Government has made America inept.

[August]

This is a very interesting and I feel illuminating article from The Daily Beast.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/05/04/government-has-made-america-inept.html

While government is often portrayed as some evil entity bent upon domination it's travesties and it's failures are nearly always the result of blind obedience and enforcement of regulations. "Mindless bureaucracy" .

At this point, American democracy is basically run by dead people—by past generations of legislators and regulators who wrote the laws and regulations that dictate today’s public policy, allocate most of annual budgets, and micromanage public choices. It’s not surprising that Washington works so badly. Imagine if you had to run a business by following every idea that any former manager ever had.

[Skybird]

“You may be expelled for homicide.”

:06:

We will most probably not bang our heads at least over this thread, August. :shucks: With only some minor rewriting, the article could be used to describe realities over here as well.

These symptoms will become much worse, and at increasing pace. That is the nature of bureaucratic systems: they must expand, else they collapse - and with them those precious power structures.

[Sailor Steve]

Great article! Now I need to read all three of his books. :sunny:

[TarJak]

I believe that it's much the same wherever you find bureaucracy. Yes Minister and Yes Prime Minister are great satires of the effect of years of behaviour driven by the decisions of the past.

[August]

To those who believe there is some shadowy group of elites secretly pulling strings behind the scenes:

There’s a tendency to attribute ulterior purpose to the failures of government. Sleazy deals are certainly easy to find. But pay a visit to the innards of the giant machine, and mainly what you find is not calculating people trying to get something for someone, but a comedy of rules without reason

[Oberon]

http://i.imgur.com/W45eL.jpg

[u crank]

Law has crowded out the ability to be practical or fair. Mindless rigidity has descended upon the land, from the school house to the White House to, sometimes, your house. Nothing much works, because no one is free to make things work.

I have seen an increasing tendency for this kind of thing my whole life. It's maddening, like pushing water uphill. It is not just an American problem. I wonder, have we painted ourselves into a corner?

[Sailor Steve]

...
:rotfl2: :rock:

[Rhodes]

Covering up aliens conspiracies are easy. Ruling on the other hand...

[Wolferz]

Nothing like being stuck between a rock and a hard head place.:hmmm::-?

[Skybird]

To those who believe there is some shadowy group of elites secretly pulling strings behind the scenes:

Yes, that quote is right also, it aims at what I try to summarise as the "self-dynamic of the system".

But abuse by intended decisions also are a reality, at the top levels of hierarchies. That can be the top of the complete system-pyramid, or the top level within one sub-levelled branch of the hierarchy.

[Jimbuna]

http://i.imgur.com/W45eL.jpg

Post of the month thus far :)

[Betonov]

That's because you don't have the most democratic government in the world :O:
We have elections EVERY year now :/\\!!

[Catfish]

That's because you don't have the most democratic government in the world :O:
We have elections EVERY year now :/\\!!

That is what already Mao said, when asked for democracy.
"I have elections evely molning"


Nice article! Thanks.

[Jimbuna]

That is what already Mao said, when asked for democracy.
"I have elections evely molning"



LOL :)

[Armistead]

This is a very interesting and I feel illuminating article from The Daily Beast.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/05/04/government-has-made-america-inept.html

While government is often portrayed as some evil entity bent upon domination it's travesties and it's failures are nearly always the result of blind obedience and enforcement of regulations. "Mindless bureaucracy" .

This is why there's no accountability. We all know government is full of crooks and people doing bad deals, but they've created a system so complex, it's nearly impossible to hold someone accountable. Yes, we often get facts, but we never get enough hard evidence to put someone in jail, except the chosen scapegoat. Yes, once in a blue moon someone gets caught and is fed to the fishes while all his corrupt friends run..

[Wolferz]

I have seen an increasing tendency for this kind of thing my whole life. It's maddening, like pushing water uphill. It is not just an American problem. I wonder, have we painted ourselves into a corner?

