How to find merchants or convoys?

[JuanLiquid]

Hi,

Maybe this is just bad luck, but in the last three patrols I've see only 1 merchant and 2-3 destroyers in 1942. The BdU do not send me any contact radio, or the ones (convoys) they send me are too away from me. I'm diving each 45-60m to perform an hydrophone read, and I still do not find nothing.

How do you do it? Before, when I was able to see radio reports in the map drawed, I had more success. Now, the TC goes down to 8, but since I do not see they on the map and they do not send me the radio message, I never find a ship. I'm playing 100% realism with this mod list:

Generic Mod Enabler - v2.6.0.157
[C:\sh3\MODS]

Rubini´s Underwater dust&plancton v1
Sh3_volumetric_clouds&fog_V2.2
OLC's Modified Searchlight Beams for GWX3
Das Realistic Food
darksmoke
Wooden_Lifeboats_Mod_1.1
Enhanced Damage Effects
Realistic contacts with Sub icons
Damage_caused_by_fires_TheDarkWraith_v1_1
TheDarkWraith_Ejecting_Pilot(s)_v2_0_SH3
Dolphins
Late war SNK_RWR_for all_v2
Rapt0r's Uniforms V2.0 [Grey]
SH3 sound Mod v1.2
No Medals On Crew [Patch]
Float_planes_mod
GWX_DFa-Flag&Pens_2010
DD_VisibleMines_V1.0
snorkel_fx_for all
Ultimate Aircraft Soundmod
Foam
depth charge explosions and fire light
SH3MoonMod
torpedo trail and wake fix
NationalityMod_v3.0
ThomsenParamApp
Ahnenerbe WideGui 1920 x 1080 Final
JuanNoUMark
Supplement to V16B1 Ahnenerbe
OLCE2
Optional O2-Gauges v2 (JSGME)
newScene
JuanNoFatigue
EnvSimAct_10
EnhancedMapDrawing

[Andy 01288]

Hi JuanLiquid,
Just thinking there might be a big clue when you say (Quote) "Now, the TC goes down to 8" (if I`ve understood you correctly). I think this normally means an enemy has clocked you. I reckon get off the F5 map and go to F4 view and ask your WO if he can see anything. Also, good advice given re: hydro checks often. I do them on the hour at standard cruising speed.

Good Luck,
Andy 01288

[JuanLiquid]

Thanks for the replies, however I quote myself here:

I'm diving each 45-60m to perform an hydrophone read, and I still do not find nothing.

I'm already doing that, but I still do not see any contact. I try to stay in the places where I think the convoys will come but the game do not spawn them for me.

Take a look to this video, the two first hours I'm just hydro-scanning. The next hour I'm trying to escape from a destroyer that surprised me:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBwpmoM2Ulw


In the next video, more of the same thing, the full hour I'm using the hydro searching for any target:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyyfJdsjSdA&t=36s

[Niume]

Juan whats your pc specs? and are you running gWX?

[JuanLiquid]

No, I'm running vanilla with the mods I listed. GWX is too slow loading, and it crashes my system.

Windows 8.1 Home.
i7 3630QM 2.4GHz
6GB Ram
Nvidia Geforce 610M 2Gb- The graphic card sucks

I was doing another gameplay but it crashed when some planes revealed my position and the escorts from a convoy came to sink me. It crashed in the moment one acoustic torpedo hitted one of them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEOBN8ODlR4

[hauangua]

No, I'm running vanilla with the mods I listed. GWX is too slow loading, and it crashes my system.

Windows 8.1 Home.
i7 3630QM 2.4GHz
6GB Ram
Nvidia Geforce 610M 2Gb- The graphic card sucks

I was doing another gameplay but it crashed when some planes revealed my position and the escorts from a convoy came to sink me. It crashed in the moment one acoustic torpedo hitted one of them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEOBN8ODlR4

Hi
you using hsie patch... probably you checked :
" hydrophone fix"... with this fix

Hydrophone-Fix
Hydrophones useless when diesels are working:
• When snorkelling, you must stop diesels in order to use hydrophones. Otherwise
you'll hear nothing.
• No sound contact reports when diesels are working

I see by your video you use hydrophone with diesel working ...
impossible hear contact

[JuanLiquid]

I have the hydro fix enabled. But unless diesels are working at 40m, I think I don't using hydro with diesel :) and 90% of times I stop all engines.

