If you are going to make up a conspiracy, go big

[Platapus]

Posted on one of the more nutter forums on the Internets Tubes.

I believe that Hillary Clinton will win the election in November. Then, sometime between November and January, Hillary will be indicted. The IRS is now investigating the Clinton Foundation and the whole e-mail thing isn’t over yet. Once under indictment, she won’t be able to assume the Office of the President in January. Tim Kaine, who will not actually be the Vice President because neither he nor Hillary have been inaugurated, cannot assume the Presidency. The Speaker of the House can’t move up to it because there is already a sitting President and Vice President.
So President Obama, in an Executive Order citing emergency situation, gives himself another four years in office is the only way possible.

Obama has been planning this for a while now, knowing he has enough on Hillary to indict her. Had the Attorney General indicted her based on evidence from the FBI this plan wouldn’t have worked because the DNC would have quickly come up with another candidate If you think about it, it’s not that outrageous. Many people on the left, including the President, want Obama to stay another four years. The law prohibits him from being re-elected so the only ways he can do it is by declaring martial law and suspending the election (which would be a very negative thing for the country) or to declare himself still President because the elected candidate cannot assume her duties. The latter makes more sense and is actually more feasible. And since it’s never been done before, it would set a precedent that would be difficult to challenge. Of course, if Trump wins the election none of this is going to happen. But what if this scenerio is correct? Four more years of Obama and a mostly useless Republican House and Senate would give Obama the time he needs to continue destroying the country (he's done a wonderful job so far) to fit his stated goals.

Civics Quiz. This poster is clearly ignorant about many aspects of our government. How many mistakes did this poster make and what are they? :know:

[u crank]

How many mistakes did this poster make and what are they? :know:

As a person who is not familiar with American laws, I don't know. I have though not seen any indication from President Obama would want to do this. The only people who are suggesting this are his enemies. Look at the guy. Does he look like he wants to keep that job? Pass the tinfoil.:O:

[vienna]

I've seen this one before on some other webpage; it is amazing how people who know nothing about the workings of US government seem to think any of this is at all plausible. There are two immediate horrifying thoughts that leap to mind: One, there actually are other people that the poster who will believe this tripe; and, Two, the poster, and those who believe him, probably are eligible to vote...




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[fireftr18]

I checked the appropriate sections in The Constitution. As far as I can tell, if Clintion is indicted after winning the election, and before inauguration, then the current Vice President will take office of the President until Congress authorizes a special election to fill the vacancy.

[razark]

Then, sometime between November and January, Hillary will be indicted.Error 1.

Once under indictment, she won’t be able to assume the Office of the President in January.Error 2.

Tim Kaine, who will not actually be the Vice President because neither he nor Hillary have been inauguratedError 3.

[Tim Kaine] cannot assume the Presidency.Error 4.

The Speaker of the House can’t move up to it because there is already a sitting President and Vice President. Error 5. (Did he forget that he's talking about what happens when Obama's term ends?)

So President Obama, in an Executive Order citing emergency situation, gives himself another four years in office...Error 6.

Obama has been planning this for a while nowError 7.

he has enough on Hillary to indict her.Error 8.

Had the Attorney General indicted her based on evidence from the FBI this plan wouldn’t have worked...Did we finally hit a true statement?

...because the DNC would have quickly come up with another candidateOops, I guess not. Error 9.

If you think about it, it’s not that outrageous.Error 10.

Many people on the left, including the President, want Obama to stay another four years.Error 11.

The law prohibits him from being re-elected so the only ways he can do it is by declaring martial law and suspending the election (which would be a very negative thing for the country) or to declare himself still President because the elected candidate cannot assume her duties.Error 12 and 13. Not only can he not do it, it's also not the only way for him to gain another term.

The latter makes more senseError 14.

and is actually more feasible.Error 15.

it would set a precedent that would be difficult to challenge.Error 16.

Four more years of Obama and a mostly useless Republican House and Senate would give Obama the time he needs to continue destroying the countryError 17.

destroying the country (he's done a wonderful job so far)Error 18.

destroying the country... his stated goals. Error 19.


How'd I do?

[Sailor Steve]

The General Election is November 8 this year. The Electoral College votes on December 19. If the President-Elect is disqualified between those dates the Electoral College votes again. They may vote for whomever they please, but the most likely scenario is that they will vote for whomever their Party recommends.

If the President-Elect is disqualified after the Electoral College votes, then the Vice-President-Elect becomes President-Elect.