The rank and file aren't holding the paint brush. But we keep voting more lawyers into office to continue the same old ignorance and apathy.:yep::-? :roll:

I have to say that it isn't government making America inept,it's government making the government inept.

[Oberon]

https://31.media.tumblr.com/033dc7d9dc8c873c35515c440f58ccff/tumblr_n53c5tqnHR1qc8jh0o9_500.gif

[Platapus]

What's it like working in the government?

Having spend my adult life (35 years and counting) either as a government employee or supporting the government, I can honestly say that the government is populated with people just like us. We are a cross-section of the nation.

We have the smart, the average, and the dumb. We have the energetic, the average, and the lazy. We have the dedicated, the average, and the leeches. Just like any other large organization.

The government is made up of many many people who want to do a good job, but are often shackled under multiple layers of often conflicting laws, regulations, policy, and tradition. I have never met anyone working in the government who did not want the bureaucracy to go away.

Are government employees perfect? Not by a long shot. We reflect our nation's population right down the line.

"Just let me do my job" is a common complaint of many many government workers.

It is interesting and a little depressing to talk to people who have worked their way up to senior positions. They were all expecting to finally be in a position where they could make a change. Cut the bureaucracy, streamline things, get the right people and give them the right authority... cut the crap and get the job done.

All of them, that I have talked to, have been disappointed. In the government, there is always someone (or a group of someones) above you and always restrictive and often conflicting rules and regulations.

The government employees don't like and don't want all these regulations. Every single one was imposed by either executive or legislative authority. Most of the rules were implemented for very good intentions. Unfortunately, it is hard to remove an obsolete rule so the easy way is to just make another rule and now we have two conflicting rules on the books. Multiply this by a few thousand and you are starting to understand how the government works. And if we make a mistake, obsolete or not, we will be held accountable for every conflicting regulation. That's one of the charming aspects of the job. :shifty:

There is no evilness in the government. Everyone's agenda is based on what they feel is the best solution. Sometimes they are right, somethings they are wrong. In the government, it is common to serve multiple masters many of which don't agree but we are expected to continue doing our job the best we can.

That's what it is like working in or with the government -- trying to do the best you can in a hostile environment. Sometimes we succeed, sometimes we fail. But we keep trying. In many cases our successes are unknown (news media does not make money reporting on government successes) and our failures are often publicized either by the media for revenue or by politicians for political reasons. Either really cares about the actual problem, only how they can use the outcome for their purposes.

It ain't glamorous, the pay is seldom that good (if I were to go back into the government, I would have to take a $30-50K pay cut), the golden benefits are becoming a thing of the past. But people still line up for that work. I am considering going back. People ask me why....

Working for the government is not as showy as being in the military. Almost everyone these days shows respect and appreciation for the military these days (was not always that way) . But most of the people working for the government are serving their country too. There are not medals, no parades, little recognition, appreciation, nor understanding from the citizens they serve.

But they still show up every day, and still go home frustrated.

Just a cross section of our country trying to do their job in a hostile uncooperative environment.

Yeah, I laugh at the government jokes, and even tell a few myself. But in a quiet way, I am as equally proud of my government service as I am of my military service.


The take away is that the government is not some face-less soul-less remote entity. It is people like us... people like me. Your next door neighbour and a bunch of people you will never know.

To paraphrase John Updyke: Being a government employee "is to act as advocate for a blind, venomous, and ungrateful client; still, one must make the best of the case...."


Just on observation from an old guy. :yep:

[August]

Yes, that quote is right also, it aims at what I try to summarise as the "self-dynamic of the system".

But abuse by intended decisions also are a reality, at the top levels of hierarchies. That can be the top of the complete system-pyramid, or the top level within one sub-levelled branch of the hierarchy.

Of course. Leaders are human too and affected by all the normal human vices and faults just like anyone else. But depending on the government type their ability to get away with it for long is fairly limited.