[hauangua]

I have the hydro fix enabled. But unless diesels are working at 40m, I think I don't using hydro with diesel :) and 90% of times I stop all engines.

ehehehe.. :D
opssss. ... i meant to say better engine stop.....
excuse me mate
:salute:

[bstanko6]

hauangua is absolutely right. Even if you don't have a snorkel you should do an engine stop. The ambient noise in the hydrophone can cover up most faint engine sounds. Make sure you are using the convoy map too.

[BigWalleye]

JuanLiquid, I think I have found your problem. Here is the description for the mod "Realistic contacts for SH3" from the SubSIm downloads page:

This mod removes all the contact icons on the navmap (warships, merchants, convoys, task forces, aircrafts, submarines). For distant contact reports all you will have is the radio message with the Grid + speed + heading. For nearby contact reports it will be somewhat similar to real life RDF contacts: the time compression drop will indicate a "radio contact" but you will have no way to know where it comes from and where the ship is heading.

The aim is to simulate the "fuzzyness" of real life contact reports which couldn't be as accurate as in SH3 due to the means of navigations used by then. Most likely it will make you miss merchants and convoys interceptions. This will compensate for the high number of contact reports in SH3 and maybe result in more "historical" patrol results. This is not exactly the mod you refer to ("Realistic contacts with sub icons") and I couldn't locate that one. Buy I suspect they are basically the same mod, by Mikhayl. If so, the mod is doing just what it is supposed to do, and nothing is showing up on your map. This makes finding targets a lot harder, as you are experiencing. Try removing that mod and see if the contact appear on your map. If so, you will have to choose between more realism and more in-game action. Whichever you choose, remember: "If you're having fun, even if everyone else says you're doing it wrong, you're doing it right."

Good luck and good hunting!

UPDATE: I just checked. "Realistic contacts with sub icons" is the same mod (but with sub icons retained). It is distributed in the same 7Zip file as "Realistic contacts for SH3" and the same readme, quoted above, applies to both. So that's the reason for the missing map contacts. As they say, it's a feature. :-)

[hauangua]

SH3 sound Mod v1.2
this mod can cause hydrophone problems...other user talked of hydrophone problem

PS. just now read BigWalleye post
and i think best solution is
Follow the advice of BigWalleye

[JuanLiquid]

Hi, thanks for the reply. Yes I used that mod but I missread it description. I thought you will DO receive a radio message that there was a single lonely ship desesperately wanting a torpedo in AM41 with east direction but without showing it in the map.

Is there something like that? Is there something that tells you Luftwaffe spotted a merchant but it doesn't show it exactly in the map, just an aproximation?

[Kendras]

Hi,

Maybe this is just bad luck, but in the last three patrols I've see only 1 merchant and 2-3 destroyers in 1942. The BdU do not send me any contact radio, or the ones (convoys) they send me are too away from me. I'm diving each 45-60m to perform an hydrophone read, and I still do not find nothing.

How do you do it? Before, when I was able to see radio reports in the map drawed, I had more success. Now, the TC goes down to 8, but since I do not see they on the map and they do not send me the radio message, I never find a ship.

No such problems here :

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=230691

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=231127

:03:

[bstanko6]

Problems aside. There will be bad patrols. I am currently in the middle of operation Hartmut. The invasion of Norway. U boats were used as a screen against British warships. I have only crossed paths with destroyers and German steamers. Even the aces who were dispatched to hartmut had horrible luck. So yes you will have bad patrols. It happens to us all.