Martial Law is limited. It would have to be enforced by the military, and America's military swear an oath to uphold the Constitution, not the President. He would have to get the Joint Chiefs of Staff on board, and that is very unlikely to happen.

Those are just a couple. I'm sure there are many more that I've missed.

[Cybermat47]

I bet that 20 years later, people will still think that Obama is planning to have a third term.

[vienna]

A variant of the conspiracy theory Platapus posted in OP was floated at the time Reagan was finishing his second term; oddly, there were believers form both wings: the left wingnuts viewed it as a power grab to start a fascist regime, and the right wingnuts were looking forward to the idea as a sort of The Gipper taking charge and cleaning house, restoring America. There was also a version during Nixon's last term, but the theory was he was going to pull a sort of bunker stand a la the last days of the Reich. No matter which theory, they all have one flaw: they tend to fall apart in the face of logistics, logic, reason, and simple common sense; all things lacking in the theorists...



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[Torplexed]

The impression I have of Obama (and of most lame duck Presidents) is that they are eagerly counting down the days on the calendar until the whole damn thing is over and done with. Not looking to add more to their sentence.

[AndyJWest]

I'm surprised they didn't bring Admiralty Law, gold-fringed flags and WRITING IN CAPITALS into it.

[Torplexed]

I'm surprised they didn't bring Admiralty Law, gold-fringed flags and WRITING IN CAPITALS into it.

And chemtrails. Lotza, lotza chemtrails crisscrossing overhead. :O:

[Wolferz]

Obama will grab his ho's and fly off to Hawaii on AF-1 just as soon as his term concludes. Kind of like Bush jr did.
The puppet masters have no more use for him and will install the puppet of their choice come January '17.
:yep:

[Platapus]

Obama will grab his ho's and fly off to Hawaii on AF-1 just as soon as his term concludes. Kind of like Bush jr did.
The puppet masters have no more use for him and will install the puppet of their choice come January '17.
:yep:

Technically it would not be Air Force 1, once his term is over. :D

I think that Nixon was one of the few times where the same aircraft in the same flight changed call signs from Air Force 1 to a civil designation. Turn over for the presidency is normally planed for 1200 east coast time. Nixon was in the air at 1200 that day.

[Platapus]

Here are my answers

Once under indictment, she won’t be able to assume the Office of the President in January.

An indictment would not make someone ineligible to assume the Presidency. If a select group could prevent someone duly elected president from being prevented by simply indicting them, you can see how this could be misused.

Do you know what we call people, in the US, who are indicted?

Presumed innocent until their guilt is proven, beyond a reasonable doubt, by a court of law.

Presidential immunity is a complicated topic. The CRS produced an excellent report on this.

Presidential Claims of Executive Privilege: History, Law, Practice, and Recent Developments by Todd Garvey Legislative Attorneyand Alissa M. Dolan Legislative AttorneyAugust 21, 2012

Generally speaking, while a president can be tried for crimes committed before they are sworn in as president, the Supreme Court has recognized the difficulty in conducting a trial during the presidents term. It is most likely that any trial would be postponed until after the president's final term is over.

Once in a presidential term, the only way a president can be removed is by the successful conviction of impeachment charges. But this would have to wait until after Clinton was sworn in as president. If duly elected, there is no legal way to keep Clinton from being sworn in as President.

Tim Kaine, who will not actually be the Vice President because neither he nor Hillary have been inaugurated, cannot assume the Presidency.

This question comes up a lot so the best answer I found is at https://www.archives.gov/federal-register/electoral-college/print_friendly.html?page=faq_content.html&title=U.%20S.%20Electoral%20College%3A%20Frequentl y%20Asked%20Questions#pefails2qualify

The following quotation is from the Archives.gov site and not the original post.


If a candidate dies or becomes incapacitated between the general election and the meeting of electors, under federal law, the electors pledged to the deceased candidate may vote for the candidate of their choice at the meeting of electors. Individual states may pass laws on the subject, but no federal law proscribes how electors must vote when a candidate dies or becomes incapacitated. In 1872, when Horace Greeley passed away between election day and the meeting of electors, the electors who were slated to vote for Greeley voted for various candidates, including Greeley. The votes cast for Greeley were not counted due to a House resolution passed regarding the matter. See the full Electoral College vote counts for President and Vice President in the 1872 election.
As to a candidate who dies or becomes incapacitated between the meeting of electors and the counting of electoral votes in Congress, the Constitution is silent on whether this candidate meets the definition of “President elect” or “Vice President elect.” If the candidate with a majority of the electoral votes is considered “President elect,” even before the counting of electoral votes in Congress, Section 3 of the 20th Amendment applies. Section 3 of the 20th Amendment states that the Vice President elect will become President if the President elect dies or becomes incapacitated.
If a winning Presidential candidate dies or becomes incapacitated between the counting of electoral votes in Congress and the inauguration, the Vice President elect will become President, according to Section 3 of the 20th Amendment (https://www.archives.gov/federal-register/electoral-college/provisions.html#20).