"You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time." - A. Lincoln

The key is transparency. The same cure for bureaucracy maybe.

[Wolferz]

Our government is always fighting some kind of war or wars. They currently include...
The war on poverty.
The war on drugs.
The war on terrorism.
The war on crime.
The war on obesity.
Et cetera ad nauseum.:hmmm:

Now if the government could only start fighting the right war/s...
The war on government waste.
The war on government red tape.
The war on government stupidity.
The war on the military industrial complex.
The war on selfish lobbyists.
The war on government snooping.
The war on war.

It's all absurd to the extreme and makes me want to go to DC and stand across from the capitol building and stare in an unapproving fashion.:stare:

[Mr Quatro]

Our government is always fighting some kind of war or wars. They currently include...
The war on poverty.
The war on drugs.
The war on terrorism.
The war on crime.
The war on obesity.
Et cetera ad nauseum.:hmmm:

Now if the government could only start fighting the right war/s...
The war on government waste.
The war on government red tape.
The war on government stupidity.
The war on the military industrial complex.
The war on selfish lobbyists.
The war on government snooping.
The war on war.



That's a cool list Wolferz, but is today's government any different than the one Will Rogers made fun of?

Maybe we need a modern day Will Rogers to make fun of the present day mistakes bringing them to light just using jokes SNL is nice, but Will Rogers had a following of the entire American public speaking for them so to speak.

As for the government keeping secrets I think the secret involving Cuba and Fidel Castro and the out and out murder of President Kennedy remains the best kept secret, but will come to light as soon as Fidel Castro dies.

The truth would probably have had the an outrage so loud from the general public that the truth had to stay a secret for all of these years. :yep:

Now as for UFO's and aliens ... do we even know all the names of all the illegal aliens that have entered this country in the last 60 years?

I don't think so :woot:

[Wolferz]

Now as for UFO's and aliens ... do we even know all the names of all the illegal aliens that have entered this country in the last 60 years?

I don't think so :woot:
Juan, Pablo, Jesus, Jose and Klaatu.
That should about cover it.:D

[August]

That's a cool list Wolferz, but is today's government any different than the one Will Rogers made fun of?

There are two key differences I think. The government has a lot more laws, rules and regulations and it is a lot better at enforcing them (when it wants to).

[Platapus]

It's all absurd to the extreme and makes me want to go to DC and stand across from the capitol building and stare in an unapproving fashion.:stare:

Instead of standing in front of a building, how about standing in front of a candidate's HQ that you support and help on the campaign. Then stand in line on election day and vote. :D

[Wolferz]

Instead of standing in front of a building, how about standing in front of a candidate's HQ that you support and help on the campaign. Then stand in line on election day and vote. :D

How would that help? Once that candidate gets sworn into the good old boys club, any thoughts of fixing anything go right out the window.:-? Especially after all the letter clubs dig up lots of dirt on the guy or gal. Then it's just a case of blackmail.

[August]

Sounds like a cop out to me... :)

[Wolferz]

Sounds like a cop out to me... :)

Cops are very much a part of the equation. You need a strong paramilitary force to enforce all the inane laws and regulations.:hmmm:

[Platapus]

How would that help? Once that candidate gets sworn into the good old boys club, any thoughts of fixing anything go right out the window.:-? Especially after all the letter clubs dig up lots of dirt on the guy or gal. Then it's just a case of blackmail.


If you truly believe there is no solution, why kvetch about it?

I still believe there is a solution and that solution must come from the citizens.

[August]

Cops are very much a part of the equation. You need a strong paramilitary force to enforce all the inane laws and regulations.:hmmm:

Well that's very true but I was referring to your assumption that every politician is automatically turned into a crook by just getting elected therefore it is pointless to try and help improve things. Are you sure that's not just a convenient excuse?

[August]

I still believe there is a solution and that solution must come from the citizens.

This ^