[Leoz]

JuanLiquid, I think I have found your problem. Here is the description for the mod "Realistic contacts for SH3" from the SubSIm downloads page:

This is not exactly the mod you refer to ("Realistic contacts with sub icons") and I couldn't locate that one. Buy I suspect they are basically the same mod, by Mikhayl. If so, the mod is doing just what it is supposed to do, and nothing is showing up on your map. This makes finding targets a lot harder, as you are experiencing. Try removing that mod and see if the contact appear on your map. If so, you will have to choose between more realism and more in-game action. Whichever you choose, remember: "If you're having fun, even if everyone else says you're doing it wrong, you're doing it right."

Good luck and good hunting!

UPDATE: I just checked. "Realistic contacts with sub icons" is the same mod (but with sub icons retained). It is distributed in the same 7Zip file as "Realistic contacts for SH3" and the same readme, quoted above, applies to both. So that's the reason for the missing map contacts. As they say, it's a feature. :-)

Learn something new everyday BW. Great post. I may try this out.

:Kaleun_Periskop:

:Kaleun_Cheers:

[Leoz]

Problems aside. There will be bad patrols. I am currently in the middle of operation Hartmut. The invasion of Norway. U boats were used as a screen against British warships. I have only crossed paths with destroyers and German steamers. Even the aces who were dispatched to hartmut had horrible luck. So yes you will have bad patrols. It happens to us all.

:Kaleun_Cheers:

[Leoz]

Problems aside. There will be bad patrols. I am currently in the middle of operation Hartmut. The invasion of Norway. U boats were used as a screen against British warships. I have only crossed paths with destroyers and German steamers. Even the aces who were dispatched to hartmut had horrible luck. So yes you will have bad patrols. It happens to us all.

Hi,

Maybe this is just bad luck, but in the last three patrols I've see only 1 merchant and 2-3 destroyers in 1942. The BdU do not send me any contact radio, or the ones (convoys) they send me are too away from me. I'm diving each 45-60m to perform an hydrophone read, and I still do not find nothing.

How do you do it? Before, when I was able to see radio reports in the map drawed, I had more success. Now, the TC goes down to 8, but since I do not see they on the map and they do not send me the radio message, I never find a ship. I'm playing 100% realism with this mod list:

Generic Mod Enabler - v2.6.0.157
[C:\sh3\MODS]

Rubini´s Underwater dust&plancton v1
Sh3_volumetric_clouds&fog_V2.2
OLC's Modified Searchlight Beams for GWX3
Das Realistic Food
darksmoke
Wooden_Lifeboats_Mod_1.1
Enhanced Damage Effects
Realistic contacts with Sub icons
Damage_caused_by_fires_TheDarkWraith_v1_1
TheDarkWraith_Ejecting_Pilot(s)_v2_0_SH3
Dolphins
Late war SNK_RWR_for all_v2
Rapt0r's Uniforms V2.0 [Grey]
SH3 sound Mod v1.2
No Medals On Crew [Patch]
Float_planes_mod
GWX_DFa-Flag&Pens_2010
DD_VisibleMines_V1.0
snorkel_fx_for all
Ultimate Aircraft Soundmod
Foam
depth charge explosions and fire light
SH3MoonMod
torpedo trail and wake fix
NationalityMod_v3.0
ThomsenParamApp
Ahnenerbe WideGui 1920 x 1080 Final
JuanNoUMark
Supplement to V16B1 Ahnenerbe
OLCE2
Optional O2-Gauges v2 (JSGME)
newScene
JuanNoFatigue
EnvSimAct_10
EnhancedMapDrawing

Great reading Juan.

Maybe this will be useful maybe it won't. I can't see it but do any of the mods above included the 16km environment? If not I highly suggest getting the 16km environment.

You will obviously see farther. I spend most of my time in years 39-42. I spend most of my time searching on the surface in known areas (BE for example-- use the shipping lane map as a guide).

I can search more area on the surface per day with a 16km environment than submerged at 2 knots. Pick whatever search environment you prefer. I go north and south in a sector (example: BE99) at anywhere between 6 and 10 knots. And I find things on the surface without reports.

A side note: I recommend if you run the 16km environment to also run SH5 water (comes with a 8km and 16km choice). The boat rides better in the waves too.

