in someone else's money.

In a plea that was widely mocked as wishful thinking, he asked profit-making businesses to grant workers year-end bonuses, adding that they would be tax-free“president of the rich”.
https://cdn.images.express.co.uk/img/dynamic/78/590x/Emmanuel-Macron-Vladimir-Putin-meeting-810601.jpg