Back to quoting the original post



This is true, but not for the reasons the original poster stated. The 20th amendment (and resulting federal law) only permits the Speaker of the House to move up if the President and Vice President are incapable of holding their office at the same time. In this case, the fact that we would have a duly elected vice president elect would prevent the Speaker from moving up.


[quote] So President Obama, in an Executive Order citing emergency situation, gives himself another four years in office is the only way possible.

There is no federal law, constitutional article, or legal precedent that would allow a president to do this. One of the many good things about our governmental structure is that the US does not skip elections. Even in time of declared war, even civil war, the US held elections.

So it was not true when people were claiming that Bush would suspend elections and remain president, and it is not true now that some are claiming that Obama will suspend elections and remain president.

Unless there are significant changes of the Constitution/federal law, it won't be true in eight years when the same people will claim that Clinton or Trump will be suspending elections so they can stay president.

That is just not how our governmental system works.

[mapuc]

When I read following in your post

"The Speaker of the House can’t move up to it because there is already a sitting President and Vice President.

This is true, but not for the reasons the original poster stated. The 20th amendment (and resulting federal law) only permits the Speaker of the House to move up if the President and Vice President are incapable of holding their office at the same time. In this case, the fact that we would have a duly elected vice president elect would prevent the Speaker from moving up. "

I suddenly remember Alexander Haig toke command after Reagan was shot and he was Minister of Foreign Affairs when this happened.

Markus

[vienna]

A similar event occurred following the assassination of Abraham Lincoln. Vice-President Johnson was reputed to have been sleeping off a bender and was in no condition to assume control. Secretary Of War (the current title for the position is Secretary Of Defense) Edwin M. Stanton effectively took control of the government for some hours until Johnson could take control. Stanton's assumption of control was later questioned and debated, much like Haig's attempt, as being outside of the framework of the Constitution; the rationale given by Stanton and his defenders was the imposition of martial law on the Capitol at the time, a lingering by-product of the Civil war years previously...



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[Platapus]

Here is a nice explanation of the Al Haig I am in control event.

http://adst.org/2014/03/al-haig-and-the-reagan-assassination-attempt-im-in-charge-here/

Basically, Al Haig did the right thing but said it the wrong way.

[August]

So it was not true when people were claiming that Bush would suspend elections and remain president, and it is not true now that some are claiming that Obama will suspend elections and remain president.


I wonder how many of them have claimed both. :hmmm:

[fireftr18]

I wonder how many of them have claimed both. :hmmm:
Probably all of them. :haha:

[mapuc]

Here's something that's 150 % sure

As long there is a Presidential title in USA there will always be conspiracies about this person and/or his government

Markus

[Platapus]

Ok, the last one was a bit lame as it was just some guy on the Internets Tubes. But this is the real deal. This is not just some guy in the Internets Tubes ranting, this is from a real website. They have a .com so you know it is legit. :up:

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/08/mass-lesbian-farm-infiltration-is-obamas-best-scheme-yet.html

By Jonathan Chait


Barack Obama is nearing the finish line of a presidency filled with accomplishments ranging from death panels to FEMA camps to the importation of Sharia Law.



Year eight is a natural time for Obama to unveil the most deviously brilliant plot of them all: mass lesbian infiltration of the agriculture sector. The Department of Agriculture has cleverly designed this scheme as an innocuous outreach summit to LGBT Americans living in rural areas. But Rush Limbaugh has exposed the administration’s true intentions, which are nothing less than a full-scale assault on the last bastion of red-state America.