Hope this helps. :Kaleun_Cheers:

[JuanLiquid]

Good question Leoz. I'm not sure if OLCE2 includes a 16Km environment... how can I know it? It doesn't say nothing in its readme.


I think I see ships with moderate visibility far enough (skip the firsts minutes, I had the frame with wrong settings :/), 2:08:20 is a good example about how far I can see:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDOKTrCWVjM


Sh5 is cool, however it has three bad mistakes (i live in the atlantic). The normal version is perfect - except the underwater colour which is an irreal light blue, the same effect that if you would have an underwater camera light&filters. I tried to change it using Sil3ntEditor but I failed finding the colour. It's really annoying when you are using the periscope and it goes underwater.

The ultimate version has a very unrealistic sun (always red!) and a very unrealistc water colours (somewhat yellow'ish), also, as soon as you zoom out with the camera you can notice how the water repeats patterns. And the nights aren't as solid as OLCE2.

I'll try go later to BE99 when I play again. Thanks!

[BigWalleye]

Here is another consideration:

If you search in a barrier pattern (180 degree turns at each end) for 3-hour legs at 10kt cruising speed, with a 16km horizon you will cover roughly 2100 square km. At the center of each leg, a target traveling at 10 kts and moving perpendicular to your search will have a 2 in 3 chance of being in your search area. At the ends, this drops to 1 in 3.

Now consider the same search pattern, but every hour, you dive to 20m for a hydrophone search. Hydrophone detection range is about 30km. Now your search area is 4200 square km, almost double. The chance of a 10kt target being in your search area at the end of each leg is rises to 1 in 2, and in the middle, virtually 100%. (These numbers are all just for the mathematical case. RL, all probablilties would be reduced, but would all stay in the same relative order.) So a search with periodic hydrophone checks should be significantly more effective than a purely surface search. But, particularly in SH3, it is significantly more work, too.

If you search instead in a zigzag pattern, with 60-degree turns at each end, then you get much better coverage (about 100% at the ends) - but only when the target is moving in the same direction as your search. (This is sometimes called a retiring search.) For a target moving the other way, it's about the same as a straight pattern. So zigzagging is helpful, if you know which way the traffic is heading, or don't care.

IAC, adding hydrophone checks to your searches will significantly increase the likelihood of finding contacts. It is more work. If you are in a rich hunting ground, like the Bristol Channel, it may not be necessary. But if you are having a dry patrol, hydrophone checks may just produce some more action.

[Leoz]

Good question Leoz. I'm not sure if OLCE2 includes a 16Km environment... how can I know it? It doesn't say nothing in its readme.


I think I see ships with moderate visibility far enough (skip the firsts minutes, I had the frame with wrong settings :/), 2:08:20 is a good example about how far I can see:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDOKTrCWVjM


Sh5 is cool, however it has three bad mistakes (i live in the atlantic). The normal version is perfect - except the underwater colour which is an irreal light blue, the same effect that if you would have an underwater camera light&filters. I tried to change it using Sil3ntEditor but I failed finding the colour. It's really annoying when you are using the periscope and it goes underwater.

The ultimate version has a very unrealistic sun (always red!) and a very unrealistc water colours (somewhat yellow'ish), also, as soon as you zoom out with the camera you can notice how the water repeats patterns. And the nights aren't as solid as OLCE2.

I'll try go later to BE99 when I play again. Thanks!


Thanks Juan. My next PC build, I will probably use MEPv5 as my environment. Happy hunting.

[bluehedgehog]

I am currently in the middle of operation Hartmut.

How? All I get always are "patrol grid __ __" and that is all. How do you know it is a part of some operation?

Also, how to be more "in action" and often help in interesting operations?

[BigWalleye]

How? All I get always are "patrol grid __ __" and that is all. How do you know it is a part of some operation?

Also, how to be more "in action" and often help in interesting operations?

Try Sh3Gen. http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=4360

It provides a variety of mission assignments. Of course, it's an external add-on, so nothing is enforced or rewarded with renown gains or losses. You just carry out your orders. It also adds a good bit of intel, some of which is usually true.

[Leoz]

A sidenote. Just wanted to say thanks to Juan.

