I am getting SO frustrated!

[She-Wolf]

I came back to SH3 a while back, and decided to try NYGM with manual targetting. I am on my first patrol, and finally I have found a lone steamer to nobble. The data collecting for manual targetting is a bit diff from SH4 of course, but I figured I could work it out easy enough - just follow the instructions, right? Wrong..

Apart from the first 'sitting duck' in training, which is close and stationary until the last moment, ALL my torpedoes pass to the rear of the boat I am aiming at.

I have looked on the tutorials, but some of those use 'pen and paper' tools to collect the data, and I have no pen to mark crosses with in NYGM - it doesn't show the target in normal map view - it does in attack view, but there is no pen to mark anything. All I have is the 'notepad' top right of screen on which you collect data by ID, Range, AOB and Speed, validating as you go, and I have followed the tutorial in doing that.

What have I forgotten? What am I doing wrong? Maybe I am just getting too old to play this game anymore.

Fed up and Frustrated :nope:

[Von Due]

I am not familiar with NYGM and I don't know which tutorials you have looked at but with that in mind:

Does your navigation map come with plotting tools? It is a bit unclear from what you wrote. I understand there are no ship icons on the nav map but if you have plotting tools there then there are ways to do the plot.

Draw a line representing the boat's course. Either match the direction with the true heading which will save you time later, or have this line go straight north-south which will take some more calculations later. The line can be drawn anywhere.

Mark the boat's position on this line. This will not necessarily be the true position but it will, hopefully, be true relative to the target, eventually.

Use the scope to get bearing and if possible, range and speed as well.

Use the protractor to draw bearing lines from the marked position. If you have the distance, mark the distance on these bearing lines.

Repeat till you have the target's course, speed and position, relative to your marked position (again, not necessarily your true position)

You should now have the angles and distances you need to navigate the boat and the target bearing you need to hit. Don't focus on where on the map you drew the plot, just note angles, headings, courses, distances etc. Those are the ones you need.

(if you have one laying around, you could even use a whiteboard with whiteboard marker pens, ruler, compass and all the usual plotting tools and really get down to some semi-realistic plotting, and base all lines and measurements on what the scope tells you)

[She-Wolf]

the Attack map has no pen to mark the target with, the Navigation map has the tools menu but no target is shown to mark - and in the tutorial, such as you read when you go to Naval Academy, there is no mention there of marking on maps such as you describe and as I would mark in SH4, it is all to do with collecting data via the 'notepad' option top right in periscope screen and using the icons for ID, Range, AOB and Speed to get the data and validate it - same as in GWX.

[Von Due]

Unfortunately, the Naval Academy in SH3 is only good for one thing. For the player to marvel the graphics. That's it. It doesn't really teach you the things you need to know.

Best way, in my opinion is to start a test career that you're not going to take too seriously, to learn a few different methods to use in a real career.

There are methods where no plotting is necessary but where you will need a decent quality calculator, especially one with trigonometric functions, and the periscope to do bearing readings.

I have 3 methods bookmarked. They do take a bit of studying and a basic grasp on trigonometry and algebra but they are solid.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=200846
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=225129 (two methods here, videos on youtube)

If you do want to plot though, you can do so on the nav map even when there are no ship icons. You will need to be more accurate than you would allow yourself to be with the icons there, and you will get less accurate results due to inaccuracies in reading the boat's scope marks etc, but keep the range down when fireing and you should have a fairly good chance of success, if the weather and lighting conditions aren't playing against you.

Again, you don't even need to know where your boat is exactly on the map to do a reasonably accurate plot. You just need to switch from thinking true position, true distance, true anything, to relative position, relative distance, relative anything. This way you can make the plot right across Siberia when you really are off the coast of Ireland.

[She-Wolf]

I will look at these Von Due - and thank you - but, probably, they are not going to be simple enough for an old brain and poor eyesight, particularly when I only have the red light to work by. The tutorials ought to work, that is their purpose - why give us guidance that does not match the actions of the game? My grump is not assuaged!
ps have bookmarked the vid on constant bearing to target, looks helpful, thanks.