Here’s how it works. [Limbaugh quote:] “Rural America happens to be largely conservative. Rural America is made up of self-reliant, rugged individualist types,” explains Limbaugh. [Chait comment: Farmers are “self-reliant” because, even though their sector is technically the recipient of heavy federal subsidies, they are overwhelmingly white.] Obama has a plan to attack them:
They are trying to bust up one of the last geographically conservative regions in the country; that’s rural America … So here comes the Obama Regime with a bunch of federal money and they’re waving it around, and all you gotta do to get it is be a lesbian and want to be a farmer and they’ll set you up … apparently enough money it make it happen, and the objective here is to attack rural states. I mean, it’s pretty obvious that once Obama locks up the farmers in FEMA camps, he’s going to need to repopulate the farms with political loyalists, or else the cities will have food shortages. That’s where the lesbians come in. By the time Hillary Clinton is running for her fourth term, red America will have been completely liquidated, and she won’t even need Acorn to steal the election for her.


There you go folks. They can't put anything on the Internets Tubes that is not true. :nope:


Mass Infiltration of Lesbians on Farms.......MILF. :D

[Von Due]

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.asylum.com/media/2009/06/headache_vintage_getty_72353812.jpg

http://p.fod4.com/p/media/5c597eb60b/c=sq/s=w700/o=90/fh6r9t9SU2MvczG1Mrxc_Confused%20Ice%20Cube%20THUMB .jpg

Next: Obama filled the hollow earth! Obama was in my room and stole my medication!

[fireftr18]

I think maybe someone stole Jonathan Chait's medication. :woot:

Vapor trails may have something to do with it.

[Betonov]

Subsidies for lesbian farmers :rotfl2:

I am astounded by the thought process that led to this :haha:

[Catfish]

And i thought it was »The Onion« :doh:

Betonov is right, statements often reveal a lot about who thought it out, and his "way of thinking" :rotfl2:

[Von Due]

For the sake of what's left of my sanity, I choose to believe that is a piece of satire on the background of
http://mynewsla.com/hollywood/2016/08/24/lesbian-farmer-horror-for-rush-limbaugh-turns-hilarious/
http://www.snopes.com/limbaugh-obama-sending-lesbian-farmers/

Looking up what else this writer has written, he does come across as more mentally stable. Right or wrong, at least there wasn't much incoherent rambling in
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/07/obamas-success-only-beginning-to-come-into-view.html

[HunterICX]

http://i.imgur.com/ndlnTwO.jpg

Aliens excist, they must've abducted him and made him believe something crazy as this is real.

[Catfish]

"I hope Rush Limbaugh is right. Federally paid lesbian farmers invading my town sounds like a dream come true.
The Goddamn Batwoman (@batwoman_nyc) "


:rotfl2::rotfl2::rotfl2:

[Von Due]

Take me back to the ol' open prairie
where the tractor dykes will plow until they're hairy.
Where we toil the dirt and grit
Where Limbaugh will throw a fit
But we all know that ol' Limbaugh is a fairy.

[Torplexed]

Rural America is made up of self-reliant, rugged individualist typesAnd a certain percentage of them have always been gay. But, I suppose in Rush's idealized agricultural world of Green Acres reruns that can't possibly be.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_s347VH8X1UY/S_eDdNDyoBI/AAAAAAAAAyM/BPF6uOBeBgU/s1600/this-american-gothic.jpg

[Oberon]

America....we need to talk...

http://24.media.tumblr.com/380ed81504c51fb2e1aeab79e0f146be/tumblr_n0745x84pQ1toet33o2_250.gif

[Osmium Steele]

Anyone who listens to Limbaugh knows that he loves to "demonstrate absurdity by being absurd".

I was listening when he did this bit and thought it was brilliant.

His whole point was simply why? Why provide subsidies for lesbians specifically? What possible motivation could the Dept. of Agriculture have for outreach to the gay community? Reach out to farmers no matter their orientation. that is their job!

And he let his mind run with it to the point of absurdity.

The media loves to deliberately misunderstand Limbaugh when he does this.

[Betonov]

I saw a recent picture of Obama and he's more likely to hang himself because he has no more will to survive the office until January, than force another term.

[Catfish]

Frankly, i do not know what the fuss about a prolonged.. presidentship is about? No former president has ever tried to - by force or whatever - remain in office longer than the law permitted.

Apart from Fema death camps, chemtrails to control minds or poison the people, or turn the US into a Muslim country, who really thinks that those ideas really exist, or that Obama really wants to remain president?

Presidents in the last year have forever been called lame ducks, because there is no political future as a president available for them after those three terms, and they certainly know that. Exception may be a national state of emergency, but who thinks that Obama.. ?? Come on! :doh:

[Platapus]

I don't think there has been anyone since FDR that wanted to be president for more then 2 terms. It has become a pretty crappy job in my opinion.

