Amelia Earhart mystery

[STEED]

Amelia Earhart: Does a blurry photo prove she died a Japanese prisoner?

A newly discovered photo suggests legendary US pilot Amelia Earhart might have died in Japanese custody - and not in a plane crash in the Pacific.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-40515754

Not sure. :hmmm:

[Jimbuna]

I doubt we'll ever find out 100% but my thinking is she died shortly after the crash (wherever that was) or died a castaway.

Despite the missing Japanese records I'd have thought somebody would have spoken in all this time.

[vienna]

The whole Earhart being captured by the Japanese theory has a few too many holes to be entirely plausible. It is known the US and, possibly, other Allied nations, were actively monitoring Japanese communications before and during the war. It seems highly unlikely Japanese troops would stumble upon and seize Earhart and not at least report the seizure to higher command and the report subsequently be intercepted by the US. If so, there would be a record of the intercept and it appears there is not; likewise, the Japanese were rather scrupulous about record keeping and even if a capture report were not intercepted, at lest some record would likely have been found by the US as they examined captured documents. It would be understandable neither the Japanese, who might have feared disclosing too much about their prewar activities or possibly inciting anti-Japanese feelings in the US, would want to make public the capture of Earhart nor would the US as it might tip their being able to intercept and decode Japanese communications. But it seems unlikely, after the war, for the US to continue to cover up a possible Earhart capture since there seems to be no real logical reason to do so. The whole theory just leads to too many unanswered questions...




<O>

[Aktungbby]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3153107/I-know-saw-saw-lady-Revealed-Pacific-islanders-insist-Amelia-Earhart-taken-prisoner-Japanese-crashing-remote-atoll.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3153107/I-know-saw-saw-lady-Revealed-Pacific-islanders-insist-Amelia-Earhart-taken-prisoner-Japanese-crashing-remote-atoll.html) Bilimon Amram http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/07/09/00/2A53822400000578-3153107-image-a-46_1436399662403.jpg went to his grave insisting he not only saw Earhart and Noonan on the Koshu Maru, but also spoke to the navigator about the leg he broke when the plane crashed.
'Amram said the woman had short hair and long boots. He and the doctor didn't talk to her - they just treated the guy, had a conversation about his leg, and then they left.
'As they were leaving, he said he saw on the far side of the ship that there was a plane hanging there, with one wing broken.
'That was as much as they saw - that was what he told me and he had no reason to tell me that and I had no reason not to believe him.'
Domnick said that when he asked Amram if he was sure about what he had witnessed, his friend said forcefully: '"Hey guy" - that's what he always called me - "I know what I saw and I saw the lady!' Domnick recalled.
'"She was definitely American, not Japanese, and I did help fix Noonan's leg".' Even though Dr. Amram had 'impeccable credentials', people lie, forget, or obfuscate details... but palm trees do not: ...islanders have claimed that the damaged aircraft was hauled across the island from the ocean side to the lagoon side on rail car wheels similar to those used by Japanese troops to move bombs. Rusty remains of those trollies are still to be seen on the island. Kramer's son Daniel, who joined a team of 11 researchers on an expedition to Mili atoll last January, pointed the team towards an area where the shorter trees indicated their relative youth compared to taller, older trees.
the find seems to support the theory that the aircraft was towed across the islands on the trolley by some 40 Marshallese villages, with trees having been cut down to make way for the rails. As with native accounts of Little Big Horn they are truthful...and don't get into a jam with short hair and long boots!:O: There are simply too many uninvolved no-ax-to-grind witnesses from Mili to Saipan that are consistent: Identity: Locals reported that the woman was American and had 'short hair' and long boots... After decades of the 80 year old 'party line' the truth-worm is perhaps beginning to turn: ...said the Japanese would have "lost face" if it emerged that Ms Earhart had landed on the Japanese-controlled island of Mili without their knowledge and would also have assumed that she was a spy. The US, he added, was fully aware that Ms Earhart had been captured because it had broken Japan's military and diplomatic codes. To request the fliers' freedom would have tipped the Japanese off, the theory goes, so the US "decided Earhart would become expendable", http://www.nevadaappeal.com/news/local/cousin-japanese-captured-amelia-earhart/ (http://www.nevadaappeal.com/news/local/cousin-japanese-captured-amelia-earhart/)

[Mr Quatro]

All I saw was the ABC news reporting this and showing a picture that sure looked like her sitting on the edge of the dock.