[THEBERBSTER]

Hi SW
Why not give this a try?
Highly Recommended > LIVING SILENT HUNTER III EDITION 2015 Mega Mod (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=220285)
Full set of tutorials in my signature.
Peter
https://s31.postimg.org/6ruggrhdn/lsh3_support_download_banner.gif

[Aktungbby]

Maybe I am just getting too old to play this game anymore.... they are not going to be simple enough for an old brain and poor eyesight, particularly when I only have the red light to work by. My grump is not assuaged! . Kindly avoid references to old...I'm getting 'post traumatic dotage syndrome' :O: references to the red light district are always welcome however to assuage my grump...as long as a defibrillator is standing by! :arrgh!: :Kaleun_Party:http://i.imgur.com/RPO9gwd.jpg:k_rofl:

[Von Due]

Again, unfortunately, you have all the right reasons to be grumpy at the nonsensial tutorials in SH3. It's nothing special to SH3 in particular. All too many games take tutorials extremely lightly.

[She-Wolf]

Von Due, thank you - am just going into GWX, which I have on the old computer, to see if that differs.. maybe I never used to play it with manual targeting before - that would explain why I am having these difficulties now :)

Aktung! nothing 'divine' about me ol fella (!) - but lurv the cartoon! :haha:

oohh! Berbster.. that looks tempting... I think I might be about to cheer up!:)

[bstanko6]

She-wolf I play only NYGM. If you are playing completely 100% realism, you will not get a ship icon on the nav or attack maps. You will have to use your periscope or UZO markings religiously to find the range, and distance, and then project that info on to the nav map.

The best method is the 3-bearing method. It gives your target's direction, and speed.

Correct the attack map is virtually useless in NYGM the higher the realsim. It is meant to make you plot more on the nav map. Hope that helps.

[She-Wolf]

thank you bstanko6, that is helpful. I am not on 100% realism, about 63%, but maybe that is enough. At least it explains it, so I do feel a bit better - I can comfort myself that it wasn't me being stoopid!

[bstanko6]

I teach manual targeting in the Doenitz Elite Flotilla. If you need any advice about how to manually target a ship, let me know. Also, I strictly play NYGM. so just ask any questions about it.

[She-Wolf]

thank you, will remember that :)

[Leoz]

I don't know if this is helpful but one of the additional things I did the other day to gather an approximate speed of a target on a night surface attack was to:

1. Stay out of sight.
2. Try and run parallel to the target ship. Lock it up on the Uzo and match it to a ship's ID in the recognition manual.
3. Move my own speed up or down until the target ship didn't move much in the Uzo looking right at 90 degrees relative or looking left at 270 degrees relative.
4. After some minutes of stabilizing this, I would then go to the torpedo management page and put in the speed that I thought it was: example 6 knots.
5. Then I tell the watch officer to call of ranges, I put that manually into the torpedo management page as well as a visual of what I think the angle of the bow is.
6. It isn't perfect. Then again it will give better results than some of the things you read about on Uboat.net where the U-boat follows a ship for hours, missed it with the first shot. Some minutes or hours...missed it with the second, shot, hit it with the third shot. After the ship stopped and didn't sink all that well, fire another shot (torpedo fails). Sink it with another shot. And it being smallish tonnage. :o

[bstanko6]

I actually use this method in convoy attacks. I do it because it keeps me moving away from the escorts.

[Leoz]

Found this just the other day.

http://webpages.charter.net/sawdust/sh3/sh3.html

Hey, everything in SHIII is still new to me :)

Used it to bag a large tanker from a large convoy in a daylight periscope attack in high seas and medium visability. (Oct 1940, IXb) from about 1500 meters.

Forced down earlier in the day after finding the convoy. Caught up some hours later. Approached from the right-front corner of the convoy; and, got lucky with the position. Submerged ahead.

First pericope observation after finding out what I wanted (and was able to do) was to pick the target, a large tanker, which was in a good position 330 degrees relative at about 80AOBs.

Guestimated about a 6 knot speed. I have 100 percent realism on which means the seas make your periscope visuals bob with the boat.

Guestimated the number of vertical hash marks to the top of the mast. Down scope and prepared the numbers on the torpedo management page based on a print out of the charts from that website.

Worked well (for me anyway) in that it was a higher stress situation; the lead escort was about 45 degrees relative to me @2500 meters.

This also kept my periscope exposure lower.

Up scope, lock up and fire a spread of torpedos.

Gave me credit for the sinking when I was submerged and getting away...

All very interesting.