I wonder if when a president first finds out that he has been re-elected if secretly there is a moment when he thinks to himself "crap, another four years of this". :yep:

[Platapus]

A
The media loves to deliberately misunderstand Limbaugh when he does this.

Having listened to his program over the years, no. There is no misunderstanding on anyone's part but Limbaugh's.

He was tolerable back when he was a radio comedian. But in the past 20 years.. .yikes.

Here is a man with no education in public policy/political science, no experience in public policy/political science but for some reason people think he is an authority on public policy? :doh::doh:

Weird.

[vienna]

I don't think there has been anyone since FDR that wanted to be president for more then 2 terms. It has become a pretty crappy job in my opinion.

I wonder if when a president first finds out that he has been re-elected if secretly there is a moment when he thinks to himself "crap, another four years of this". :yep:

Looking back at the other two-term Presidents, after Nixon, the idea of what a "lame duck" President actually does is interesting; some seem to be concerned with their "legacy", trying to accomplish or enact something to either make some, any , impact on history or, in some cases, to overshadow the ineptitude and failures of their first term. Some seem to just coast along and appear to have the attitude of "let the next one deal with it all", and just try not to screw-up their remaining term or the hopes of their party to retain occupancy of the Oval Office...

Having listened to his program over the years, no. There is no misunderstanding on anyone's part but Limbaugh's.

He was tolerable back when he was a radio comedian. But in the past 20 years.. .yikes.

Here is a man with no education in public policy/political science, no experience in public policy/political science but for some reason people think he is an authority on public policy? :doh::doh:

Weird.

This is the one part of a lot of the political radio pundits influence I really don't understand: how can any rational, thinking, person put any serious weight in the observations and opinions of persons who have no real background or education in political matters and who exhibit no more ability than to spout off banal platitudes, slogans, and absurdities with little or no substance. Worse yet is how many people, including those in the more serious media and the political realm, give credence or legitimization to the rambling of those who, in another time, would just be little more than akin to the loudmouth drunks at the end of the bar crabbing about fighting city hall and what's wrong with the country. This criticism applies to all of those idiots on both sides of the political spectrum; there are enough of the nattering fools to cover all the possible areas of the spectrum...




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[August]

"I hope Rush Limbaugh is right. Federally paid lesbian farmers invading my town sounds like a dream come true.
The Goddamn Batwoman (@batwoman_nyc) "


How many lesbian farmer invaders would it take for the average New Yorker to even notice? :hmmm:

[Buddahaid]

All these weird outlandish fears coming out of the heartland are starting to make me believe in chemtrails. I mean there must be some reason people believe this rot!? :doh:

[Platapus]

This is the one part of a lot of the political radio pundits influence I really don't understand: how can any rational, thinking, person put any serious weight in the observations and opinions of persons who have no real background or education in political matters and who exhibit no more ability than to spout off banal platitudes, slogans, and absurdities with little or no substance. Worse yet is how many people, including those in the more serious media and the political realm, give credence or legitimization to the rambling of those who, in another time, would just be little more than akin to the loudmouth drunks at the end of the bar crabbing about fighting city hall and what's wrong with the country. This criticism applies to all of those idiots on both sides of the political spectrum; there are enough of the nattering fools to cover all the possible areas of the spectrum...




<O>

I think it is a matter of confirmation bias

Rush Limbaugh's opinion agrees with my opinion so therefore Limbaugh is a smart guy.

it is human nature to consider one's own opinion to be right.

It takes a high level of critical thinking discipline to accept that a personal opinion may be wrong.

In one of my political analysis courses, we were given a very tough assignment. We had to identify an opinion that we personally held that was wrong.

That was quite the soul-searching thought experiment. Several of the students couldn't do it. It was a toughie. :yep:

[vienna]

The only training of that type I experienced was in the form of competitive tournament debating. I had started competing in public speaking tournaments (extemporaneous and impromptu speech) starting in grade school and later got into debate. The format, back then was to establish a topic for the individual tournaments and then have the teams or individuals argue pro or con. The one big trick of it was the debaters had to alternate with presenting the pro or con view. We had to be able to try and convincingly argue either side of the topic armed with facts and cites supporting our argument(s). This is probably the reason why, even today, I don't really feel comfortable just accepting anything at face value without substantiation. The experience does instill a healthy skepticism and the need for proof, However, the need to be able to see both sides of an issue can sometimes lead to waffling or equivocation if presented with an issue have strong arguments from either side. In those cases, it is sometimes a "coin flip"...



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