I am now running Realistic contacts for SH3 (retaining the sub contact icon) and absolutely LOVE the game experience. Has really made things more dramatic for sure.

Also put MEPs v5 on my current build, dropping SH5 water for SH3 (16k) which was an improvement over stock and MEPs v5 runs fine. My machine is lower performance than yours.

That 20k environment of MEPs v5 and setting up a search pattern in front of not all that exact contact reports has made for a lot of fun.

Regards,

:Kaleun_Cheers:

[JuanLiquid]

You are welcome :)

It changes radically your experience with SH3, from a shoot'n'put to a real simulator. I enjoy it a lot, when I fail to calculate where are they, when I have to think how is the convoy formation, or when I'm getting depth charged and I have to wonder their trayectory!

[Pisces]

Aside from the Realistic Contacts mod, the range for displayed radio contacts is rather low. Iirc 250km by default.

If you change the values in Silenthunter3\Data\Cfg\Contacts.cfg then you can increase the range around you where they can be shown. If something is actually there, and the randomizer-God is liking you.

[ContactSettings]
; Contact settings

Display Range To Opportunity Radio Contacts=750 ;[>0] kilometers
Display Range To Important Radio Contacts=750 ;[>0] kilometers

As BigWalleye wrote earlier. The hydrorange is only a little bigger than 30 km. So it is still a small circle in that big ocean. It helps to dive, but don't expect garunteed detections. And visual range halve of that if the 16km mod is used. Even if the TC drops with a stutter then in is only being loaded for rendering by the game. It might still be out of visual range. The hydrophone should be able to detect it if you listen yourself. But with your mods that may vary. (I am not familiar with most of them)

[Fanuboat]

Just go to the hot spot.... :)
You know.... :)

Halifax, Scapa flow, Gibraltar, Freetown, St Helena.... :)

Lot of target here.

[Drakken]

Early in the war, I also recommend patrolling near the Thames, Southeast of the Lowestoft area. Plenty of lone merchants and convoys leave from the London area as they turn for the Dover straits.

However, the depth there is a little shallow with a lot of neutral Belgian and Dutch vessels traveling there from and about England. However, this is perfect ground for an IIA or IID boat. Besides, even I lose Renown if a merchant ship is without lights in that area she is toast whether she is neutral or not, as per the unrestricted submarine warfare RoE from October 1939.

[Dave Kay]

Having read the OP's first post I believe he's asking for WHERE to run across ships & convoys. Is that correct?

As I've only skimmed the other posts and if it has not already been mentioned I strongly suggest studying the Convoy Route map and generally, just follow their lanes whichever direction you choose.

While I don't play 100% realistic it seems to me that realistically--- any Bdu radio reported ships or convoys would most definitely be PLOTTED on the u-boat charts by any good Telefunk-operator at sea. So I play with radio plots enabled.

When I first became immersed in SH3 in 2005, I had no idea how to find the enemy but after a bit of deduction it is rather obvious that where the mapped convoy routes converge your probability of making contact increases considerably.

Having said that, it is known that the SH3 convoys DO NOT always follow those map routes closely in fact, they may be several hundreds of nautical miles off the mapped course.

Learning how to intercept a radio-report convoy is another skill that takes time and patience to have success, but it will come. When trying to close with a convoy several hundred NM away--- THINK like the wolf and how he stalks his prey; their course, their distance away and the TIME involved to travel a distance where you may intercept their course. It's a hit & miss guessing game really but one where YOU have the speed advantage over the slow moving prey. Use it I say.

It's like that old saying about standing in front of the fan when the you-know-what hits. Same basic principle.

[JuanLiquid]

Well, anyway I solved my problem in the most realistic way possible: enabling radio contacts (but I didn't enable god eye view). Now it's more fun to play.

After all, when the uboots received a radio with a convoy or merchant contact, they at least would know where it should be, direction and speed. The nice thing would be that those details were imperfect, and subject to human fail.

If you use the convoy routes for the current period of time, it doesn't work as well as expected - and you shouldn't know it (at least in late war, 43-45, where I prefer to play).