I believe Aktungbby's rare find too, but then I still believe in the tooth fairy and the Easter Bunny. :)

Good research there Aktung. :yep:

[Gargamel]

This is no more than another Al Capone's Vault (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mystery_of_Al_Capone%27s_Vaults). Just clever marketing and promotion to garner interest in a show.

[propbeanie]

Whatever they're doing, they circled a native standing behind something, like a small flag marker or similar, instead of the white man under the broad-brimmed hat, in that "evidentiary" photo...

[Sean C]

Here are some reasons (http://fer3.com/arc/m2.aspx/Another-round-fate-Amelia-Earhart-todays-news-LaPook-jul-2017-g39425) that the people in the photo are likely not Earhart and Noonan. The man who posted these is well versed in aerial navigation (possibly a former navigator himself, I can't remember) and has studied the case extensively. He has been a vocal opponent of TIGHAR's theories over the years.

Here is a video (https://vimeo.com/channels/549186/75427331) of a presentation he gave to some WWII aviators on the subject.

[STEED]

I think it will remain a mystery for all time, i agree with above posts that the Japanese capture her extremely unlikely and if they did as pointed out there is no record which makes that one a very weak case.

[Aktungbby]

THe official BS: https://earharttruth.wordpress.com/tag/howland-island/ (https://earharttruth.wordpress.com/tag/howland-island/) The probable truth-with grains of 80 year old salt: The essential outlines of the truth—as opposed to the myth—concerning what happened to Earhart, Noonan, and their twin-engine Lockheed Electra are by now well established through the testimony of a large number of witnesses. The airplane went down on an island in the Japanese-controlled Marshall Islands to the north of Howland Island. Earhart and Noonan were taken prisoner by the Japanese and treated as spies. From there they were transferred to the Japanese headquarters for the region, the island of Saipan, for incarceration and interrogation, with a likely intermediate stop at Kwajalein Atoll. https://earharttruth.wordpress.com/tag/saipan-witnesses/ (https://earharttruth.wordpress.com/tag/saipan-witnesses/) The marines dig up two caucasian bodies on Saipan; the word from the top:https://earharttruth.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/graves-b-erskine.jpg?w=303&h=379 (https://earharttruth.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/graves-b-erskine.jpg) < Marine Gen. Graves B. Erskine, deputy commander of the V Amphibious Corps at the Battle of Saipan. In late 1966, Erskine told Jules Dundes, CBS West Coast vice president, and Dave McElhatton, a KCBS radio newsman, “It was established that Earhart was on Saipan. You’ll have to dig the rest out for yourselves.” The Rest: https://tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/Archives/Research/ResearchPapers/AEinMarianas.html (https://tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/Archives/Research/ResearchPapers/AEinMarianas.html) In summary, the evidence for Earhart and/or Noonan dying and/or being buried in the Marianas consists of a number of eyewitness and secondhand accounts, together with a piece of cloth interpreted as a blindfold and two collections of human bones. The accounts variously have the woman identified as Earhart dying of dysentery and/or being executed by firing squad, while the man identified as Noonan is executed either by firing squad or beheading. Too many non-corroborative independent witnesses from Mili Atoll to Saipan incl. a US Lt nurse, Mary Adams https://earharttruth.files.wordpress.com/2015/06/mary-patterson-1.jpg?w=620 (https://earharttruth.files.wordpress.com/2015/06/mary-patterson-1.jpg) https://earharttruth.wordpress.com/tag/mary-adams-patterson/ (https://earharttruth.wordpress.com/tag/mary-adams-patterson/) corroborate her arrival and demise on Saipan. Whether by beheading, firing squad or dysentery: she was at Saipan. To marines, Burks and Henson . who allegedly dug up remains are of interest under the watchful eye of an intelligence officer :Griswold, who later denied being part of this grave digging episode, yet his language clearly suggests otherwise. He kept repeating, “I’m not denying what you are saying but I have to go on record that I can’t recall.”....Why not a simple grave-registration officer; and who makes good marines dig in a 1944 civilian cemetery in the middle of Pacific War anyhow??!!? And, in all of the accounts, why do the bones and the Electra keep disappearing:hmmm: Bear in mind on this routine 'round-the-world trip, coverage was provided from the top-FDR himself: From midpoint stationed USS Ontario and cutter USS Itaska: President Franklin Delano Roosevelt, who had made the arrangements for U.S. Government cooperation with the flight, immediately ordered the American battleship USS Colorado which was on a summer reserve training cruise near the Hawaiian Islands to proceed at top speed to the Howland Island area to assist with the search. Colorado carried three catapult observation planes that could cover wide areas of ocean. That's a lot of government $hekel$ for a simply civilian flight project imho.:hmmm:

[ValoWay]

nope, you're all wrong..

http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Amelia_Earhart

[Rhodes]

nope, you're all wrong..

http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Amelia_Earhart
Eehhehehe
http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/ff/ff39d9865b975e50204556b5a4f31a6015bb93968d2fb3391a e2a83bcc25c26d.jpg

Well, if the body died of dysentery, I do not know what kind of evidence could be on the bones, to fast for that. Firing squad and beheading, will leave bones evidence. So, one just have to see how are the skeletons.

[Mr Quatro]

This one is the more believable one: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/07/10/forensic-dogs-scent-human-remains-pacific-island-earhart-may/

10 JULY 2017 • 9:32AM
Four dogs trained to detect the scent of human bones have located a site on a remote Pacific atoll where Amelia Earhart and her navigator, Fred Noonan, may have died on their ill-fated attempt to circumnavigate the globe in 1937.

The four border collies were taken to Nikumaroro, part of the Republic of Kiribati, as part of the latest expedition to the atoll by The International Group for Historic Aircraft Recovery (TIGHAR) and the National Geographic Society.

TIGHAR believes Ms Earhart managed to land on Nikumaroro - which was at the time an uninhabited British territory known as Gardner Island - but soon succumbed to hunger, thirst or illness.


Amelia Earhart and her navigator, Fred Noonan, vanished on their ill-fated attempt to circumnavigate the globe in 1937.
Amelia Earhart and her navigator, Fred Noonan, vanished on their ill-fated attempt to circumnavigate the globe in 1937.
The Delaware-based organisation has carried out numerous visits to the island and discovered some compelling indications that Ms Earhart's Lockheed Electra landed there after being unable to find Howland Island, its intended target.

That evidence included aluminium skin from an aircraft, plexiglass from a cockpit, a zip made in Pennsylvania in the mid-1930s, a broken pocket knife of the same brand that was listed in an inventory of Ms Earhart's aircraft and the remains of a 1930s woman's compact.

[mapuc]

Years back I found this story very fascinating. First I read about her adventure and what could have happened to her in some Swedish books. later I read about it in some Danish books and their had two different point-of-view of what have happened to her and her navigator.

So I just left it there, with the knowledge that we may never know what exactly happened.

Markus

[Aktungbby]

http://www.dcdave.com/article5/Earhartstamp.jpg

[Rhodes]

Always thought they were abducted and in 24th century found by Voyager!
http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/memoryalpha/images/1/18/Earhart_and_Janeway.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20070611050450&path-prefix=en

[Platapus]

Lets look at some of the factors in this final flight

1. It could be said that she was not that skilled a pilot, more of a publicity grandstander (thanks to Putnam). Most of her recognition was because of her sex and not her pilot skills. Most of her records were doing something for the first time, not necessarily doing them the best. During her career she never won any competition where she was competing against other pilots.
2. She had limited experience with multi-stop trans ocean piloting, especially over the distances involved in the Pacific
3. She had limited experience with this particular aircraft
4. The aircraft was ill-suited for this type of trip
5. In order to make the fuel stretch, important survival and commo gear was removed.
6. The aircraft was highly modified and the modifications were untested. The added fuel tanks drastically altered the flight characteristics and she did not have enough time to fully test this.
7. She was unfamiliar with the radio navigation system which was brand new to the aircraft. Noonan, an experienced navigator, reported earlier in the flight deviations using this new equipment. Not good when you are trying to find a sliver of an airstrip in the middle of an ocean. This radio direction finding equipment was damaged in Darwin and repaired.
8. The RDF equipment on the Itasca could not tune into the frequency she was using so there was no back up radio navigation capability.
9. The aircraft, after being involved in a ground accident during the first attempt, was repaired quickly and there were no test flights to determine how the accident/repairs may have affected the modified aircraft.
10. Itasca was onsite and started the search north of Howland island where the signing was estimated as being. All told there was one battle ship, one aircraft carrier, and two Japanese ships involved in the search. After that, there was a privately funded search of the surrounding islands. All with no evidence of any aircraft nor personnel found.

Given all this, it seems most likely that her aircraft simply ran out of gas and crashed into the ocean.

As United States Navy Captain Laurance Safford wrote after his research of the accident, it was a result of "poor planning and worse execution".

[Mr Quatro]

Fool me once, fool me twice ... somewhere a long the line it's going to be my fault :yep:

Last week, the History cable channel revealed a photograph said to possibly show the vanished aviator Amelia Earhart on a dock in the Marshall Islands after she disappeared, possibly clearing up one of the 20th century’s greatest mysteries. On Tuesday, however, a Japanese blogger wrote that the photo was taken two years before she went missing and isn't Earhart.

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/questions-raised-over-unearthed-amelia-earhart-photo-n782016

[Aktungbby]

https://media4.s-nbcnews.com/j/newscms/2017_27/2061371/170705-amelia-earhart-marshall-islands-1937-njs-921a_dc54c36fc9e07144008eb24d4b245ccf.nbcnews-ux-2880-1000.jpg Vs: https://media3.s-nbcnews.com/j/newscms/2017_28/2069436/170711-earhart-question-v2-ac-1028p_40a4301cf0dcaa5990fc7331b101d4eb.nbcnews-ux-2880-1000.jpg < the Japanese version which 'crops' some of the aircraft which is 38' feet-the length of an Lockheed Electra-38' 7"....now on a barge! The two pictures are both very iffy: is that even a female seated on the pier? And who dares take photos if the Japanese are into secrecy and terror of Chammoro natives??:hmmm: Both the stamp and Dr. Amram's account both reflect an entire plane 'hanging on the far side of the ship" with the right wing broken: since the plane's generator for all the garbled 8 days of messages to Itasca and stations around the world: https://tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/Archives/Research/ResearchPapers/Brandenburg/signalcatalog5.html (https://tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/Archives/Research/ResearchPapers/Brandenburg/signalcatalog5.html) until July 10 is in the right wing !!! this creates post-crash radio plausibility problems. Here's where the plane really is!:D Since both the 1935 Jap photo and the Navy archive file purported secret 1937 and all the second hand native witness from Mili to Saipan are innately undesirable... including 1944 US gravedigging marines!:O: let's cut it down to 3 Australian soldiers, engine numbers and one reliable radio operator on Nauru Island!:yeah: https://earharttruth.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/billings-map.png https://earhartsearchpng.com/2016/01/16/earhart-lockheed-electra-search-project/ (https://earhartsearchpng.com/2016/01/16/earhart-lockheed-electra-search-project/) Of course I expect the bones and the Pratt & Whitney engines to disappear again...:doh: